Managing money

[nightandthelight]

DH and I have been married two and a half years and have a three month old DS. Before getting married I earned slightly more than him (couple of thousand a year) and we split joint contributions on a proportional basis.

We then had a period after marriage where we earnt the same so all joint contributions were split equally and we had the same amount of money for ourselves each month (we have a joint current account for bills and a joint savings account and then our own accounts).

DH has just got a new job with a significant pay rise (around 10k) and I am on maternity leave so reduced income and will hopefully be returning to work part time so there will be a big difference in our salaries going forward.

I feel that life would be a lot easier and fairer if we put all our money in one pot (siphoning some off into a joint savings account as well) and treated it as family money. DH doesn't feel that this is fair though as we didn't do this when I was earning more before we were married.

I am currently struggling every month for money and any spare I have goes into our joint savings as we are in the process of buying a new house and need money for legal fees, furniture etc. DH on the other hand always has money spare and has his own savings pot which I can't afford to do. He puts the same amount as me into joint savings, any spare goes into his personal savings.

I feel that this is unfair now that we are married and have a baby and our incomes are so different. But perhaps as DH has said I am being unfair as I was happy for it to be proportionate when I was the higher earner.

I suppose technically this should be in AIBU! So AIBU to feel that we should see money as family money now and not keep everything so separate.

Forgot to mention the separate thing is also a hassle as we end up owing each other money for stuff we bought with our own accounts and endlessly swapping money back and forth.

I agree with Jackie! Being a SAHP parent has perks and downsides like any other role. But your DH gains way more than he realises. And it isn't a jolly!

Your husband is a tight, selfish bastard.

Relationships develop and circumstances change. When you first start dating, the fairest split is 50-50 (unless one partner earn significantly more than the other). When you first start living together, the fairest split is proportionate to earnings. When you get married and start making career sacrifices (having a baby or relocating, for example) the only fair thing to do is to see all income as "family money" and have an equal say in how to spend it as well as an equal amount of disposable income.

The fact that he is comparing the situation now to the earlier stages of your relationship is awful. It's also extremely petty and mean of him to want to count up everything - but all things considered you have already contributed more than your fair share (paying more for the wedding and honeymoon, for example) when your salary was only slightly higher. Now his salary is much higher and he wants to keep it all for himself - selfish bastard.

I suggest that you find a good couple's counsellor to work on these issues. It's crucial that he treats you as an equal, which means providing for you and the child you have together as well as himself. If he doesn't values your unpaid contribution (maternity leave, childcare etc) as highly as his salary, you should seriously reconsider the relationship. And you should definitely go back to work to keep your financial independence. Being a SAHM with this twat man for a husband would be a disaster.

It is awful that you would have to consider going back FT rather than looking after your baby just because your husband is refusing to accept his responsibilities to his family. It's one thing if that's a decision you mutually agree on, but you're effectively being forced into it by him.

I think you may need to treat him like an idiot really break it down for him: The baby belongs to both of you. It cannot be left unsupervised for ten hours a day. Therefore, you either pay someone else to do the childcare (which would cost £X per month) or you sacrifice your salary to do it. In which case that work you're doing has a value of £X.

Disposable income drops dramatically once you have kids. It just does, there's no way around it. It sounds like he hasn't accepted that yet.

We have our own accounts and a joint account. The mortgage, bills, nursery, food, holidays etc all come out of the joint account. We put a proportional amount in each month according to how much we earn (60/40 roughly as we are both back to work full time) and then we have our own disposable income to spend how we like. I end up spending more of my own money on DD as I am with her more but then OH will take us out for dinner/drinks.

Definitely a game changer having a child and you should have a joint account for the bulk of things. I don't necessarily agree with ALL money being family money though, there has to be some autonomy and how would it work with gift buying etc?!

Bear The two things aren't mutually exclusive, you can still see all money as family money but divide it up into family expenditure and individual "allowances" for gifts and other things.

Gosh this has made me cross and I really, really hope you can get it sorted, OP, and not just by you giving up and 'letting' him control all the money, so he can 'treat' you to things. I grew up with an earning parent and a SATP, they were happy but i could see it was not for me. It has left me , though, with a desperate need to be in charge of my own money as that is the prized position in the household.

