If I describe a situation please can you tell me what you think?

[Ihopeyouhadthetimeofyourlife]

DH and I are having problems. The problems are mostly that I'm no longer attracted to him and questioning whether I want to remainin the marriage. I feel guilty and sad for feeling the way I do, particularly when I've always felt it's not his fault.

Something happened the other night that made me feel uncomfortable and I'm really struggling to understand whether it's because of the way I feel (or don't feel) about him or whether it was not quite right.

We were away in a hotel for work (we have always worked together). We went for dinner with a colleague and he was texting me to say I was talking too loud (possibly slightly true, my voice is quite loud, but I wasn't drunk or shouting and was talking about boring work stuff in a moreorless empty hotel bar - nothing terribly embarrassing).

After my colleague left I said (nicely) that it felt very critical being texted like that and he stormed out. He came back a few minutes later saying he knew he was being childish. It was a bit strained but we had a drink in the bar then went up to our room.

He wanted to have sex. I didn't and was going to sleep. He came up behind me in bed and started touching me. I moved his hand (nicely) and said I was too tired. He moved his hand back and carried on. I said I was still bleeding (end of my period) and not really up for it. He carried on and said 'that's no reason we can't play'.

I said 'i really don't feel like it, can we just have a cuddle?'he carried on for a minute or so as if he hadn't heard me then huffed and rolled over away from me..

All night he made a big thing of not being able to sleep. Getting up every 5 mins and sighing etc. In the morning he said 'I had really dirty dreams about you and really want to fuck you'. I still didn't want to and said so so he picked up my hand and put it on his dick and closed my fingers round him. I touched him half heartedly for a couple of minutes then pulled away. He put my hand on his nipple and pulled my head on to his shoulder and had a wank until he came.

i feel really weird about it all.,I know I didn't want to do anything and felt really uncomfortable, but I'm not sure if his behaviour was unreasonable. I'd really appreciate so outside views

FFS. OP did move his hand. And she has just explained very clearly why she didn't walk away.

I did move his hand and he moved it back, but yes, I could have got up and walked away. He would have made it into a big deal and shouted at me etc though.

I'm not saying I think he assaulted me, but I do think that it should have been clear that I didn't want to do it, and that when you know someone doesn't want sexual contact with you you shouldn't go ahead and do it anyway.

I don't know. Maybe it is because of my own history and issues, but i ended up lying there kind of frozen and trying not to cry. whilst I'm sure that wasn't what he intended I don't think he cared enough about how I felt to stop

It was a rotten thing to happen OP. Of that there is no doubt, and I'm sorry. It wouldn't fall under my personal view of assault, but I gather the law is different, so it could just be me

Do you remember what attracted you to him in the first place? Has he changed or did you have a mistaken idea of what he's really like?

In this thread and your March one you mentioned your DH uses the word "play", noun or verb, I wonder if he deliberately uses that to disarm you because he knows full well you are not reciprocating. It sounds better to him than voicing, "I don't care if you want to be touched or not".

Pretty sure some of what he does is emotionally abusive:

1. Frequently disregards your opinions and needs.

1. Sulks and repeats bad behaviour when you challenge him to put you down and make you feel bad about yourself.

1. Accuses you of being insensitive or selfish in order to deflect his negative remarks.

1. Points out your flaws and weak areas but denies his attitude if confronted over his actions.

1. Makes you feel you need his permission to go out then creates a fuss when you do.

I see you need to continue the job if it's going to be financially punitive to leave the company but it must rankle you still have to prioritise his work over yours. What on earth would happen if you fell ill? Any chance of hiring someone else now to be his PA?
You see him at home and you work together and travel together. It must be suffocating when you no longer enjoy his company. It would be more bearable if he properly appreciated what you do.

OP, you sound perfectly clear about how he is treating you. Ignore the handmaidens who think women should be in a permanent state of consent.

So. Things are not improving and there seems little prospect that they will. What now ?

