Anger management issues

[Floflo10]

Hi, My husband and I been married 9 years fairly happily and we have a full on 7 yr old and a 4 yr old. Over the years when we've argued he has a habit of massively over reacting and swearing at me/out loud a lot. Or called me names if I done something daft (leaving hose pipe filling paddling pool for 9 hrs and leaving on Emersion heater). He will get so cross, not leave me alone, berate me and generally be unreasonably angry with me. He gets angry where he will smash his hands in doors/work tops, yell, shout swear words. He won't quieten down for the kids and will wake them. I hate them hearing shouting and swear words. It's not how I wanted my children brought up.

Last night he went out drinking 3-9pm. Got a taxi home and left the iPad in the taxi. He got in, clocked what he had done and started going mad. I was tired and quietly watching tv. He started shouting every s, f and c word SO loudly. Stomping around the house. Woke my children who were worried about the noise too. Refused to quiten down. He wanted to drive to taxi rank but I hid his keys as he was obviously over the limit. I eventually put on my clothes and went to train station/rank. Drunks were around and I was asking all the taxi drivers if they had dropped him off. I felt really vulnerable so decided to go home. I stopped down the road as I was scared he would shout again or ask for car keys. I made him get a taxi back and then I went back in the house to bed. He eventually came home and i made him sleep on the sofa.
I was shaking and crying telling him to stop yelling. He even went out the front garden and was yelling. I'm so ashamed of him. The neighbors undoubtedly heard him. My point is that he can't control his anger. He has shoved me on the very rare occasion and I don't think he would ever hurt me but I get scared of him being uncontrollable with anger. He has been on a brief stress management course but they obviously didn't help much.
I didn't want to talk to friends as I'm so ashamed of him. I'm really shook up by the whole situation too.
Should I just man up? I've told him how I feel. He feels awful and ashamed. To be honest it's the same thing every time. Regret and upset and then it happens again.
I'm not sure how to get my feeling across to him that this has to change because talking certainly hasn't helped so far.
I'm So sorry for essay. This is my first time on mumsnet in years. I've just hit rock bottom with him this time. I'm just looking for advice really. X

Hi OP - Sorry you are living with a man child

I just wanted to chime in and agree with several other posters who highlighted the effect this will be having on your children,

I lived with domestic violence throughout my childhood. My mother regularly flew into terrifying rages and would shout and scream the place down in the early hours of the morning. My father was petrified of her. Any little thing, any perceived slight would set her off and she'd rage for hours. As their relationship deteriorated she became violent. I believe this was partly due to my Father being passive and allowing himself to be a verbal punching bag so she upped the ante and made him a physical one too.

I saw and heard a lot more than my parents ever thought I did. They assumed me and my siblings were tucked up in bed and didn't hear a thing. We heard it all.

The impact it has had on my life has been profound. I struggle with intimacy, I am afraid of forming close personal relationships, I immensely dislike loud noises and shouting.

I was never physically abused but am virtually no contact with both parents. The emotional damage went too deep.

Think and tread very carefully OP. It won't stop here. He can control him temper around you but he doesn't want to. He doesn't care about intimidating and frightening you or his children. He wants a reaction.

Don't give it to him. I dislike the term flung about willy nilly on these threads but this is my first ever LTB

Hi OP,

Just to clarify, my XH never hit me, but the hurt was everywhere and by 'not feeling safe' in the counselling session, I meant that the therapy room was not a safe sanctuary for my feelings. I'd wanted a safe place and there wasn't one.

And I really wouldn't feel the need to 'warn' him about anything that might happen in your Relate session, if indeed you do decide to go. He's a grown-up. He can Google stuff can't he?

Your last paragraph in your most recent post is an almost exact portrait of my XH. Being accused of things they are guilty of is the most ridiculous double standard, I nearly felt like laughing. Except it had gone way past funny at that stage. The unfairness is ludicrous, but terrifying at the same time - looking back it was like living in a hall of mirrors.

I really feel for you OP. Others on here are right, but you need to come to your own understanding of the seriousness of your situation. Like them perhaps, I wish I could put you on fast-forward, because the realisation that you really are in an abusive marriage is horrific in itself. You do need to get to that point, because you also probably need to completely let go of the idea if only you got your behaviour 'right' then things would be all right. That never works.

Somehow I missed a few posts. Annie Kenney. I've read yours and i could maybe try some of your suggestions but when's he off on one, he won't listen to me. I have to listen to him. I would like this fixed but I just can't see him changing.

I've spoken to friends today too. They all support me and agree. I've emailed relate to book a meeting with just myself too.

I haven't been able to talk to him today. He's doing his all sweetness and light. He cooked dinner and offering me cups of tea (I never get offered tea!) this is what happens. We have a chat and he promises to be better and we forget... Until next time.
I've been through my what's app and notes. I had noted arguments down. There's loads of them where he swears at me and having a go at me. I feel like I've been more pro active today. Thanks for all your advice.

You are doing well, OP. Wherever this ends up, you are starting to examine your situation more clearly.Even in a couple of pages on MN I sense a big shift in our thinking.

When he's sweetness and light that is the time to get serious with him zero tolerance
Clearly when he's raging your just in damage limitation mode

You say this happens when he drinks ? My H did the same thing twice. I threw him out. He is home now and no longer drinks. Does your dh have a drink problem, as in binge drinking ?