It's very telling that he is insisting on having the same period of time when he is in a position to be generous as you were before and nothing about the actual sums involved.

^ is the gist of my post, the rest is a wander down memory lane for me. Hope you find what works.

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So I sort of understand where you partner is coming from but oh dear, he has a very faulty idea of what is fair. If he really was on board with the idea of a baby, as i am sure you were between you, you need a new definition of fair, which includes all that you are sacrificing (salary, future promotion and career opportunities as well as sleep, substituting the mind numbingly boring round of childcare and housework) in order to give your child the best chance in life and to enable his career to continue as before.

I have a feeling though, that deep down, it comes down to the fact that he prefers to keep the control over the money in his own hands, so he can be 'generous' with you. He may have hated the days when you had more ( the way he didn't ask you for help when he needed it is a straw in the wind). If you could find a way to unpick these feelings with him, with some professional help, then it will be much easier to find a way forward that you both find fair. Currently, he is clawed his way up above you and is giving no sign of willingness to relinquish this position.

It's very telling that he is asking for the same period of time when he is in the position to be generous to you as you were before and nothing about the actual sums involved.

In my first serious relationship, we started as students, he had much more money than me and i was happy for him to spend it on me, leaving all the decisions (hence control) to him. We always knew that when i finally qualified, i would have loads more so there was no trouble about fairness now meanwhile.

When i did get that job, it all changed but, not, as i expected, for the better as we were both earning comfortably. We argued about 'everything'. Suddenly instead of it being finally my turn to be involved in decisions, i was supposed to 'let' him make decisions so he didn't feel emasculated. I laughed in the faces of the first 'friends' who pointed this out to me, i was sure we were an equal partnership and wasn't i now really pulling my weight in earning too?

All about control.. I had learned that the earning parent had 'proper' this is the way its going to be power and the SAHP had 'make him his favourite meal and wait for a good moment to ask him' power. It's taken me a while to find a different kind of relationship and to relax into (sometimes) not being in control. I still sometimes wish i could 'just decide' things but on the whole our partnership makes me happier than being alone.

AnotherEmma - yes for sure. I think our approach is pretty much identical to the one you describe though. Most of our earnings go in the pot and this is our commitment to the family money, then the remainder we can do what we like with. Both up with pretty much the same amount of 'allowance' as a result.

It's the intent rather than the end result OP - you may end up with plenty of money for everything but it seems controlling and a bit mean-spirited to make you ask for it, and it's exhausting enough looking after small people without having to keep tally of everything all the time.

It sounds like actually you've paid more or at least in proportion to earnings whilst you have been earning more. And the moving in together with your job starting rings bells - did you have another thread about him holding a grudge about paying before you started work? I think his true colours over money are showing now. If he won't share then get him to pay for the cost of you being a "nanny" and consider couples counselling to get him to see how ridiculous he is being.

No that wasn't me petal :)

Have had a text:

'I give up, we can do what you want. We split our spare money right down the middle but keep our separate accounts, OK?'

Splitting pretty marriage is very different to post children IMO. And as you now see it is generally the woman who loses out.

If you are struggling stop putting money in the savings. It is crazy to build up a nest egg whilst going with out on a day to day basis.

Go back to work full time.

Split the costs proportionally as you used to. Ask him which days he wants to be responsible for nursery drop offs/pick ups. Do not accept they are your responsibility you job is as important to your employer as his is to his.

You need to protect yourself financially. He has made his opinion clear. At the moment he is paying more into pensions etc whilst all the time you stay at home you start to lag behind.

Also did your employer really say they were discriminating due to your pregnancy by not putting you up for a promotion?

I would be very upset if my DH expected this arrangement.

We had separate finances until we got married. We then got a joint account and all income went into the one pot. At the time I earned x2 what he did, but only a year later we were earning the same (big pay cut for me), then a year later I went on maternity leave, then quit my job so I wasn't earning at all. Then I went back part time so that I could look after the children. DH now earns x3 what I do.