I'm so sorry OP, this sounds like a hideous situation. This was a sexual assault, he forced you to participate in a sexual activity against your will. The trouble is that people seem to believe that the terms 'sexual assault' and 'rape' are interchangeable. They're not. Rape is a form of sexual assault, but not all sexual assault is rape. I think it's really problematic that society seems to you this catch-all term to cover all forms of sexual violence and so you end up with people who've experienced these acts feeling like they have to minimise their experience in order to avoid labelling the perpetrator as a rapist. It also shuts down the discussion and prevents people from talking about their experiences. I don't think anyone is suggesting that (from what you have described) your DH is a rapist, he is however an a-grade asshole and what he did to you was very wrong.

Freezing is an incredibly common reaction in the circumstances and does not in any way indicate consent. The law, which has been quoted above, is clear on the definition of assault and some of the comments on this thread are pretty offensive. You clearly said no and he put his own wants above yours - he clearly doesn't care whether you consent to what he wants to do or not. For me, there would be no coming back from that. I'm so sorry that this has happened.

No-one said anything about being in a permanent state of consent. That's a ridiculous exaggeration. I simply couldn't get my head around the idea of assault, when the OP wasn't being held with force against her will. Just because we have different ideas of what this means (and it seems it is a grey area), it doesn't mean that I don't sympathise or think you should give in to this man and his pathetic advances.
And it was the OP who asked for our individual opinions on the situation.
I will bow out of this thread now, as I suspect it could turn from being a reasoned discussion.
OP, really hope you're okay and I hope I haven't added to your upset in any way

It is not a grey area!
She was forced to touch his penis against her will.

Sorry OP these posts are making me cross - not yours.

I am sorry this has happened to you and wish you strength to deal with it

assault = touching without consent.

sexual assault - sexual touching without consent.

Violence is a completely different thing and not being discussed here.

A man pinching your bum is sexual assault. Our bodies belong to us. If someone intrudes on your space without consent it is assault. The law is absolutely 100% black & white on this, no grey areas.

She said. no. He carried on. That's sexual assault.

No-one is suggesting that he violently attacked her, or even that she reports him (she could) but that she thinks about what to do in the future.

No adult in this world has the right to touch you in a sexual way unless you have definitely consented and want it.

'I'm sure victims of sexual assault wouldn't have let the act happen just for fear of an argument or shouting.' In that case you have absolutely no idea what your talking about

KickAss this is what I was trying to say, but you did it much more articulately!

Bilbo, presumably you've read the legal definition of sexual assault? And the fact that the OP told him she didn't want it and pushed his hand away is a pretty clear signal that she didn't consent, isn't it? The fact that he then continued anyway...? What would you call that?

Here's a tip if you have the power to stop people doing stuff you don't like then just stop them, don't just give in.

You do realise that's not how it works? Sometimes you are in situations where you want to fight back or resist but you can't - the body just freezes and becomes physically paralysed with the trauma of what is happening to you. It's one of the body's ways of protecting you from further violence (whether it's rational to think that violence may follow or not). A lot of victims (of rape, sexual assault or other crimes) don't fight back because they are physically unable to. It doesn't make their experiences any less genuine. There are numerous academic studies which support this and it's listed on the CPS website as one of the most common (and damaging) rape myths.

Besides which, OP has said repeatedly that she said no but she was ignored so it's kind of a moot point. She didn't consent, her DH had no reasonable belief that she had consented and therefore it was assaulted.

He coerced you into sex and treated you like a wank sock. That's pretty grim.

Some massive victim blaming shit going on here. And also some stubborn dumbass stupidity

OP has been perfectly clear in her description of what happened. Sexual assault, by definition and by law, does not require violence or threatening behaviour to be classed as such

Sulking, withdrawal of affection, silent treatment, emotional manipulation etc are forms of coercion which is now outlawed. Seems not everybody is up to speed with that though, and still only label sexual assault when there is a physical threat at play. It might be easier to square some of your own experiences by using that mindset, but it doesn't make it correct.

OP I think your feelings are telling you this is wrong. I think you can see your wishes were clearly ignored. It's difficult to get your head round. I found the Rights of Women website helpful, in particular this link might provide you with some clarity. There really isn't any "grey" in what you describe.

Understanding sexual assault link

I have forgotten how to cut and paste a link on my phone (gah) but the cup of tea analogy works well

but I'm sure victims of sexual assault wouldn't have let the act happen just for fear of an argument or shouting
I hope you can disregard nasty comments like this OP, the poster concerned is absolutely spouting nonsense and should be ignored

Cheers, srsly