Non-communication problem.

[lifeissweet]

This may be long. I apologise in advance.

DP and I have been together for 2 years. We have known each other for about 11 years, but were both married to other people. We are part of the same circle of friends. I was divorced for 5 years and him for 2 before we got together (just in case anyone was wondering)

We have always got on really well. Our friends were all delighted when we got together because we are so well suited. Including my ex-h, who I have an unusually good friendship with.

All was going amazingly well...until...

About 6 months in, we had a very minor disagreement. I was annoyed with him about something he had done that had hurt me and I told him so.

Completely without warning, the shutters came down. He wouldn't answer my calls, he wouldn't respond to messages save to say that he didn't want to talk to me. It was hell. I felt ill. I thought it was all over.

After 2 days of being ignored, he invited me round, told me he had been going over things in his head. He had been worried that I was trying to manipulate him. I wasn't. He had decided that I wasn't, so now everything was ok. He was trying to guard against the same mistakes made in his marriage, where he had been controlled and manipulated and was determined not to let that happen again.

I was upset with him, but relieved that things were back on track, so on we went...

This has happened 3 times since. Always about something small that was taken the wrong way. He refuses to answer my calls and gets annoyed if I text him saying 'all I want is some space and you can at least give me that.'

When I ask him about it he just says he needs time to think and that I need to leave him alone. He stops short of completely ignoring me. He'll send a good morning or a goodnight (just those words. No elaboration) and if I try to call, he'll text a 'do you need me for anything?' and if I say 'just to talk to you.' He'll say 'oh. Ok.' Or remind me that I'm supposed to be leaving him alone.

He is doing this to me at the moment. We don't live together. We have complicated and busy lives. I went round to his on Thursday night. Neither of us had our children. I usually stay the night. I was getting tired at about 11, so said I might go to bed. He said 'so you're going home, then?'

And I was a bit surprised and asked 'can't I stay here?'

And he said
'No.'

Just that.

So I got my stuff together and started to leave. I was upset. Visibly so.

He got annoyed with me. I told him it was fine. He needed a night to himself and that is valid. I sometimes do too, I was just disappointed as I hadn't seen him all week and like waking up with him. He accused me of trying to make him feel bad.

I left.

And since then it has been the cold shoulder.

He sends me good morning and goodnight messages and we even all went to his sister's house for lunch yesterday, but he didn't speak directly to me or look at me the whole time we were there.

I feel like I'm going mad.
I have told him how this makes me feel. It doesn't seem to make a difference. He says this is just how he copes with things and I need to accept it.
But it makes me feel physically sick and Insecure and out of control.
Is Any Fucker around to give me a kick up the arse?

He is a cold, callous abuser. For the love of god don't stay with him because you worry what people will think! None of us have any idea what goes on behind closed doors. Most people are mature enough to know that. And the things they said about him before: that's because they love and support you. I'm sure they will love and support you through this too.

That kind of thinking will get him right back into your head and into your bed

This is your life. Would you knowingly ruin it to keep up appearances ?

Nope. Don't get me wrong, AF. I'm not being swayed by it. I'm just getting annoyed in advance because I can see it coming.

I suppose I'm just preparing myself for the next bit...

And I'm trying to work out why my judgement was so out of whack.

Never mind that. Like you said, the Nice Guy persona was very convincing

He was Mr Charm at his sister's. Joking with everyone. Playing with the children. Being Mr Jovial. Just not making eye contact with me or addressing me directly at any point. Even when he left and I tried to hug him goodbye he stiffened and almost pushed me off

If you were my sister I would have noticed all of that. And I would have asked you if you were ok either at the time or afterwards.

If anyone asks you can say that some people behave very differently to friends than they do to partners, he wasn't the nice guy in the relationship as he appeared to the outside world.

That whole 'be lovely to everyone but me' bollocks is one of the many reasons I am happy to see the back of my 'D'H. He would then gaslight me by saying there wasn't a problem when I challenged him on why I was the only one he was being off with
Everyone thinks he's this lovely affable guy. And in public he can be, anyone that works with him or knows him casually thinks he's great.
Eventually I faced up to the fact that if he could be nice to everyone else, then he was actively choosing to be a bastard to me, often for 'crimes' I wasn't aware I'd committed. That hurt but I'm finally realising that it wasn't me.
He used to say he couldn't talk to me, would shut down 2 sentences into a proper conversation or generate an argument out of thin air. Yet everyone comes to me with their troubles. Funny that.