Throughout all these changing times, we have always had equal access to the household funds and have spent roughly about the same as each other.

Your DH needs to realise that you working part time to take care of the children is facilitating his career and that you deserve a share of the salary while you are looking after the children. If he is not willing to share his salary with you then I would go back to work FT and split the childcare costs & childcare duties. Actually I would consider LTB if he had so little respect for me.

hi nightandthelight

re your comment:-

"Have had a text:

'I give up, we can do what you want. We split our spare money right down the middle but keep our separate accounts, OK?"

Well that was nice of him - NOT. More passive aggressive bs from him.

He still does not want to understand the concept of family money and still wants to maintain far more power and control re the finances. It would not surprise me if he was to try and curtail your attempts to go back to work.

He has far more spare money than you have, I believe that you are still on maternity leave.

Just had another message, think he has realised the other one was passive aggressive. He is now saying sorry for being selfish, we are a team and what's mine is yours.

Hopefully having thought about it he has realised what I actually contribute!

Yep, passive aggressive bullshit.
It will do though.
You're supposed to bow down now and stop being silly.
Don't.
Agree it's a fair compromise that you want to share all money equally but he doesn't like the idea of a shared account.
So make sure your half is transferred.
Then rise above the petty comments - there'll be some. All more passive aggressive bullshit - expect him to want to deduct the cost of tampons from his share of the shopping or some such bullshit.
You can either ride that out by laughing or ignoring, or steel yourself to tell him that one more dig like that and it's counselling or bust.
Good luck love - but well done on holding firm and getting this - I know it's not been easy for you.

Crossed texts.
I'm glad you've had an apology.
The cynic in me says watch out that he's not buttering you up to immediately back track

Perhaps the apology is because by standing up for yourself and the logical and fair split, he's realised he can't actually just dictate to you.

Be on red alert to his attitude and financial movements though. And don't be scared of using a counsellor to help if this comes up again!

Thanks everyone, really helped me stand up for what was fair :)

Sounds like progress - albeit forced a little. It would be worth having a conversation about what is joint and what is separate for fun/personal money.

So if both wages go into joint account - £xx goes directly out for savings/direct debits/ allocated for less frequent bills. Cars/associated costs are also from the joint pot unless one is a mid life crisis toy groceries and child related things also from joint account ie clothes/nappies/playgroup coffee.

Then personal money for individual hobbies/after work drinks/nights out/gym classes etc.

Hopefully it was just selfishness and naivety about family life changes but don't get complacent - keep an eye on things and especially when the time comes to make decisions about returning to work full time or not.

No car is very much a sensible family one :)

I'm glad he's apologised, but you do need to keep talking about this - preferably face to face rather than by text. Make sure he genuinely means it and isn't going to sulk or go back on it.

Makes me so sad and cross when people are like this over shared money! I bet he'll be happy to benefit from you doing more of the running of the household, housework, childcare (including when DC are ill to save him taking time off work), admin etc etc. I'm a single working parent and I'd absolutely love to have a SAHP (or part-time working parent) to take on the lions share of stuff, leaving me free to work, come home, spend time with DS.

Glad you are standing up for yourself and that he apologised for the passive aggressive text. I agree with what someone else mentioned about making sure he does his fair share of parenting. Including taking DS off by himself so that he does actually get that it isn't all coffee shops and daytime TV!

If you do end up splitting "spare" money down the middle, do make sure you don't end up paying for all DS's activities, clothes etc from your half.

Another tip when calculating what's "spare" - is he paying into a pension?
Just be watchful for a list of things emerging that "don't count".

We both have work based pensions so the money comes out before we are paid.

Yes but as his salary is much higher than yours, he (and his employer) will be paying much more into his pension, which means he'll have a much bigger pension pot to draw on when he retires.

So paying into a pension for me?

he said that he is happy to have more disposable income than me as he earns more
I just don't get this. I would not want to live with a higher disposable income and standard of living than my husband! I just find that notion bizarre. We are equals and we both contribute what we can to make the family life that we enjoy together.