Ex wife am I doing it right or am I fool.

[1DAD2KIDS]

Fist of all some basic background to where I am today. My ex wife and former love of my life had an affair a left me and the kids for another man. She was always a difficult woman but I loved her all the same. When I was in the relationship I was blind to the abuse I was under. She would go off her head at me for the littlest thing, she would put me down, attack me sometimes and as well as the affair she had been lying to me about all sorts for years mainly to undermined my trust in my closest friends and family. Because of her lies I nearly lost some good friends. I was blind to all this because I trusted her 100%. She tore my world and kids worlds apart.

Anyway role on to the present. I live with the kids and she lives 100 miles away. We get on fine now and I get no abuse from her (on the whole she is sound). I know the above paints her in a bad light but despite it all I don't think she is evil just a messed up person. I think I married a fraud, maybe she was trying hard to be someone deep down she wasn't. M best guess is some sort of personality disorder. The household is a lot calmer with her gone. The main problem is she is a compulsive liar. I really don't think she knows what the truth is anymore. Her life is a mess I know that. It didn't work out with the bum she left us for (the best way I can describe the bloke, he was no catch). I don't love her anymore (never thought I would say that) but it seems I have some sort of responsibility for her. She has totally fucked her life up and has nothing. Its is a bit of a pain that she lies all the time. She has just told me that she has had to have a few days off work because she has had a break down. That wouldn't surprise me as I often worry about her mental health and I think the enormity of the way she's fucked her life up is starting to kick in now she has no one to look after her. We had it all really. But the trouble is I never really know is this is the truth or a lie to work things to her advantage.

So it is working like this for us. We get on fine now. She is nice to me (not that she was always horrible we have lots of nice loving memories too). I help her out with stuff like her car. No point hating her. We sometimes do things together with the kids. We always spend Christmas together with the kids and we are going on our first little break away together with the kids soon for a couple of night (separate rooms). I think it could be very good for her as it will probably be the only holiday she gets this year. I have paid for the accommodation and will be driving us all up. I will probably have to pay for nearly everything as she say she always skint (that probably is the truth as she earns little working in a popular fast food place). I don't really mind as I am fairly comfortable and it would be the same if we were still married as she never brought in an income. I just hope we all have a nice time (that I am confident we will to be fair) and that it helps my ex wife to perk up a bit and feel a bit happier.

So my question really is am I mad (I know I am in general) to be so friendly with my ex, care about her wellbeing and still supporting her to some extent? Especially after the hurt and abuse she has caused me? Should I be making the excuses I do for her actions because I think she has problems or is she in reality just a dick?

Sorry about the useal heap of typos. Its normal for me but hope its readable. Plus the kids wanting their parents back together was response to Iamdobby63 not cary2012, got a little muddled

OP I don't think you can possibly do any more than you're doing. The fact that you still have a good relationship with her family speaks volumes, my family loathe my ex with a passion because of the way he left me and the kids without any thought to our wellbeing or finances.

Just make sure you set those boundaries, where you co parent as best you can whilst making her realise she's on her own, you can't 'carry' her emotionally. Of course you want your kids to have a strong stable mum, but with the best will in the world, you can't fix her. All you can do is be the best dad possible for them. And by the sounds of it, you already are.
I wish you well.

It's seems like you are very aware of all the pitfalls, that's a very good thing.

Perhaps come the new year you can put some of your plans in place, it's still relatively early days in relation to Christmas and holidays, my concern would be it becoming a habit and expectation for the children - then you meet Miss Wonderful and all changes. But I guess for it to become routine that would take a few years.

I can only say again that you're a remarkable man, with no bitterness for what she did.

It's in the children's interest to have a mother functioning properly. At least when your DD starts her periods and needs her first bra, her mum will be there.

I assume she is not paying any child support? . Did she ever after she flounced off with another man leaving them behind? If you are paying for her holiday, I guess not. I am still not clear why you are giving her money.

