ExH applying for sole custody - I'm miserable

[user1475501383]

I've been sneaking on this message board for a while and am liking it, I hope you could give me advice and opinions on this...

The beginning 'sticky' post is brilliant where it says the only amount of abuse that is acceptable is 0%. But there is one thing that has not happened in my case. It says 'no your kids won't be taken from you'. But mine has been taken away by XH, at least for the time being.

It's a long story but I'll try to be as brief as I can without leaving out too much important detail...

2 years ago I moved out because of constant disagreements with XH. He was the 'domineering' type and found it hard to accept my imperfections, so it was an ever-increasing amount of criticism, escalating to verbal and sometimes physical abuse. At the same time, he presented as TheWorld'sBestDadTM and TheWorld'sBestHusbandTM and I doubted myself for years when I wanted to leave because my family adored him, as well as our DS, and also, he was so super nice to me sometimes.

He always told me that if we ever broke up, he would refuse to move, as it was his deposit in the house. We were abroad with DS (now 9) and got into another conflict and he refused to let me on the plane, so I stayed behind and flew back to UK the next day. I moved out then.

XH also always told me that if we break up, "I will take DS and use your mental health records against you". I am on antidepressants and I also have a diagnosed learning disability similar to Dyspraxia.

I moved back 6 months later, for a 3 month period, as I was so depressed I wasn't getting proper access to DS. Everyone told me not to get a lawyer - XH and my family - so I wanted to see if we could live together as a family again. However, it didn't work out, I moved out again and we stayed friendly.

However, I still wasn't seeing DS enough - I only had him over half a weekend and also one night during the week when I 'babysat' for XH at the old marital home.

Things rapidly got worse when I found a new man. On one of the conflict occasions I expressed that I wanted to have our son overnight during the week at mine, as obviously (because of the conflict) it was no longer viable for me to 'babysit' at the old marital home. XH was walking away from my flat then but turned back and busted his way in, and in front of DS and new partner XH started pushing me and threatening to take pics of the state of my flat for social services. (It was a bit messy as I was packing up due to an impending move etc.)

Long story short, I called the police and XH from then on stopped me seeing DS AT ALL without 'supervision'. I started court proceedings but progress has been slow. For an agonising three-four months I could not see DS for more than 2 hours a week at a mutual friend for a playdate. Mother's day I spent 1 hour at a local shopping mall cafe with my son and XH!!!

Then XH agreed by consent for me to see DS overnight one night a week without supervision. The court has not taken a stance yet AT ALL because of several bureaucratic issues delaying the process. Social services have been involved and so far they have said to me that they have no concerns regarding my parenting and that all restrictions imposed come from XH only.

We are due to have the first official report published in a few weeks as we're also going to court again then. I am nervous - my parenting will be judged based on an 1 hr long meeting with me and DS.

One silver lining has been that I got a good report from my GP stating that my medication and mental conditions should pose no risk to my parenting. I cannot stress enough what a relief it was to have someone say I'm sane enough o look after DS! Especially as I believe XH's behaviours fall a lot under 'gaslighting'.

Things that worry me include:

DS says he wants to only spend one night a week with me, XH has been parrotting this from the start. I used to look after him full time and then later on more like 60% when XH went freelance. I don't understand why suddenly my own DS does not want to see me more, and I don't know what it is that XH has done for it to get to this point.

DS has got a legal guardian so his voice will be heard in court through that. I worry it will actually be XH's voice that gets heard through DS.

XH lies a lot in his statements, I have tried to point these out in my responses to his (as I do have proof that some/many of them are lies), but the Judge has not yet had time to go through any of them properly, and I worry that XH will get his way as he is so determined to erase me from DS's life.

XH is a very charming man, and I worry the social worker / legal guardian falls under his charm. XH has successfully mobilised his whole family and many of our mutual friends to give written statements against me and my parenting. (Obviously the mutual friends are not my friends anymore after this!) He is very good at people skills and he also lies (which shows in the statements written by former mutual friends) that I am applying for sole custody when in fact he is. I am only applying to co-parent on the 50-50 principle, shared care. Like we always used to do when we lived together!

