"But we took you to Stately Homes" - survivors of dysfunctional and toxic families

[pocketsaviour]

It's February 2016, and the Stately Home is still open to visitors.

Forerunning threads:
December 2007
March 2008
August 2008
February 2009
May 2009
January 2010
April 2010
August 2010
March 2011
November 2011
January 2012
November 2012
January 2013
March 2013
August 2013
December 2013
February 2014
April 2014
July 2014
Oct 14 – Dec 14
Dec 14 – March 15
March 2015 - Nov 2015
Nov 2015 - Feb 2016

Welcome to the Stately Homes Thread.

This is a long running thread which was originally started up by 'pages' see original thread here (December 2007)

So this thread originates from that thread and has become a safe haven for Adult children of abusive families.

The title refers to an original poster's family who claimed they could not have been abusive as they had taken her to plenty of Stately Homes during her childhood!

One thing you will never hear on this thread is that your abuse or experience was not that bad. You will never have your feelings minimised the way they were when you were a child, or now that you are an adult. To coin the phrase of a much respected past poster Ally90;

'Nobody can judge how sad your childhood made you, even if you wrote a novel on it, only you know that. I can well imagine any of us saying some of the seemingly trivial things our parents/ siblings did to us to many of our real life acquaintances and them not understanding why we were upset/ angry/ hurt etc. And that is why this thread is here. It's a safe place to vent our true feelings, validate our childhood/ lifetime experiences of being hurt/ angry etc by our parents behaviour and to get support for dealing with family in the here and now.'

Most new posters generally start off their posts by saying; but it wasn't that bad for me or my experience wasn't as awful as x,y or z's.

Some on here have been emotionally abused and/ or physically abused. Some are not sure what category (there doesn't have to be any) they fall into.

NONE of that matters. What matters is how 'YOU' felt growing up, how 'YOU' feel now and a chance to talk about how and why those childhood experiences and/ or current parental contact, has left you feeling damaged, falling apart from the inside out and stumbling around trying to find your sense of self-worth.

You might also find the following links and information useful, if you have come this far and are still not sure whether you belong here or not.

'Toxic Parents' by Susan Forward.

I started with this book and found it really useful.

Here are some excerpts:

"Once you get going, most toxic parents will counterattack. After all, if they had the capacity to listen, to hear, to be reasonable, to respect your feelings, and to promote your independence, they wouldn't be toxic parents. They will probably perceive your words as treacherous personal assaults. They will tend to fall back on the same tactics and defences that they have always used, only more so.

Remember, the important thing is not their reaction but your response. If you can stand fast in the face of your parents' fury, accusations, threats and guilt-peddling, you will experience your finest hour.

Here are some typical parental reactions to confrontation:

"It never happened". Parents who have used denial to avoid their own feelings of inadequacy or anxiety, will undoubtedly use it during confrontation, to promote their version of reality. They'll insist that your allegations never happened, or that you're exaggerating. They won't remember, or they will accuse you of lying.

YOUR RESPONSE: Just because you don't remember, doesn't mean it didn't happen".

"It was your fault." Toxic parents are almost never willing to accept responsibility for their destructive behaviour. Instead, they will blame you. They will say that you were bad, or that you were difficult. They will claim that they did the best that they could but that you always created problems for them. They will say that you drove them crazy. They will offer as proof, the fact that everybody in the family knew what a problem you were. They will offer up a laundry list of your alleged offences against them.

YOUR RESPONSE: "You can keep trying to make this my fault, but I'm not going to accept the responsibility for what you did to me, when I was a child".

"I said I was sorry what more do you want?" Some parents may acknowledge a few of the things that you say but be unwilling to do anything about it.

YOUR RESPONSE: "I appreciate your apology, but that is just a beginning. If you're truly sorry, you'll work through this with me, to make a better relationship."

"We did the best we could." Some parents will remind you of how tough they had it while you were growing up and how hard they struggled. They will say such things as "You'll never understand what I was going through," or "I did the best I could". This particular style of response will often stir up a lot of sympathy and compassion for your parents. This is understandable, but it makes it difficult for you to remain focused on what you need to say in your confrontation. The temptation is for you once again to put their needs ahead of your own. It is important that you be able to acknowledge their difficulties, without invalidating your own.