I know you may have kind intentions but these can be easily exploited - I think she is using you. You are probably bang-on about some kind of personality disorder. She lies, she cheats, she messes up her life and the lives of those around her.

I get this must be an incredibly difficult situation. However, I think you need to develop some very strong boundaries and you will need to be strong to protect yourself and your children. Sorry, but don't let her use or abuse you anymore.

If I was you, I'd probably do the same thing, if I was in a good position financially. I am also quite a forgiving person who tries to give people chances (although sometimes too much).

It sounds like you are a lovely bloke. Your efforts to provide/care for her will be having a really positive impact on your children's view of relationships and their mother. They will have learned a lot positive things from witnessing your behaviour. It would be so much worse and damaging if there was animosity between you.

It takes strong person to truely move on and forgive someone who has treated them so poorly. It says a lot about your character.

Make sure you have clear boundaries that you don't want her to cross. Decide what you are happy with and what you would not find acceptable. Make sure she does not take advantage of you or lean on you too much, because it will not be healthy for either of you. She does need to learn to stand on her own two feet. So long as what you do for her is given with no expectations and not resented, and does not impinge on her ability to sort her own life out, then I think it's all great.

Thanks for the support. It unchartered territory to me. Its like building a lego kit without instructions. Its starting to look like the right thing but of course I am going to make so mistakes. Just finding my way. I definitely need to have a good think about boundaries, what's ok with me, what is not. I am definitely not interested in her emotional problems, I have another of my own with hers. Also on a practical note a few house rules for the times she says at my house to see the kids.

Iamdobby63 the whole holiday thing with the children becoming an expectation is a worry because now know what the future holds but why should the kids miss out on in the here and now? Also I have no intention of meeting miss wonderful till the kids are adults. I have not the time nor would I want to do anything that affcts our family unit. My focus for now is very much my family not my love life.

SandyY2K luckily I have my brothers wife on standby for when DD is older and needs so female advice.

OrphidsintheSnow No she doesn't pay maintenance. I don't need it so I didn't want empty her pockets (of course I would be having it if times were harder). She was paying a bit of money in the kids savings accounts but that has dried up. Don't think it will get better short term as it looks like she maybe heading for long term sick. But of course I will expect her to start putting a little savings in again once her income picks up. Just to clarify I don't give her money bar this holiday really. To be fair I think te cost of a few extra meals and tickets will be wroth the money to enhance the kids holiday.

The children only miss out on the here and now if it meant that without you arranging and financing holidays they wouldn't see her.

Well I don't think you could possibly make anything any easier for her. Make sure you don't lose yourself whilst you are busy pleasing everyone else. You may not be actively looking for Miss Wonderful but she could just appear.

But your plan is still a good one, see how you feel when your divorce is finalised and review it all then.

My fear for you op is that she's faking the being nice right now, she has a lot to lose and everything to gain by keeping up a pretence.

I also suspect that should she get a whiff of you and a new woman, she will make your life hell again and that of the kids. You could do with a lot more boundaries, she's a grown up and your not helping her be self sufficient by still looking after her.

Sorry if that sounds harsh, but I don't buy into her sudden calmness and nicely nicely act, she's using you.

She does take advantage, I know. To be fair all things considering she has been let right off the hook.

Party because I put my self in her shoes and see how hard mess she has made is. I think of factors such as:

If I accept that she has personality issues to what extent is it anyone's fault she acted like this and to what extent is she just a dick? I just don't know where to place the blame? So I have to give her the benefit of the doubt to some extent as she may be a bit the victim of her personality.

Also I know that I would be heart broken without the kids (I feel so sorry about all those non resident parents who want to be with their kids every day). That why it is so important to me that she gets to see the kids and be a part in their life's without hindrance from me as much as she wants. Of course I can facilitate this but it is down to her what effort she makes. That's why I don't think its fair that any of us should miss out on the key events such as Christmas, we are both their parents.

