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Mumsnet has not checked the qualifications of anyone posting here. If you need help urgently or expert advice, please see our domestic violence webguide and/or relationships webguide. Many Mumsnetters experiencing domestic abuse have found this thread helpful: Listen up, everybody

Original poster

uh-oh I feel trouble brewing...

122 replies

poppiesinalinewithtinsel · 03/12/2006 13:09

At a family do 3 years ago my BIL (my sisters husband) who doesnt 'do' children lost his temper with my DS1 (who was 6 at the time) and picked him up by his throat and threw his across the room. Neither DH or myself witnessed this but found DS1 crying in a corner a few moments later with red marks around his throat By the time we managed to ascertain what had happened BIL had gone.

I telephoned my sister the next day to talk to her about it (I was on the phone for 1 1/2 hours to her) and basically she said that it was DS1's fault because he shouldnt have wound BIL up. WTF!!? I put my view across very plainly and ended up saying that we would have to agree to disagree as I didnt want to fall out with her about it.

We havent seen my BIL since. I have seen my sister. He doesnt normally come to any family do's because he doesnt like being around people.

Anyway, I seem to have landed with hosting Christmas afternoon with the family round my house. I assumed BIL would not come as per usual which is fine by us.

Sister has announced that yes, he will be coming.

DH says he is still waiting for his apology. This could be a very interesting Christmas afternoon.

OP posts:
madmarchhare · 03/12/2006 15:25

Forget the fall out, do you really want this man near your son?

Original poster
poppiesinalinewithtinsel · 03/12/2006 15:31

You are right. People are scared of him and do walk on eggshells around him. You are right. He is a bully.

DS1 doesnt remember him or the incident.

DD doesnt remember him

DS2 has never met him!

Since that very long conversation with my sister on the telephone the day after it happened, it has never been mentioned. It has become one of those family 'taboo' subjects. To barr him from my house would be dragging it all up again.

I am in a lose/lose situation.

OP posts:
madmarchhare · 03/12/2006 15:34

It is a pig of a situation if it means it will all kick off. Who else is supposed to be coming? Could you change the plans?

Original poster
poppiesinalinewithtinsel · 03/12/2006 15:39

The whole family. Its the only time we all get together. And my mum and dad are travelling 250 miles to be with all their children, spouses and grandchildren. I'm hosting because I have the biggest downstairs space (I live in an extended 3 bed semi before you all think I am rich and live in a mansion! LOL)

My other sister is having mum and dad stay with them. I offered to host the afternoon to take the strain off my sister a bit. Regardless of where we go he will still be there. At least in my house, its my rules, so I will have that upper hand so to speak. And at least the kids can disappear upstairs into their bedrooms.

OP posts:
JustUsTwo · 03/12/2006 15:41

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

JustUsTwo · 03/12/2006 15:43

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

HumphreyCushiONtheFirstNoel · 03/12/2006 15:44

What a difficult situation for you, poppiesinaline.
I had a long think about what I would do in your situation.
I considered being charitable at Christmas; that you obviously love your sister, and don't want to get into a row; that you could ensure your son is never alone with your BIL.
But I know, deep down, that I couldn't go through with it; I just couldn't let an adult who had behaved so aggressively towards my child into my house ever again.
And if this meant my sister supported him and didn't come either, then that would have to be the way it was.
You shouldn't have been put in this situation, IMO - I can't believe he's got the nerve to assume he's invited.
I think your DH has been very restrained. You all certainly deserve an apology - but I still wouldn't let BIL anywhere near the house.

Original poster
poppiesinalinewithtinsel · 03/12/2006 15:45

ok ok I get the point.

OP posts:
Original poster
poppiesinalinewithtinsel · 03/12/2006 15:46
OP posts:
madmarchhare · 03/12/2006 15:46

Can you talk to your mum about it? This man has physically assalted two of her granchildren, surely she doesnt think its acceptable to brush it under the carpet.

I really would seriously consider backtracking your offer.

SherlockLGJ · 03/12/2006 15:47

Cold day in hell,before he would set foot in my house. TBH

HumphreyCushiONtheFirstNoel · 03/12/2006 15:47

Oh poppies....
I know it's awful, but think of the relief when you know you've said your piece.

DoesntChristmasDragOn · 03/12/2006 15:48

Given that your DS does not remember him and you (and your other sister) are aware of what he is like, you can ensure your children's safety in your own home. I think given those particular circumstances I would go ahead with allowing him to attend. I would seriously think about warning your sister and him that if he touches or threatens any child in any way, you will call the police.

It's a one off occasion (Christmas, not the original incident). I wouldn't be retarting any regular contact with this man though.

Steppy1 · 03/12/2006 15:48

...do you think that he's physically abused his own children and, as he's never been reproached by your sister. thinks that it's acceptable to behave this way with other 'family members" ???

You have to put a stop to this NOW....if you all pretend that it hasn't happened or brush it under the carpet it WILL blow up in your face. Think of YOUR children and what the worst case scenario could be (especially after a few festive drinks) is it really worth the risk for the sake of keeping the peace and that "life is too short"...

good luck with your decision, you know that you'll be damned if you do and damned if you don't, but your childrens welfare must come first.....

wakeupandsmellthecoffee · 03/12/2006 15:50

please tell me hes not welcome .

Original poster
poppiesinalinewithtinsel · 03/12/2006 15:52
OP posts:
Original poster
poppiesinalinewithtinsel · 03/12/2006 15:54

would I be a real coward if I spoke to my mum who could then speak to my sister?

poppies doesnt want to make that phonecall.

OP posts:
DoesntChristmasDragOn · 03/12/2006 15:55

I don't think you'd be coward but I don't htink that's fair on your mum.

lulumama · 03/12/2006 15:56

poppies....focus on how strong you will feel when you have made that call...you are protecting your babies.........everything else is secondary to that.......attilla;s post hit the nail on the head...the home is the sanctuary...your children have an inviolable right to feel safe in their own home

and if he does come, and DH & he argue..or it kicks off, in front of the kids..that will be a horrible thing for them to witness...

DonnerDasherDancerDior · 03/12/2006 15:57

Poppies - horrible situation . I have to say though that he would not be stepping foot in my house if he had done that to my ds, sorry.

lulumama · 03/12/2006 15:57

no..you must speak to your sister.....

JustUsTwo · 03/12/2006 15:59

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

Original poster
poppiesinalinewithtinsel · 03/12/2006 16:01

Gosh you lot are tough cookies!

OP posts:
SantasFattymumma · 03/12/2006 16:03

I would imagine that with you and your DH in attaendance your son would be pretty safe but i would certainly speak to yrou sister and explain that you are still unhappy with his behaviour that time and that he should consider himself very lucky not to be sat in a prison cell (if it were my son he would be 6ft under by now tbh)

explain that it is christmas and you do not wish to ruin it for everyone by causing a scene but that if he feels anyone is gettig to him or he feels hmself getting wound up he is to leave immediatley as otherwise you will call the police.

he sounds like a vile vile man and i would hate every minute of him being in my home. i can understand why you feel he needs to be there and that deep down you would rather he wasn't.

you know your family dynamics, if its not possible to exclude him then try and make sure he knows the boundaries...and stick to them

jabberwocky · 03/12/2006 16:10

Do you honestly believe that your ds doesn't remember it? Infantile amnesia ends at 3 you know. Of course, he could have a post-traumatic block, but that would be even scarier than the more reasonable answer which is that he does indeed remember and chooses not to talk about it.