YOUR RESPONSE: "I understand that you had a hard time, and I'm sure that you didn't hurt me on purpose, but I need you to understand that the way you dealt with your problems really did hurt me"

"Look what we did for you." Many parents will attempt to counter your assertions by recalling the wonderful times you had as a child and the loving moments you and they shared. By focusing on the good things, they can avoid looking at the darker side of their behaviour. Parents will typically remind you of gifts they gave you, places they took you, sacrifices they made for you, and thoughtful things they did. They will say things like, "this is the thanks we get" or "nothing was ever enough for you."

YOUR RESPONSE: "I appreciate those things very much, but they didn't make up for ...."

"How can you do this to me?" Some parents act like martyrs. They'll collapse into tears, wring their hands, and express shock and disbelief at your "cruelty". They will act as if your confrontation has victimized them. They will accuse you of hurting them, or disappointing them. They will complain that they don't need this, they have enough problems. They will tell you that they are not strong enough or healthy enough to take this, that the heartache will kill them. Some of their sadness will, of course, be genuine. It is sad for parents to face their own shortcomings, to realise that they have caused their children significant pain. But their sadness can also be manipulative and controlling. It is their way of using guilt to try to make you back down from the confrontation.

YOUR RESPONSE: "I'm sorry you're upset. I'm sorry you're hurt. But I'm not willing to give up on this. I've been hurting for a long time, too."

Helpful Websites

Alice Miller
Personality Disorders definition
Daughters of narcissistic mothers
Out of the FOG
You carry the cure in your own heart
Help for adult children of child abuse
Pete Walker

Some books:

Toxic Parents by Susan Forward
Homecoming by John Bradshaw
Will I ever be good enough? by Karyl McBride
If you had controlling parents by Dan Neuharth
When you and your mother can't be friends by Victoria Segunda
Children of the self-absorbed by Nina Brown - check reviews on this, I didn't find it useful myself.
Recovery of your inner child by Lucia Capacchione

This final quote is from smithfield posting as therealsmithfield:

"I'm sure the other posters will be along shortly to add anything they feel I have left out. I personally don't claim to be sorted but I will say my head has become a helluva lot straighter since I started posting here. You will receive a lot of wisdom but above all else the insights and advice given will 'always' be delivered with warmth and support."

Hi greenleaf (I'm the OP, I changed my username!). One of the reasons I feel guilt is that since I went LC she has mostly been pleasant to me as I always have DH with me and I never visit their house or invite them to mine, I prefer to stick to public places as I know she would try to get me on my own. I haven't experienced a tantrum or silent treatment in so long I do wonder if she has changed and I'm being hard by not 'getting over' things. This makes me doubt my continued LC sometimes.

Hey I've read everyone's and nodded along. It's all so familiar, it kinda scares me!! I'm only 28 though but I think cause I had kids so young (first at 17) I grew up really quickly and saw how I wouldn't do to mine what she did etc although even now it's like you wait till she's a teenager you'll know. Whatever.

Had to say about toomuch saying you tied yourself in knots so she wouldn't have anything to criticise, exactly what I did then she threw at me that I try too hard time be perfect and I'd be happy if I let go a bit. Can't win!!!!!! But yeah I actually told her I'm happy when she is leaving me alone lol!

Big welcome to all the posters

Also noticed the absence of Atilla recently, hope she's ok xxxx

Try to hard to be perfect that should say x

And now I have my too and to mixed up. Yes as you can see, so perfect

Hello :) I've been pointed towards this thread, the my parents hate my OP is mine.

Not OP! OH!

helpme it was def when I saw my mother trying out her shite on my kids that I thought, right, out the door with you. It's a lot easier to see that it's abuse when they're doing it to someone else - I also sort of saw it as my job to deal with her. It's not, but the thought of passing that job onto my kids really focused my mind

Also wondering if Atilla is OK - maybe she's just letting us get on with it!

Debs don't feel guilty. You're in the reconciliation phase of the cycle of abuse, also known as "come closer so I can hurt you again".