But mainly what I am after is results. I have enough on my plate as it is. I don't need fighting and petty bitterness or to pay hand over fist for solicitors. I want the kids to see two parents who love them very much and who can work together to give them the best. And of course a mother who is stable and has her act together is good for the kids.

The above comes with cost and me being taken advantage of a little. But when I consider the other possibilities if I have had handled things differently this method works for me, just needs tweaking a little.

As to Miss Wonderful one I doubt she's out there, sorry still a little bit jaded towards long term relationships (of course reading this site doesn't help). Secondly she cant find me if I ain't looking, right?

To be fair she has on whole been very reasonable. Party I guess cause of the way I have treated her and party (I think) because she has got some genuine remorse. She knows that I have seen a could women since we been apart and never seems bothered. The main thing is making sure the seas are calm until the divorce and financial issues are sorted. At the moment we are both agreed and I need that to go through without any issues. I hope she doesn't turn because she can be a right stubborn and vindictive cow if she wants to be. I have seen that side of her a few times with people, literally she would cut her nose off to spite her face if she has the hump. At least once the legal matters are concluded I will be in a lot stronger position should things turn sour. Hence my rush sort out the divorce, she was bothered about getting one. Just waiting on some paper work. Hopefully done by Christmas. I as always look for the best but keep a plan B (don't worry I have a plan B should we ever have to play hard ball). I like to be a few moves ahead (the chess player in me I guess).

Overall I need to define some boundaries, I know that. I think once the legal stuff is sorted and she has her money that would be a good point to say time to stand on your own two feet. She will be in a nice position to start again (since her relationship with him fell through) and sort her life out. Hopefully she will and we can continue to get along and provide the best we can for the kids happiness. And don't worry I am human, sometime I am angry, very angry at what she has done but luckily I know for best results let positively trump anger ever time. Having said that I do genuinely hope she sorts her life out and finds happiness. Sadly I have this feeling she is one of these people who just cant find happiness. But as has been clearly pointed out that is her problem.

Again, you are making excuses for her.

She has not been diagnosed with a personality disorder. She behaves like a twat because no one has ever pulled her up on it. Or if they have, they've soon backed down and let her get on with it because it's easier.
We all have issues we have to deal with, but that doesn't give any of us the right to sponge off other people and expect them to bankroll us.

I commend you on the rest of it though. You're obviously working very hard to make this as easy as possible for your children.

I do make excesses to much. The kids have been away for the weekend. There grandparents picked them, not my ex. Now she wants me to meet her at 10am half way to pick them up? Now to day apart from a run I have done noting but chill, absolutely nothing. Not even any of the housework or DIY I should be catching up on. It has been lovely and relaxing. I don't want to get up at 8am to drive up the road to meet her half way. I don't think its unreasonable especially since I am grafting so hard for our kids t expect a little rest and let her drive down here and drop them off? Especially since her parents drove down and picked them up so she didn't have too. And I let her stay down here some weekends so she doesn't have to drive so much.

Also yet again she wants to drop the kids off so early on a Sunday. Even though she doesn't get them till Friday evening. I that was me I wouldn't want to return then on a Sunday. To be honest I am a little hacked off.

I wouldn't be unreasonable to tell her to bring them to me?

Sorry, I've only just seen this. But no, you would be far from unreasonable to tell her she has to drop them off.

And I would knock letting her stay at yours on the head too, personally.

No, you wouldn't be unreasonable at all. Start to be more assertive. Doesn't mean you become unfair, you just stop being so available and accommodating, she needs to learn to rely less on you, and she never will if you are always there.