This has been a miserable experience and I doubt I would have made it this far if I didn't have my new partner by my side, as well as my family's support and their money to pay for my legal representation.

Any comments are much appreciated. Honesty too, especially that. I feel guilty - what kind of a mum does not live with their child??!! Have I failed my DS? Where did I go wrong??

I think the plane thing was probably psychological abuse, with an alternative solution and/or being controlling (OP being used to his control)

'Controlling antics' still minimises it - if he cannot control you directly, then it seems he is still trying to control your access to DS and probably controlling DS. It will be interesting to see how he responds to the counselling suggestion - because that becomes something he cannot control.

You may well be told DS does not want or need it; but there is nothing to stop you asking DS yourself or making sure he has a neutral third party to talk to (even if he does not take up the offer now). Just so he knows it is a possibility. You do not need to do everything through his dad.

Generally if there are no issues around abuse, neglect etc then I understand that children have a right to know both parents in all aspects of their lives. I have had a breakdown - I was already resident carer as xH did not live with us, no-one ever questioned my fitness to parent (and I had a few days when I was dropping off DC in my pjs and not going up to the class lines to wave them in, because getting them fed, dressed, packed was all I could manage). In fact me being at home all the time, and not working some days, helped DC because they didn't really care if I was sleeping all day when they were at school! I hope I am not trivialising but the DC were aware I was ill, and that these things happened. They were able to respond to I am not well enough to do x, so we will do y. Whether it would have been better to have someone else look after DC at that point, I don't know, I would have not wanted that more than a day here or there. But to not see them at all? That is a whole different story. That would make it worse. I think you are doing well in a difficult situation.

The other point about residential contact - DS is being assessed for ASD and other support needs. He absolutely struggles with being away to the point of distress and him being violent. So if your DS had any issues like that, but you would be aware. DD hardly sees her dad (his choice) but she is always excited to go and I move commitments around to make sure she can do. You don't block manageable and safe contact for no reason, you promote and facilitate it.

New lawyer for definite. You need someone who is experienced in D.A.

The other thing is that if your ds is saying he only wants to see you once a week then it's going to be hard to enforce visits if he has been or is convinced he does t want them. It might be that you have the once a week to re bond with him and show him that you are not who his dad has led him to believe and then he can come more (he's getting old enough to make his own mind up).
It's awful, what a pity you didn't involve the police from the outset but don't dwell.
I wonder if women's aid can recommend a lawyer?

Oh, OP. You have been abused for years, and this has - very understandably - made it very difficult for you to look objectively at your own situation.

Here's how it appears to an outsider:
Your XH is not a good person.
He is physically abusive (pushing you, pinning you against wall, throwing things).
He is financially abusive (denying you rights to house despite paying mortgage for years).
He is emotionally abusive (too many examples to mention).

You need to completely change your approach to this. The conciliatory approach is not working - it's never going to work with an abusive bully. Your attempts to keep things civil and make concessions to him for your son's sake are working directly against your own interests.
You need a new lawyer who is experienced in domestic abuse cases; you need to be open with them and list every episode of abuse that has happened over the years. You need to keep thinking of it as abuse, because that's what it is. You need to stop being 'nice' to your XH - keep all contact to a bare minimum. Challenge every lie he tells - don't let things go for the sake of keeping the peace.

Please contact Women's Aid and get some support. Use your family and friends. Fight for your son.

I just have to say thank you so much for your views and support. I have been reading them in tears today. It really means a lot to me that you are giving me this support. I'm at work now so have to leave this short.

Really grateful for this.

Cocoabutton - my DS may well have issues like that. The argument that can then be made in favour of XH is that him and his 'mansion' (as he calls it) provides DS with the stability DS needs? Everyone tells me the court will only look at what's in the best interests of DS, and therefore, is it possible that main residence with XH is actually better for DS?