Bumpk1n, hello! I saw your other thread. I think the advice you were getting on there to get into a flatshare was excellent advice. You may not have absorbed this 100% yet but you're escaping an extremely controlling environment and you need time to learn your own likes and dislikes and to learn to rely on yourself. If I were you, if your OH proposes soon, I would suggest a long engagement - going straight from the "care" of your parents to the security of marriage means you might never get the chance to learn how to cope on your own - and if you go into a marriage thinking you couldn't cope if it broke down, that puts you at a massive disadvantage compared to your OH.
Also you were saying on there about some comments your parents made, that they were unjustified comments, you didn't know what they were getting at - I think the penny is starting to drop for you but to spell it out, your parents do not have your best interests at heart. They don't say things to help you, they don't say things that are true - they say things that are likely to keep you confused and controlled, single, and at home with them.

Good Morning ladies. Anyone for a ? Oh, and bugger it, I think we can allow ourselves some for breakfast With narcs, there's an element of hypocrisy to a certain level. HelpMe, like you have just mentioned, your mum has said to stop trying so hard to please, yet she acted in ways that manipulated you (probably without you realising at the time) into try too hard to please her. I have noticed that a lot of narcs seem to do this. It could simply be because they want to you to stop trying to please others so that they have your undivided attention and use you for their own benefit. It's an abuse, use and lose tactic.

They abuse you (to keep you trying to please them), they use you (for their own benefit) and lose you (when they have gotten what they want out of you and you are of no further use to them). The key word with these people is manipulation. Sometimes it helps the person to separate the actions from the narc and ask yourself if those actions are out of character for the person, OR if they are not surprising coming from the narc. Looking at the narc's history will tell you everything you need to know. How they treated others (related/unrelated), if the narc was about to be exposed and how quickly they cut the person off etc. Simple things like these can help the victims see the bigger picture and make an informed decision regarding the best way forward (LC/NC or LC then NC).

I've also noticed that the wonderful Atilla hasn't been on here for a bit. She could be busy or ill, so I'll send out lots of love and support from us all on here................if that's OK with you good ladies?

BTW, for all you who think I'm new here, I was Chiggers, but I've name-changed as I got a bit bored of my NN It has been my NN for the longest period of time, so I though t it was time to think of another one. I saw my lovely staffy bitch lying upside down on the sofa and being a complete goofball, so I was inspired

Isn't it funny how we go through bad times emotionally, yet something random happens that makes us chuckle and think "Hehehe, that's a good'un. Must remember that". It's those little funny things we keep in mind that we can recall when times get tough.

When going NC or LC, the narc will step up their campaign to get you back into your role as scapegoat. They can resort to all sorts because the more you distance yourself from them, the more chance they have of being exposed by the victim. They tend to use 2 tactics. Either the abovementioned role so you don't say anything to damage their facade, or to completely slate you to others (as a parting shot IYSWIM) and cut you off. The parting shot and cut-off tactic means they can 'brainwash' people into thinking you're the bad guy, the narc is hard done to, and that they stop talking to you. All are tactics to try and avoid exposure, and ultimately, shame and embarrassment for the narc.

All in all, narcs are drama-loving, attention seeking, nasty, spiteful, illness-feigning-victim-blaming, insecure, self-loathing, deceitful, co-dependent, jealous changelings.

I say co-dependent because they need us more than we actually need them.

DebRocks, you're right to keep to public places and DH being there when meeting up with your narc. That way there are witnesses if they kick off. As I've mentioned before, the decent people will talk to you and your mum to get both sides of the story before making a judgement. If they judge you purely based on what your mum has told them, then you needn't bother with them until they see sense and get both sides of the story.

ANyway, I'll stop waffling on and get some bit done that I need to do.

I'm sure Atilla will show up again at some point

Nice new name UpsidedownDog. I did think when reading the most that the style (and all the food!) reminded me of Chiggers :)
Thanks for the replies earlier. It's interesting isn't it, when others share their stories most of us really relate and nod, and it seems obvious that the situation is not normal. But when it happens to us, when our own mothers are messing up with our heads, suddenly things seem so much more confusing! UpsidedownDog (can I call you Dog?) you mentioned how difficult it is to sometimes see through the narc as a lot of the behaviour happens in private; it would be great to be able to get a neutral third party to analyse the situation! But even then, even if such an outsider third party did weigh in and they told the narc that objectively their behaviour is not right, it would never sink in, would it? The narc would just find excuses, become a mega victim etc. It's hopeless trying to demonstrate they are ever wrong! Otherwise, "Narcissistic Mother Interventions" would be a thing, wouldn't they? :) I think a lot of you on the forum have come a long way to see your situations clearly, so hats off to that..

