If your father left you to die [Trigger warning for addiction/alcoholism added by MNHQ]

[WildeWoman]

By leaving you to die, I mean 'she's an alcoholic, what can you do'.

And you later found out that he may have been complicit in welfare fraud..........

Would you report him?

Humpty - I have CHOSEN, possibly twenty times to 'get help'. Has it helped? No.

So - did I choose not to be helped?
Or
Did the 'help' NOT FUCKING WORK.

I have tried to avoid referring any further to my brother, a professor of medicine, but here is one of his last sentences to me last night 'I believe the only alcoholics who have been cured were not true alcoholics to start with for its an incurable disease that changes the mind and brain irrevocably in my opinion.'

No, you chose to pick up the bottle. Any help you get won't do that for you.

I'd like to see you argue with him. As the brother of an alcoholic and a professor of medicine.

It's easy to disparage me. I'm an easy target.

I'd like to see a web discussion with a psychiatrist specialising in addiction on here. Might actually help somebody.

Multi, you'll probably find your friends & brother describe themselves as alcoholics. It's generally understood that you can't choose not to be an addict, once addicted. By the time you find out, you're stuck with it.

You will always be an alcoholic.

It will always be something you have to manage and live with IMO.

What you do have power over is whether you are an alcoholic who is sober or an alcoholic who is drunk.

You may need to chose sobriety several times after relapsing etc

No-one is saying you can magic away your addiction or that sobriety is easy.

People are saying that no-one but you can stop you picking up a drink.

You are killing yourself, Wilde. and it doesn't seem to me that you are being particularly brave about it.

Psychiatrists specialising in addiction certainly understand it better than a bunch of hurt & angry people having a go at an addict

As I'm sure you're aware, however, they also understand the hurt & angry people. And tend not to pull their punches!

I was a bulimic for 15 years. Vomited something between 5 and 20 times a day. I think I know something about addiction.

I had help. But I only stopped when I decided 'this stops now and here'. And even though I wanted to vomit very badly, I didn't.

But you seem very keen to justify to yourself and others that you are an alcoholic, so there's nothing you can do about it and you simply CAN'T STOP DRINKING.

And you wonder why some people may not want to be in touch with you?

I believe the only alcoholics who have been cured were not true alcoholics to start with for its an incurable disease that changes the mind and brain irrevocably in my opinion.

Key words are I believe and in my opinion

Not actual medical evidence.

All of which is enabling you to minimise your own behaviour.

WildeWoman

I'm an alcoholic (in recovery)

We ALWAYS have a choice.
I choose not to drink.
It might not always be easy but it is always, every fucking time, without exception, that simple.

The sooner you take responsibility for your recovery, the better.
There is loads of help out there.... You should use it.

My heart goes out to all the PPs who have gone through pain because of another's addictions.

Well you should be proud of yourself then...your a true alcoholic that can't be help more like doesnt fucking want to be and your brother is totally right even tho god knows how many have proved him wrong
so what else is it you want?

And I call bullshit on the help not working.

It's simply not true.
I really hope you get better.... You certainly won't get better until you get honest.

Complete bull shit if he's spouting crap like that I am pissed

Ah.

So your brother enables you and your father doesn't.

There's a surprise.

I'm betting that if your father did step in and help you out that you would have continued drinking anyway. How many times should your family intervene before you stop and actually take responsibility for yourself. After reading the thread through I can completely understand why your family have retreated. I had to do the same with my mother. There's only so much people can take.

Wilde I really hope you are able to be a good role model to your daughter. Does she live with you?
Is she proud of you? What sort of life does she have? Does she worry about you at all?

Does she help you when you are drunk? Mop up your sick and wee? Are you there for her emotionally and physically? Do you take her to any after school ctivities? Are you interested in her?

Do you like the larger than life character you are when drunk? Does she?

What do you think you could do to ensure she has a great life? Or are you intending on making her life a car crash too?

WAKE UP op. Don't you want to be a recovering alcoholic? Start today. You are not as weak as you make out. You are intelligent and articulate. You have given up on yourself and those closest to you have too, by the sound of it.

But guess what op, there is a spark there somewhere, a stubbornness which is the chrysalis that you need to change. If you let it.

Or you can go to your grave feeling sorry for yourself.

Surprisingly op, you are using your alcoholism a bit like a crutch so you don't have to change. It's almost like you revel in your status of being one.

Can't change won't change.

Anyway, op, you are human which gives you CHOICE. May be your brain is damaged beyond repair which makes you enjoy the mean, vindictive side to your personality.

You've nothing to lose. Why not say no to alcohol today and see how you get on?

I'm glad you have your brother for support.

But I'm married to an academic and work with them. The big thing I hear over and over again is that the more they find out, the more questions they have - so much about the body and the brain is unknown. They rewrite biology books every few years because of this.

Your brother's too close to the situation to be objective, his "professional" opinion isn't necessarily true, and the only person who can "make" you recover is you.

That must be horribly hard and I don't blame you for feeling self-pity, but feeling sorry for yourself can only take you so far.

Meanwhile your remarks about cancer and dementia do not seem to demonstrate pity or undertaking for others, which makes it harder for them to return the favour.

All of which goes a long way from your OP. Has your dad replied yet?

I have an alcoholic in my family.

Before I knew she was an alcoholic I let her babysit my 1 year old. I didn't ask, she offered.

She got shitfaced and nearly burned the house down. I came home to her passed out and the living room carpet on fire.

She didn't choose to be an alcoholic but she did choose to put a tiny baby in danger.

OP I hope you get the help you need.

Bloody hell coughed I'm glad your little one was OK

How the hell do you know it's like cancer, is it fuck!!

My Dad died of cancer and he didn't choose cancer or to make us suffer. He tried to put on a brave face and if at any point he was given a choice to get better he would have taken it.

My mother's an alcoholic and she chooses to drink. We all suffer due to that and she worries us sick. She never touched a drop in her life for roughly 35 years, she got with a man who introduced her to it and eventually she depended on it. She chooses to drink. My Dad didn't choose to die. He had no say in the matter. As a person who's seen it from both sides I'd say your delusional!

Mumsnet you should remove this thread. OP I wish you well in your recovery. But please stop posting such utter bullshit. My brother is a heroin addict, he also believed he was a victim of an illness and has been thar way for about 25 years. My niece was a heroin addict. She took control and got better because she understood she had a choice.. She's been clean for about 15 years and I know she will never relapse. You can be a victim or you can take control.

I'm sorry that your brother appears to be enabling you. That is definitely not the sort of help you need.

For you to keep repeating that it is not possible for an alcoholic to stop, is to insult all those people who worked bloody hard to do just that.

Yes, I am an alcoholic.....who hasn't touched a drink for twenty nine years, five months and one day and twenty three hours.

Thanks Sunnybitch, DD never knew a thing, we got home just in time.

"My" alcoholic has been sober for 4 years, is married and a mother herself now. She struggles every day but every day she wins. :)

Rosyglow