I can't imagine XH would allow a situation where I moved in the 'mansion' he feels he is 100% entitled to because without his deposit I'd only been renting.

Hi iminshock, thanks for your reaction, it is therapeutic to hear. Cocoabutton is right. The way it unfolded was that when XH told me he was not letting me on the flight back to UK, I knew he had the tickets so there was no way I was able to go on that plane unless he allowed me to have my ticket. I begged and pleaded, I said I'll even move out but please let me fly back, he said "you need to stay in your country" (an unexpected variation of the racist standard phrase 'go back to your country') and I tried to reason with him but he kept telling I wasn't allowed on the plane.

There was no way I was able to get on that plane short of trying to confiscate the tickets from him, and I didn't even know which bag/pocket they were in, and that would have made him interrupt physically which would have caused more trauma in front of our DS which was tragically witnessing all of this.

It didn't help that my mum, who back then was still completely charmed by XH, overheard us argue and her reaction was to just keep telling me 'just say sorry, just say sorry...' I'm sure I did say sorry, too, it's just that there was nothing I could do.

At the last minute before leaving for airport, 2h after the fight, XH turned around and said 'Okay things are calmer now so you can come with us'. At that point I had already made arrangements to fly back the following day, so I declined. In retrospect I perhaps should have gone on the plane... It's just that I knew I'd get sucked back into XH being 'MisterSuperNicePerfectHusband' and that I would change my mind about us having to separate --- the argument and the fact it started with XH gaslighting our DS (long story, I wrote a post about it yesterday on the thread re gaslighting) had made me decide to draw the line there, finally. Perhaps I intuitively sensed that if I had gone back on the plane, we would have made up and the family rollercoaster hell of ongoing ups and downs would have kept going full speed until God knows when.

It is hard to explain but it simply was not an option for me to do anything else other than not go on the plane OR go on the plane --- it would not have been possible to do anything that would have involved me and DS going together without XH, or us all going and then making XH vacate the house... He is a very strong and domineering personality, and at that point he had also my parents' full support.

Ledkr, many thanks for your views. I'm trying to keep those in mind. I will certainly re-evaluate depending on what happens in our court session next week.

I would want nothing more than to just have this resolved amicably, but am starting to realise it simply may not be possible at all with the kind of person XH is. If I was in his position, I would actively encourage contact with DS and XH, as long as it posed no risk to DS of course.

If I was the resident parent, there is no way I would allow DS to get away with "I only wanna see dad 1 night a week" because it would be clear to me that that is not beneficial for having a proper close relationship with the non-resident parent. We both used to play a very active part in DS's life me more, of course, although XH tries to deny I ever played a part. I wonder how he explains our DS is fluent in the obscure EUMinorityLanguage that only I have spoken to him over the years except for a few weeks a year when we visit the country of the obscure EUMinorityLanguage or when my folks have come over. A foreign language is almost impossible to learn unless you live in that country I have studied 3 foreign languages so I know a lot about this! it is beyond belief how XH can outrageously lie that I have not been a proper mum to DS when the striking fact is that he is bilingual only because I have always been there with him speaking said language.

It stresses me out as that is my main evidence against his absurd claim that I was never really present in DS's life. I envisage having to pay two expert witnesses for Court - one who evaluates that DS's comprehension of EUMinorityLanguage is indeed at 'mother tongue' level, and another who is a specialist in children's language learning and can testify that there is NO way a child can speak and understand a second language fluently unless they've been brought up with that language a minimum of XX hours a week, whatever that number is....

It is obviously draining my family's finances.

Cel982, thanks for your honest view.