Toomuchtooold, wise words. I think you are spot on about one of the questions being wether my mother would suffer if we went NC. Her telling me she is suffering because of me is one thing, her actually being sad about it is another.. Good way of looking at it. Good job to you on having found the strength to go NC, it sounds like you are coping really well about it. I'd never heard of grey rocking before, interesting concept. Did you not get criticism after a while for being unresponsive and lacking conversation? Basically the opposite of what helpme was saying but with the same result: if you do too much you get sh1t for being too perfect, if you do too little you get sh1t for not doing enough, there is no winning!

Debs, your parents sound hard work! And completely undermining and lacking respect for you. If a friend would always order you to call them by text rather than call you directly, you would not put up with it, would you? And this constant need to tell you everything that you did wrong, gaaaaah it's just so abusive. And the facts that date back to days or months ago are suddenly brought forward, it's so manipulative ("see, I have been suffering for all this time, all in silence, because of you"). I hope meeting them tomorrow goes ok - given it will be in public, am sure it will go fine. Just remember to stay super strong and completely immunity to any BS..

Anyway, have a good rest of week end everyone. x

The title refers to an original poster's family who claimed they could not have been abusive as they had taken her to plenty of Stately Homes during her childhood!

Mine was, you went to Brownies....as evidence she did things for me as a child.

hi upsidedowndog

How nice of you to think of me😀

I have been on holiday for the past week in the USA and am at present sitting in the gate area waiting for the flight back to the UK.

WIll read the recent messages and further comment in a couple of days when I have properly got over the jet lag.

A x

Atilla hello! I forgot you were going on holiday. Hope you had a lovely time

MissZ re. whether your mother would suffer if you went NC, I just thought - it's like any other unhealthy dependency (alcohol or drugs or so). You wouldn't buy drugs for an addict... even if you knew they would never stop taking drugs, you wouldn't feel obliged to feed their addiction. And doubly so if you had to make your own life a misery to supply them.
It's funny but no, I never got any criticism for grey rocking. She watched me carefully for any signs of life/weakness that she could exploit, but she never openly criticised my lack of communication. I think generally as they are very self absorbed, they don't think much about your motivations - so if you just gradually make yourself more boring, she'll just lose interest a little.
Where I found it really hard was when my kids came along. You can't grey rock in front of a child, they need you to be real.

Greenleaf - re Jane Goodall - have you seen the Action Movie apps? DH and I have had some great times videoing short clips of his parents and then calling in ballistic missile strikes on them

Hi everyone, lurker here - just posting to say how much memyself's post resonated, especially the little "chats" - just thinking about them makes me feel sick. I've had plenty over the years. I really relate to that bruised feeling you get afterwards. Bloody awful. I've hated conflict ever since.

Interestingly, after a period of recent family contact I've realised I've been doing the grey rock thing, without realising it was a thing. I give no info on my feelings about anything, entertain no discussion of Xh, close any bitching down and it's interesting that there's nothing else they want to talk about. Not my job, friends, dp, holidays etc.

I'll post more under a special name change. Been outed on here before by family and still terrified of it happening again.

I've had to take a few days off from posting, the realisation from my posts that I'm still in the FOG has hit me really hard.

I've also got a lot on my plate with my own marriage, it's been a struggle since we had DD and I've very much lost mu libido which has left DH to think that I like the idea of him but don't want him and that I'm just with him because I want to be with someone not necessarily him though. He couldn't be more wrong I deeply love him and deeply love him. I've never been an affectionate person and since DD has been born I've battled with mu very real worry that I'd turn into my mother and also with my mother doing everything possible to discredit me as a parent and my parenting ability so I've probably not paid as much attention to DH as I could and should have.

Aside from that it's looking like my mother is going to lose her home and I'm really scared that I won't have the strength to tell her she can't live with me. I don't have a good excuse as we have a spare bedroom and she's already tested the waters and I said to her I wouldn't take her and all her various animals in (over 8) so of course she's told various people how awful I am that I would see her homeless even though I have a spare room.