He has cut down drinking in the week but at weekends doesn't know when to stop or mainly if he goes out with friends drinking beer. At home it's red wine mainly. If he ever falls asleep when drunk i.e. On a train or sofa he can wake up a different person, like he's in a dream and can get very disturbing and very loud. It's awful. I've warned him about that. This time I'm not sure if he fell asleep on the train but he'd had 1 beer on the train home. As there was a 4 pack on the kitchen side. He says he's sober and he wasn't particularly slurry but the way he was behaving was so crazy. How do I chuck a grown man out the house if they don't want to go!!

I feel like my body is on high alert at the moment it feels horrible. I'm strung out and feeling down at the same time. We're not talking but he's gone into quiet ashamed mode and accepting that I don't want to talk. I just want him to say he knows what he's done and how it's affecting us. How sorry he is for it. I believe he does feel sorry yet he still believes he was entitled to be angry about losing the iPad. He calls it letting off steam. Wasn't directed at me but equally wouldn't respect me or the children to stop the noise. He believes he's entitled, he's an creative/emotional person and it's because he's close to me that I see it all. I'm his emotional punch bag though. Feeling so sad about it all today.

How do I chuck a grown man out the house if they don't want to go!!

By calling the Police.

Or by telling him while he's sober and quiet that this is a deal breaker and he needs to give you space and time to think. It's shit I know but you CAN do it.

You need to speak to him when he is sober
And be prepared for him to challenge what you say.
Stand firm, don't back down , zero tolerance ..just calmly repeat your standpoint if he gets aggressive or overly emotional walk away
And repeat
And what Isetan said

Orherwise nothing will change

Good luck OP and good idea to to along to Relate on your own. It will help you gain clarity.

to go

"He's a creative/emotional person.."

Ha fucking ha. He deserves special understanding of his right to behave like a twat ? Puh-lease.

He's an over indulged ( spoilt) child ...oops ..did I say that out loud

I've been in your situation with a drunk angry out of control man late at night it is very frightening ...and with children involved x 10. I feel for you I really do .
It is complete unacceptable
Have you reflected on your relationship and his behaviour within it on a day to day .

I've had an online chat with relate and booked my appt for next Friday. I'm talking to my husband tonight. He says he's been looking into anger management course or people who can help him. He sent me a message to say sorry and he'll make it up to me but still made a point of being upset about the iPad. He really doesn't get that I don't give a shit about the iPad. Just my children heating his angry spew that came out of his mouth. Tonight we are talking. I'll tell him in doing relate and then we need to do it together. He also is trying to sort himself out. its a start.

Day to day we are ok ish. I'm getting fed up with his lack of communication. He doesn't like to discuss work and if he's snappy it's because he had a bad day and doesn't want to discuss. If he comes home he may get fed up with the kids if they don't do as they are told. But so do I. Id say that's all fairly normal. He takes the kids to school every day which is a great help. He likes to know what I'm doing in the day and if I spend money. I don't really tell him either. Most days we are fine. It's only if he's had stress then we all sure as hell know about it.

He likes to know what I'm doing in the day and if I spend money

So he's emotionally abusive/controlling as well?

Take a look at the power and control wheel. You don't need to share with us, just for you, but have a hard think about which of his behaviours fit where on the wheel

www.theduluthmodel.org/pdf/PowerandControl.pdf

Floflo10,

re your comment:-
"Tonight we are talking. I'll tell him in doing relate and then we need to do it together".

I doubt very much that you will get very far in talking to him.

No, do not tell him this and do not joint counselling with him under any circumstances (particularly with Relate). They are not always of much use when it comes to emotional abuse. Infact no decent counsellor would ever see the two of you together in the same room in any case.

And no you are not ok day to day either. He also likes to know what you are doing during the day and if you spend money.

Do not also subscribe to the mistaken idea that abuse is related to "misunderstandings" or lack of communication. If discussion and compromise, the mainstay of mediation, could help in any way most domestic violence situations would be long ago resolved because victims of abuse "discuss and compromise" constantly. (This is what you have been doing). You have always co-operated; he has never and will never co-operate.

Op - as you might guess from my username I am in a very similar scenario

I have a counsellor experienced in abuse - if you want pm me I have only had two sessions but it's helped

Like you I am anxious as hell at the moment - work helps but weekends - god I hate them.

My next step is to call women's said and get advice on a Soliciter - I am prevaricating I know

Sending you courage - only from this thread did u realise it's abuse but ---- it's so hard

I also am taking a long hard look at what to does to my kids

Get this yesterday he started shouting about some shit. I left the room and went upstairs and the kids said - ' can you two stop shouting'
I actually said 'darlings it's daddy shouting - not me ' and my younger one agreed . He is only just turned 5

I think the thing that will push me to be brave and address this is my kids

My older one is sometimes very naughty and my darling (now dead) friend actually said she thought he was learning to talk to me like shit from his dad

Sending you strength

I've lived with an abusive shouter. You'd be surprised how quickly he will be able to control his temper when the police arrive.

So I spoke to him or rather he came to me. He said he's found a professional to talk to about his anger (I overheard phone call). He is mortified and ashamed. He knows he needs help and this is learned behaviour from his dad. His dad was far worse to him than I imagined. He really suffered from a bully of a dad. I know he tries so hard most the time not to be like him and day to day he is a great dad. Every bone in his body wants to change. I can't just switch off and hate him and leave him. We need to try this first. I told him about my Counselling. He looked shocked but agreed and is fine to a future one together. Everything is as I thought it would be. I really think he may be able to curb this with my help. He said he's laying low. He's taken up activities that prevent too much late night drinking as well. I'm going to give him the chance with his Counselling and mine and see what comes off it. I'm also hyper aware of any day to day things and I will keep on top of any behaviour I notice that is off and note it down. I can't yet bear to be close to him but it's a start.