I guess my lawyers have made the point that this case isn't about his XH treated (or continues to treat) me, but it's about what's best for DS. XH presents as SuperDadTM so I don't really know how to go about this. From what I have gathered, XH goes around telling mutual friends that I have taken him to court accusing him of domestic violence and having him imprisoned and that I am seeking full custody of DS. This certainly is not true. And I would not want to sever the relationship between DS and his main male role model.... He is an attentive dad, no he isn't perfect just like nobody is, but in general he is a good father... Except for, well, this....trying to stop me and Ds having a proper relationship; and also I do not agree with his corporeal punishment - slapping DS when he misbehaves etc, which I am really hoping he does not do anymore.

And apparently DS's behaviour has markedly improved since I moved out. All XH's friends and family attribute this in statements to the Court as evidence that I was a harmful presence in DS's life. I tend to think that it was a relief to DS to no longer witness the ongoing toxicity between his mum and dad on an almost daily basis, and I also think that it is worrying if a child starts to suddenly act better in what are obviously traumatic circumstances - parents breaking up - as that can well be a sign that he does not trust anymore that people will stick with him no matter what.

I have made it clear to him he is not to blame for the separation, and he says ' I know', but I do wonder whether he deep down thinks it was his fault, especially as the day we separated started from DS misbehaving and XH punishing and then gaslighting him, which lead to me sticking up for DS and then XH refused to let me on the plane...

Many thanks for your views. I keep re-reading them just trying to make sense of the situation.

There used to be a support thread on here for people in or leaving emotionally abusive relationships- I am on my phone right now, but will look it out for you later. Your experience of the plane would be consistent with some of the things there. It is hard to describe the crazy making effects of psychological abuse.

Whatever may or may not have happened since, you effectively could not get on the plane for your own sanity, and he really put you in a humiliating position. A plane ticket with your family is not something you should have to beg for and his relenting at the last minute was a form of control. That is heart-breaking but in some ways, you also recognised that the cycle of abuse had to stop and/or you could no longer be part of it. What is happening now is that the abuse is persisting through the family courts but you have had some space to recover your health and hopefully gain some clarity on the dynamics at play.
Will come back later

Your Dh sounds manipulative and cruel at times. I don't understand the fact that you think he is a good person to raise your son, your son might turn out the same. Or might be treated like DH is treating you if he stands up to him in the future.
You need to be in his life to mitigate this.

Wow. Thank you Cocoabutton.

It was a sort of a weird dynamic when both my DM and DF were stepping in blaming me for the situation, siding with PerfectHusbandTM. It would have been so typical of me to bow down and blame myself too but there had been just too many instances of horrible things like that happening in the months leading up to that incident.

My DM and DF essentially still think of me as a child, as I'm their only child and female. I've analysed this and in retrospect it seems they were delighted when I got together with XH who is significantly older than me. They saw him as a responsible 'new father'.

And I also saw XH like that, although I didn't realise it at the time. But XH used to often use phrases like he 'gives me guidance' etc. When we broke up he said things like 'I was just trying to guide you'. He did teach me a lot of things - he knew much more than I did about a lot of basic practical things. I was a student and I had never learned to cook more than one pasta dish when we met & I got pregnant with DS so I can see why XH was worried about having a DC with me (DS wasn't planned - but I wouldn't change him for the world, obviously). I did learn, though, except with housework where I never measured up to his standards.

The strange thing is just before we broke up I had started a systematic daily programme to tackle my untidy habits. But it only made XH angrier. He shouted at me several times why couldn't I do it sooner over all the years. My parents seemed to take his side. Soon after, I got diagnosed with a learning disability that basically explained the difficulties I had had. I thought I could finally get the right therapy/help/support to tackle the issue. But ultimately the situation leading to my diagnosis made XH more horrible to me than ever. It's like he finally had more power over me with an official diagnosis, and would actually say things like "I'm the one who is able to XYZ because i haven't got the disability". That was a few weeks before we broke up and I nearly left him then but then made up again because I really wanted us to stay together for DS.

And also, I believe, I was an optimist and tried to only focus on the good times. Arguments would get quickly forgotten about, I didn't want to dwell on them when we'd made up.