I couldn't live with her again I fear for my mental health if I did but I'm feeling that I'm being set up that I have no choice but to take her in when the inevitable happens.

She's of course blaming my father for leaving as the reason she's losing her home but in reality they've been up their eyeballs in debt for years, her in particular is terrible with money and she has refused to work for around 10 years with no valid reason she just refused, in the last two years she's done some part time work that pays a pittance but gives her alot of power over people and so for the reason of the power she won't get a reality check and work full time.

I think I've posted alot that may out me so I'll keep this username for posting on here and then nc for posting elsewhere in the forum to give me a bit or protection in case someone searches my username

ncpg53 I think that self questioning, ie, wondering about, have you given up as much of yourself as you can - or would you be able to give more ?- is very much the O out of FOG - children of Narcs have been trained to give up reasonable boundaries in favour of the narcs needs..
Yes you have a spare room - and you see people who would give this up for their mother - but what you don’t see is people who would give up their mental well-being for their mother - and moving her in with you is this for you.
You need to be very wary of allowing a Disney picture of how some families operate dictate where you put your boundaries.
Or judging yourself against standards that functional families might be comfortable with.
Do not repeat in your head that this is inevitable, step back, let her be the adult she is and solve her own problems - you probably have years ahead of solving those she has already gifted to you.

I dont really know about your libido? its complex and easy to make assumptions,
firstly..its always worth a pop to the doctors to get your hormone levels checked
after that have you considered that out of fear you might be closing down communication - the old - "coping with everything and not sharing" - is a habit well worth breaking

The fear that comes from being the unsupported child, the one that that causes us to be capable and independent, and always beating ourselves up to be perfect - so people will like us - actually can distance us from intimate relationships - sometimes just giving that up and asking someone else, like your husband, to be strong for you when you need it, can be hugely empowering for both of you.

You don't have to have her live with you, even if she does become homeless, you really really don't. It's not inevitable, I know it feels like that, but it's not. She's an adult, she has made her life choices, you don't have to pick up the pieces. I totally understand the crushing sense that you can't refuse her and the terror that you feel you can't refuse her, that it's inevitable, I've been there and ended up living with my narc mother (really unnecessarily as it turned out in the end but it felt unstoppable and inevitable at the time) and it was awful. I should never have let it happen, but it felt almost like if that's what she wanted, then that's what had to be, my needs were non-existent. Almost co-dependent really.
You don't need to explain either, just say (and keep repeating) "that doesn't work for me", "it's not possible" and so on.
Your post really struck a chord with me, I know how hard it is to say no.

Hello everyone. Hope you're all ok. to those who're struggling at the moment.

Sorry to leap back on, things are just playing on my mind a little and I need to sound off.

We had a pretty rubbish easter wrt my M. After all the shocking abuse she gave us and all the horrid things she said, she sent me a message on easter saturday demanding that dh go and get the children's easter eggs because she'd been so ill she couldn't drop them off.

Not me though. Dh. Why dh when she was only too happy to call him a cunt a few weeks ago?
(I must say, he is pretty fantastic and doesn't even bat an eye when she gives him shit but that's not the point is it? The point is it doesn't make sense that she would then ask for him to go round.)
Perhaps it's another controlling tactic of hers?

I know what she's playing at with the illness comment, looking for sympathy, hoping I'd ask her what was wrong or how she is. I can proudly say that I didn't respond. At all. I ignored her. But it left me quaking in my boots all holiday about her coming round and knocking the door with the dc here. They would see her instantly because our front door opens directly into the lounge and that would upset them (they haven't seen her now for ages)
All weekend I felt like I couldn't let them go in there. Every door knock or bell ring I was on edge, sneaking a look round the corner to make sure it wasn't her. That's not normal and I realise it's not good for the dc to see me that worried. I want our house to feel safe but when it obviously doesn't feel safe to me, it won't to them will it? Dh told me to shut the curtains if it made me feel better but I don't want the house to feel like a fortress fgs! I shouldn't have to block the world out.
She drives past as well, when she really doesn't have to. We do live on a main road but it's way out of her way to come past here. There's nothing that she would go to that's this way iyswim.