Glad you had a relaxing day

Well I think you will be proud of me MN. I told her bring the kids to me and she said OK. The kids stay at their grandparents house with their mum when they go up. I get a text from her mum at 10 am complaining that my little girl only woke up a 9.30am and by 9.45am she had got her dress, a little yogurt in her and in the car. Her mum said that my ex had said that I make her have the kids back by 12pm. I told her that's a lie, I want her to spend as much time as possible with her mum. Her mum was not happy because yet again she is being lied to gain by my ex. I dont think my ex knows me and her mum talk. Honestly it's like she can't wait to get ride of them, it's not fair on the kids and I am not happy.

When she seen me she gave a different story. She said the Meds she is on makes her worn out by 2pm and she not supose to drive on them. I asked a friend in know about her Meds and she said she should be fine.

Their grandparents are on about doing all the driving now so the kids can stay longer on a sun. But that's not fair on them.

I just don't get her. I am not a happy bunny.

Hi Dad

You seems to be tying yourself up in knots trying to psychoanalyse why she is who she is.

You can't change her if she does have a personality disorder, then they are hard very hard to manage both for the person with it and the therapist, there is no cure for it either.

The best you can do is stop looking back and mulling over the whys and wherefores, you can only deal with the evidence before you, what you know.

She lies, she isn't maternal, she's volatile, she's flaky and unhappy.

These are the things you do know, so what can you do?

Protect your kids as far as possible from potentially damaging behaviour from her, know that your not dealing with a reasonable person, With normal understanding of parental instincts, or social norms.

As soon as you give yourself permission to not enable and feel sorry for her, the easier your mind will sit.
Your doing everything right by those children, cool your jets until the divorce is through and your home free. After that she's on her own, she has her parents let them deal with her

Good luck

Good that you're starting to be a bit more confident.

You will not damage your kids by refusing to bend over backwards and accommodate her. As they grow up, they will see and realise that you are the one who is there through it all. The daily grind, the ups and downs, and they will love you all the more for it. And for trying to be as fair as possible.

Next time it's her weekend, tell her you're sorry, but that the earliest you can have them back is 4/5pm (whatever times works best for you) and then ignore all protests.

No it's not fair that her parents do the driving to pick them up, but at the end of the day, that's not your issue.

Would she go ballistic if she found out you still talk to her parents? Probably, because she's telling you one thing and them another.

I agree with PP, you can't fix her. But those kids are as much yours as hers, so keep being the amazing dad you are to them. And step back from trying to understand her, you'll drive yourself mad. The kids have you, so just do what you're doing, when you can.

She's in a bad place, but she has active parents to support her and hopefully friends etc to help her. Push her in the background in your thoughts if you can, for your own good.

I think what you need to figure out is does she actually want to see her kids because by the sounds of it you do want to see your kids so it is better they are where they wanted.

It has been said many times on here...You can't make the NRP want to see their kids. Sometimes pushing contact is not they way.

You need to focus on what the kids need from you..Unfortunately it seems she won't be giving all they need.

I personally think you are amazing. You sound like such a lovely man. Your ex was a fool to throw someone like you away!! I have so much admiration for you and everything you are trying to achieve. You are going to make a lucky woman very happy one day. What lucky children you have.

Well Guiltypleasures001 I think I have just found my new guilty pleasure; no giving a dam anymore. She still lives with that man, no one really knows to what extent they are together or her feeling for him. Talking to my ex's mum today she said my ex is having a hard time. She found a letter to him (she used to sometime write me letters to explain her feeling). In it she complains about him coming off the pills and now he is always snappy with her. He has some anger and paranoia issues (the weed probably dont help). Also they are never seen out together any more, they used to be out as a couple all the time. He is still always out with his mates and going out for meals with his family but she is never seen with him anymore. The other man is her step cousin so her family always know what he is up to through the grape vine. Basically she said she hasn’t got a life any more and he just uses her as a skivvy and for the money she brings in (and no doubt her body too). I know she pays a lot of his bills and no doubt his weed costs a bit. It would explain how she has got in so much debt yet has nothing to show for it. Any way the point is this. I should be mortified for her, he is not a good man. In fact I used to be so worried for her when I knew who it was. After all I promised to protect her. But I did my best and a year ago I tried very hard to bring her back and protect her from this madness. I loved her then and would have forgiven it all just to have her back and know she was safe. But now I am tired. I have failed, in the end I could not protect her from her self. I am completely worn out trying to support her too. Even when I stopped loving her I didn’t want to see her fuck her life up. Now with the above (her being in an abusive relationship probably) I am going to sound harsh; but I don’t care anymore, she is no longer my responsibility and this is her life to sort now. I have tried so hard for her and now I am completely worn out. So I am going to try and stop trying to work her out anymore and concentrate on my life. It is a big load of my chest not caring anymore.