Also, XH had/has to an extent convinced me that I'm deficient in some ways because of my learning disability. He has got more practical skills than I do. I am nowhere near as bad as he makes me out to be in his statements to court, but he tends to be more practical than me (not always though). One of his main arguments with wanting sole custody (residence) of DS is that he is 'DS's stability'. He is able to exaggerate our differences because I'm officially diagnosed and that scares people (his family, school mums, perhaps even social workers) because it makes me different.

Thank you MissMargie. I believe you are absolutely right. The question is what is the right balance? That's why I have tried to go for the 50-50 principle but XH wants me out of DS's life on all occasions but one night a week. My lawyers have said it's unlikely I would be granted main residence because of the status quo of DS living with XH. If XH is mainly abusive to me only, the court would apparently see it as irrelevant if I tried to make too much of an issue about it??!!?? It puzzles me....

Thanks so much for your views, it makes me feel so much less lonely, and it's weird to think I am perhaps sane after all...

OP
There is nothing 'wrong' with you.
But your ExH is a manipulative shit and you need a shit hot lawyer who understands emotional abuse. In the absence of sensible family support you need some one like Women's Aid at your back. Time is of the essence.

I am trying the link on my phone

www.mumsnet.com/Talk/relationships/a1686357-Support-for-those-in-Emotionally-Abusive-relationships-17

There were a whole series of these threads, but mainly I wanted to point you to the resources at the front which the lovely foolonthehill compiled, I think. I have not had a chance to get my PC on this evening, but if the link does not work, put 'support for those in emotionally abusive relationships' into the mumsnet search box. I am fairly sure at least by thread 16 the resources were at the start.

Otherwise, you have written so much to respond to and I hope it is helpful setting it down. But in short fusspot has it, there is nothing wrong with you! You just need to peruse these boards a bit, maybe the health ones, to see the issues people have and the DH/DP support they refer to. It is not you who is 'wrong' here.

To the point of your xH being your DS's stability, I am minded to say only because he seems to lack any kind of heart and just be some kind of controlling automaton (his way or the highway). FFS people are all different; that is what makes life wonderful. Guidance implies he is a teacher, so you have a power imbalance right there. Marriage should be a partnership. My xH was a neat freak and I could not manage it all over time; some order is good as is some cleanliness and nice decoration but neat freakery is soul-destroying if it does not come naturally to you.

I know I have not answered your questions about whether the one night a week is best for DS, but your xH has done a number on your confidence as a person and as DS' mother (initially with your parents' support) and that seems to be the bigger issue. But I will think about your questions because I think they are important. I do think if your DS had ASD type issues or severe anxiety you would have been absolutely aware of them since he was small, though.

The advice on this thread to get talking to real life support organisations is good, it is hard to make the first call but it would be helpful to speak to someone with experience of the many manifestations of domestic abuse.

I don't know if you picked up a pp's suggestion you do the Freedom Programme. I urge you to do it, not online but in pertain if at all possible (it's worth travelling for). It is a truly excellent course and will get your head straight in record time. Find a Freedom Programme course near you

He is a bad man. He is an abuser. His abuse is much worse than you currently realise. He is using ds to punish you (with no thought of the impact on ds), just as he stopped you getting on the plane. He jumps to your defence when someone treats you badly bcs 1. he considers you are his property (so if someone treats you badly he sees it that they are treating him badly - he concern is not for you but for him) and 2. he considers he is the only one who has the right to treat you badly (see 1. re: you are his property)

(Posted that so it wasn't lost, on phone)

Pp is right that your attempts to appeal to him /his better side won't work and is counterproductive for you and your case. As hard as it is to accept, the only thing that works is to get black and white about it. Eg you recognise he has vulnerabilities - we all have vulnerabilities and many have had very bad histories but don't eg control dominate and charm their way through their intimate relationships.