It's also my sons birthday this Sunday and my daughters next Sunday. I'm dreading the weekend and the build up to it. I know she will start again. And it makes me very nervous all over again.

I'm another long time lurker who wanted to join in.

I have come, through group psychotherapy, to realise that I am a family scapegoat due to my controlling mother's issues. This has affected my mental health as well in romantic relationships, and been in many ways the root cause of bullying within friendships and at work due to being caught in a cycle of being treated badly/blamed for things and a sense of not really fitting in. This is something I am currently working very hard to tackle, but it is proving difficult.

whirlygirly and memyself thank you for your posts, I wanted to second the points about the little 'chats'. I used to have them given to me, largely by my mother, about the various misdeeds, bad behaviour I had exhibited when visiting family and friends of their's on the car on the way home, and constantly as a teenager.

I was just expected to accept them, and not be at all angry or upset that they were being ridiculously harsh. The odd thing is they now sneer about how timid and unconfident I was and how I wasn't opinionated, didn't have any friends and complain that I didn't prepare them for my sisters being teenagers as I didn't rebel at all. This is however, an exageration. I was a far more normal teenager than they really realised.

I argued against the fact they they did this to me but not my sisters, but they claimed they did, just not when I was there. I beleived them for a long while but now just feel quite angry that they lied to me when I pulled them up on their behaviour.

I have a pretty shit relationship with my sister who is requesting we meet up for lunch soon. I am torn between gritting my teeth and bearing it to keep them off my back for a while and just very nervous about how it will go. Meeting up with her alone in the past has either been fine and quite nice, or just an excuse for her to snap at me about how terrible I am to our mother. There is little pattern to this that I can see.

665 and good thank you for your replies, you have both hit a nerve with me.

I know I need to say to my mother that her moving in with us doesn't work and cut down the conversation. I'm going to have to talk to DH and make sure he backs me on this strategy and just not engage any further. I can foresee the next request being for money which will also be refused. I loaned her sum that was in the thousands years ago to bail her out of another mess, she made two installments and then never mentioned it. So I wrote it off as a learning experience and have since refused all further requests for financial help.

I know that not only would my mental health suffer if she moved in but my relationship with H would also. I can't relax around my mother and her utter lack of respect for my rules and boundaries would make life hell. It just can't happen. And you are both right I am not responsible for her or her actions and it is not my job to clean up her mistakes.

I've been severally anemic since I was pregnant and it hasn't corrected itself since I had DD so I'm currently under investigation by my the doctor as to the reason why, I'm perpetually tired due to it ao I'm sure that has some part to play in the loss of my libido. But I do need to try make more time for H and I to just be a married couple and a little time off from being parents even just to do something simple like go to the movies or for a meal without DD. I don't have much in the way of family support and DH family live several hours away so it's hard to find a sitter for DD. We've both gone into parent mode I think I've forgotten how to be ME at times

I've never spoken to a doctor or any professional about my childhood usually out of fear of not being believed. That's also my parents fault I remember once after taking a beating with a belt threatening to ring childline and reporting them and my mother sneered and handed me the telephone telling me to go ahead nobody would believe me anyway. I of course didn't ring. I did several times dial the number from a phone box but couldn't ever follow through. If only I had.

Recently my mother has been telling anyone who will listen how my father is EA to her. It's not true, perhaps in her head it is but I know that they are both equally vile to each other and have always been. She commented that he's only been like this recently. When I told her had always been like this only she ignored it because his abuse and his fists were trained on my sister and I. My mother again sneered and laughed and told me I was talking rubbish and it didn't happen.

I cut the call short I wasn't prepared to listen to deny my childhood again.

Has anyone ever sought professional help in order to deal with their childhood abuse? Has it helped you move forward or come to terms with it?