I am no longer going to bend over backwards for her. I will leave travel arrangements up to her and her parents. Her mum said she doesn’t mind as they are their grandchildren and they want to see them as much as possible. They said they want to help me as much as possible and to be fair they are the best in-law (soon to be ex in-laws) you could wish for. In fact her sisters have been great too. So I know whenever they go up they are cared for and loved however much or as little their mums does. The kids will always want to go see their family up there. I have always taken it for granted that their mum loves them and I sure she does but its hard to see sometimes.

So Blackpool is still on. I isn’t changing that for the world because my little girl is so looking forward to her mum coming too (obviously my boy is too little to understand). We are going to have a good time. Despite it all me and there mum still get on fine around each other (although I have to bite my tongue over the ridiculous fibs). For as long as its feasible we will share the key points in the kids life’s together because I do think its unfair for anyone to miss out. But after the divorce she is on her own. The only things I want to do with her will be about the kids and we will do things on my terms. I will be fair as always but that includes being fair to me. As to how she deals with these changes is up to her. She ever steps up or she doesn’t, I can see now that is not for me to do.

Saddaughterinlaw thanks for your lovely words and everyone’s support. I think it will be a long time, if ever before I want a relationship again. Unfortunately I have had great relationship role models in my life like my parents. I have seen true love and devotion no matter what. Maybe that’s why I did love her unconditionally, including her many faults and her abuse. I am a tough cookie and I was happy to ride out the hard times because I enjoyed the good time we had. She was an old ball, I knew that. We were different intellectually, I knew that. But I loved he for she was and woke up happy every day seeing her next to me. That’s why I tried so hard for our family and didn’t give up easily. But I have just realised something different about the love my parents and grandparents had. The difference was that undying love was a two way thing. They would have never gave up on each other to the bitter end. It was sixteen years ago when my dad died (I was still at school) and my mum still wont look at another man. She is devoted to him (some could say sadly) to the bitter end and wants no other. My ex gave up on me and our family. She is the one who chose to break it and did not try to repair it. Its time I remember that and start to forgive myself.

I have worked out a lot today. I must say I feel better.

What a sweet man you are. I'm sure your wife will regret her actions one day very soon. You seem like one in a million. Take care of yourself

Just read through the recent comments and you are processing what she has done / how she behaves to try and rationalise it and work out why she behaves the way she does. Must be mentally exhausting.

I recognise some of the traits you describe about her. She's messed up inside and consumed with herself. That's why she is so selfish. She is so consumed with herself that she comes first (all her issues, drama, wants/needs) and the children come second. That's why she's relying on her parents to do some of the parental responsibilities for her and minimising the time she spends with the kids. It sounds like her own parents know what she is like - that is why they secretly talk to you behind her back.

Unfortunately, as your children grow older they will notice that their mother acts in a selfish way and does not seem to care about them in the way they feel a parent should. Whilst you can protect them against some of this (and maybe you should to a degree). It will also be helpful for them to acknowledge her faults and limitations. Otherwise, they will spend their mental efforts trying to measure her and work her out (just like you do). It will be confusing for them - should a mother do that? Why did she do that/say this? Why am I feeling x about my mother?