That is, he doesn't have a better side. In one sense you have to dehumanise him in order to see him with clarify. The reality is he is not humane.

I was just about to go to bed, when I came across your thread OP, and shouldn't really be online but I'm so upset for you I had to comment!

I don't have any advice to give you, have no experience of anything you're going through, but I can't believe everyone apart from your new partner is majorly bullying you! Your own father said to you, you would never find anyone better than XH!!! Your XH didn't let you get on the plane?!! WTF?

Sorry, I'm ranting, not my usual style really, but no wonder you have mental health issues. What do you mean you are an 'acquired taste'? You're a person, a mother, a valuable human being like any other. No-one can tell you not to get on the plane, apart from passport control. Your XH is a real asshole and a bully. Your parents SHOULD treat to you better.

It sounds like you've been bullied all your life and have a very low self esteem, which is completely understandable. You do love your son, I can clearly see that, and now you have to find an inner strength to fight for him. Please do not let people walk all over you for one more day. There is nothing wrong with you! We are all some sort of 'acquired tastes' with our own issues and good and bad sides. Many of us have mental health issues, but that doesn't mean we are bad parents, and should be treated without respect. Don't let anyone talk to you like you don't matter, correct every negative or false statement about you that you hear, and make sure everyone knows how much you love your son and will do whatever it takes.

Also have a look at Joshua Coleman to address your shame and distress at the virtual estrangement from your son. He is excellent. Also look at Stand Alone who address family alienation /estrangement.

Contact Women's Aid asap. They will help and support you in all ways including signposting you to appropriate legal services in your area. Find your local WA here

You can do this. It's going to mean ditching nice/kind reasoning. You can't afford to be nice, you have to wake up in a crucial sense. The above orgs will help you to get to that point.

Springy yes, I could never work out why xH complained about mostly male colleagues dumping lower grade work on me, but was perfectly happy to perpetuate unequal roles in the home to the extent I found it hard to do more than lower grade work and was doing almost all the domestic work.

1. It was demeaning the work I was doing as less valuable
2. It was suggesting that I could not stand up for myself professionally
3. It reflected badly on him that i was not achieving my potential and that others were using me in that way, not just him
4. It allowed him to fulfil a verbal protector role, while his actions actually made life harder.

Quite clever, really. It is really hard for me still to step out of 'service' role!

I can't put in words how helpful your responses have been....

I'm going to dash off for my half-a-weekend with DS but will check back in afterwards.

It's kind of a strange feeling when you've been gaslighted and then suddenly you start hearing these kind of views?

Although I do feel that I did try hard to please XH from the start (due to accidental pregnancy) and as years went by, maybe less so because I didn't have the same motivation anymore. I used to agree with him on pretty much everything. I think he might feel tricked if he got used to being the unquestioned authority, the one with the wisdom, experience, money etc and then I stopped playing the obedient role. I'm just trying to understand his frustration...

Hugs and have a great weekend

I do hope when you get back from your (lovely) w/e with ds you action the many orgs listed on this thread.

You have to be proactive about this. Really proactive. You can't hope it'll all sort itself out - it really won't and there's a huge amount at stake.

As you progress along the route of getting free of his mentally oppressive and domineering role in your life, you will be less concerned about what he's thinking and feeling, more concerned about what you're thinking and feeling. That's the aim.

Have a great time with ds

My kids were the subject of a social enquiry to determine if they should be allowed to resume relations with their paternal grandmother against their fathers (exh) wishes. He falsely accused his step father of sexual abuse of my DDs when they were 3 & 4.

They were 4 & 5 I think, maybe one year more. I explained that everyone wanted more time with them and everyone (including me) wanted them to say what worked in their favour.

I explained that it was really important to say what they themselves wanted because they would have to live with the outcome until they were 13 at least. And not to say what they were told to say by any of us. And to say only what they knew or had seen for themselves.

They said their father drank champagne for breakfast. He is an alcoholic so their interpretation was interesting.