I don't know why but since I had DD it's all been very much at the front on my mind even things I had buried deep

Hi ncpg, sorry you are having a tough time and are dealing with an awful family background. If it's comfortable to share, how old roughly is your DD? I remember the first 6 months after the birth of our DS were really really tough on my relationship with DH. And I had very little interest in intimacy.. Somehow, slowly, time helped, as did getting more sleep as the baby settled into a proper routine and full nights of sleep. Of course it also took a lot of communication between us, an awareness of the issue etc. But when you are sleep deprived, with very little family around to help, have leaking boobs from BF, and learning to get to grips with motherhood, things are bound to be different for a while!
I completely agree with the importance of avoiding your mother staying over. I completely also get how difficult this is to achieve. You have to think of your sanity and your family first, please do not compromise! You worry a lot abour your mum and your DH, don't forget to make sure you are ok first and foremost.
As to seeking professional help to deal with bat shit crazy mother: I did it 5+ years ago and it was incredibly helpful to get a therapist 's opinion on the situation and to really talk it through. It helped me understand what was going on. It was all ok until my DS was born, somehow becoming a mother has opened new dimensions in my head - and putting up with her and just understand it is not enough. I am going back to my therapist this week to work on what to actually do about it. Considering going NC but need help there..
Anyhow, be strong, and don't give in!! X

I've considered nc too but like you need help to get to that point. I think for me seeking out therapy would probably be the first big step.

DD recently turned 1, she's a gorgeous little thing but until very recently she didn't sleep through the night and wouldn't sleep longer than 2 hour stretches, things are much better now she is sleeping through but it's been such a long process to get there.

I've had my mother tell me so many times that I should let DD cry it out but I couldn't my heart breaks if she cries for anything and I don't ever want her to think as I did as a child that there's no point in crying because nobody cars enough to come anyway. I need her to know that I will always be there if she needs me. I will not parent like my parents and I will not be mother and despite my mother saying otherwise I do actually think I'm a fantastic mum.

It's funny how having our own children seems to be a sort of trigger. I wonder if that's because we have this awful moment of realisation that we could never ever treat this tiny precious person as we have been treated and our brain struggles to understand how anyone could do it let alone the two people who are supposed to love, support and care for you?

Hello everyone. I pop in regularly but struggle to keep up with posts. I wondered if anyone can relate to this: I was abused by my brother and my parents failed to protect me. They excused him. I was basically perceived as a pain for daring to complain about his treatment of me. My mother is a narcissist, my father her very passionate enabler. Previous information for context. I found growing up that the extended family seemed to treat us the same way. Eg) brother was my grandmother and aunt's favourite. They would take him on days out on which I wasn't invited. If there was ever trouble between the cousins, my grandmother would accuse and blame me. There was a recent incident which involved me having to make contact with my aunt and I've been ignored completely. I have been very LC with my parents so that may be why. However my mother described to me how my brother (with whom I'm NC) had also been in touch with aunt and had a lovely written response. It's stirred up a lot of upsetting thoughts and feelings for me and shaken the confidence that was so hard to build. What I'm asking is if anyone on here found, or finds that the extended family treat/ed them the same way as parents - like they've picked up on your assigned role?

Yes cherryblossom. My sister treats me the same as my mother now and has done for years.

I am distancing myself as a couple of her dc are old enough to pick up on it.

Hello everyone. I haven't been around much recently and I'm sorry.

Lots of new people on the thread, welcome.

To everyone thinking about going NC or trying to be more LC and wondering if a counsellor/therapist would help: yes, it will.

Have a look via the BACP website where you can search by area and specialism. I would just pick "abuse" as the reason for counselling.

Read through the descriptions, and email several people who you like the look of. Ask them what type of approach they use, what their experience is in dealing with narcissist/abusive parents, and what is their opinion on keeping contact with abusive family members. You are looking here for someone who has no bias in trying to push you to "reconciliation" (otherwise known as shut your face and keep eating shit and maybe your family might give you a few crumbs of affection along with all the shit they keep shovelling your way.)

Give the ones who seem good a call, ask them about their fee structure (some will do sliding scale fees if you're on a low income.) Ask if you can book a short "interview" session for a reduced fee to see if you get on.

Basically, choosing a therapist is like choosing a job or a house: you need to look at several options before selecting one that suits you best. Or as Atilla has often put it: a therapist is like a pair of shoes - you have to find one who fits!

With an objective, professional therapist on hand to help you sort through your feelings and learn about boundaries (most children of narcs have no idea how to set boundaries since we were repeatedly told that we weren't allowed them) you may find the strength and support to go completely NC, or develop coping strategies if there are circumstances where you have to have any contact.

to everyone.