In short, when a parent is lacking in some way, it helps if children know that they are lacking and that it is not normal, and they deserve better.
You need to give your children the love, support and time they need. They need to experience what good parenting looks like. Then they will work out for themselves what good parenting doesn't look like, perhaps with some explanation from you when their mother lets them down on occasions. This does not need to be explained in a negative way - "she struggles with.....", "she does not know she does x because she has some unresolved issues", "Yes, I understand why you feel x, because that is disappointing".

You need to make up for her failures by being there FOR YOUR CHILDREN, NOT FOR HER - except in instances where it is a by-product of being there for your children. (i.e. the whole purpose of her going on holiday with you must be to the children's benefit, not her benefit). This will help you formulate those boundaries. Picking the kids up half-way is for her own convenience, that is why it was right of you to insist she collects them from your home. There is no benefit for your children in being picked up half-way, in fact, they may even interpret that as her being less arsed to make an effort (negative impact). See? It will help you judge what you should give in to and what you shouldn't.

Don't get angry about it (wasting your energy). She won't change. It is the way she is - probably forever. You can't fix her, she can only fix herself and she probably doesn't/won't even recognise any of it.

Saddaughterinlaw - Thanks for the kid words. All I can do is my best. Unfortunately being a sweet man doesn't always = success.

WittyCakeMeister - Thanks for insight. Its given me a lot to think about. Basically I need to forget about my ex, she is a loss. Everything I do now regarding my ex should revolve around one simple question; is it for the benefit of me and the kids? If it is yes then do it (no problem if it benefits her as a by product). If its a no, then don't. It is time to throw in the towel and sadly write my ex off. Hard for me to do because I may be sweet but I am tenacious too (always have been). I have wasted so much of my energy and soul into an unfixable situation. Time to concentrate on me and the kids. To be fair I think this is what a lot of people on here have been saying to me but maybe now the penny has dropped. You must understand its hard for me to give up on someone you loved? It was so hard for me to give up on her as a wife and its been even harder for me to give up on her as a mother.

The kids are 5 and 1 at the moment so I guess a little early to explain things. Although my 5 YO girl is very perceptive. I guess I need to take each day as it comes and hopefully find a way for them to get a good understanding as they grow up. I will as always give their mum every opportunity but no longer will I chase and push her to see the kids. I hope one day she gets out of this rut and wants to try harder. I have great family-in-law and I know the kids are always welcomed and loved up there even if their mum is not too bothered.

I do recognise now how so self absorbed she is. I don't how I never saw this before. She was probably always like that but all I could see was the good in here and the vulnerable soul behind the hard act and violent outbursts. Yes she was abusive at times and of course back then I didn't fully twig the lies and manipulation. But despite it all I was very happy with her, I loved her. The selfishness was hard to spot in away. She was no gold digger and never asked for material things. She still isn't thank goodness. But thinking about it she always was cleaver at getting her own way. I missed a couple of good mates weddings because of her (luckily one of my mates wife's was a cheat, divorced 6 months later and I got to go to wedding no.2 last year). The trouble is now I doubt my judgement on women so much I don't thing I could trust my self to find someone good (that's if I ever found the time).

On the plus side now I am convinced she would never want to take the kids of me. A few months ago when I was all over the place I was worried about that at one stage.

Apologies in advance, I'm going to ask what sound like harsh questions but I truly mean them kindly.

Can you trust your XW with a child if you split them up for a day for an activity?

If her current "beau" is a weed addict is she too? How will that impact on her care of the dc? Is she likely to bring some along on the holiday? Or suffer withdrawal from its absence - even in the air as a passive absorbent?

I fear you might have some unanticipated problems coming your way on this holiday. XW is not another child for you to take care of. If you are a rescuer then you need to assess - quite ruthlessly - the boundary lines and territory of your rescuing skills. Don't project images of ideal family life with x, y, z involved when Reality has another platter on your table.