I'm now at the stage of telling those people he's gone/moved out and the standard response seems to be 'oh, I'm sorry, he'll be back I'm sure'. I don't bloody want him back thanks. The last month has been the least stressful one in well over a decade

Your judgement was not out of whack. You trusted him to treat you the way you would treat him. And he didn't. And in the confusion you stayed, because you were trying to make sense of it. That's how it begins. No one could have persuaded you that this would be the outcome. Be happy that your eyes are open now, some people never escape. It's taken me 13 years. But better late than not at all!

You do see it a lot on here. Men who are true princes to everyone apart from the person they are supposed to treasure above all else.

It's abusive, no less, because it fucks with your head

Really, MND ? You have got shut of the twat ? That's made my evening.

Anyfucker, your delight has made mine

He moved out a month ago, has left me absolutely broke but I'm free. Been waiting for him to sign acknowledgement of the divorce papers but he doesn't realise yet that I can proceed anyway!

Allowed myself 24 hours of hurt and bitterness after he demanded my rings back on moving day, and pulled a couple of other breathtakingly selfish stunts that will probably backfire. That's long enough for me. Debating whether to do the freedom programme but tbh, for the first time in my life, I actually want to be by myself.

As for preparing yourself for the next bit, I'm still waiting for the 'wistful tearful turn back the clock' phase to arrive. I'm having a ball

Bloody good for you

And when he comes crawling with his tail between his legs, be sure to do the cool, calm "I really don't think that's a good idea" line

How are you doing lifeissweet?
He's away until tomorrow isn't he? Are you still feeling strong?
Don't be won round with his deigning to speak to you....you deserve respect

Oh love, he's horrible, isn't he?

Who wouldn't feel rejected and insecure if any time they voiced their own discomfort or pain it was "punished" like this :(

All you have to say, when you're ready to finally say it, is, "you said that this is who you are, and that to be with you I would have to accept it. I've had a good think, and I don't accept it. I cannot be with someone who behaves like this, so I cannot be with you."

It's not something that can be argued against.

If he promises to change then you can say, "I accept you for who you are. We are not compatible."

I would be so very hurt and confused in your shoes. This is supposed to be the good bit. It'll only get worse from here.

I am doing ok. Thank you so much for asking, Zebraface.

I saw my psychologist today and, although she was far less black and White about it than you lot of vipers are, she did help me to keep focused on what I'm trying to achieve. I want to take control of my life now.
He is back tomorrow. I am dreading it, to be honest.

Half of me still wants to collapse into his arms and pretend this never happened. I'll be honest about that. I'm not going to pretend to be super human. I am still attached to the idea I had of him.

And frankly, no one is all good or all bad - and he has some lovely qualities and I have such fun with him. No. This behaviour is not worth it. I have made that decision, but I still know this is not going to be easy.
And thank you marriednotdead. Your story is so heartening. You have done so well.

I know exactly what you mean lifeissweet.

Part of me wavers towards feeling sorry for my DP (ex?),for what I think he could be,what I want him to be.... That little boy lost who's XW left him.

But I know he won't be,he's had long enough to prove it

You know what you have to do. What's best for you. It's so disrespectful to shut someone down when they are trying to resolve an issue. You just need to keep thinking WWAFD?

Lifeissweet, please think really carefully about whether it's a good idea to tell him face to face.

He is an arch-manipulator and knows how much you care about him and so will pull out all the stops to make you feel that you got the wrong end of the stick and that of course he loves you and would never hurt your feelings, etc. etc.

He is dangerous for you and your mental health and you are much better off just sending him a quick text saying you don't want to see him again.

You don't owe him anything at all! Just think about the pleasure he has derived from making you really unhappy on many occasions...

Then you will be able to get on and enjoy life, instead of trying to work out what is going on inside his sick head.

I am a bit confused as to why you cant just pick up the phone or text him that it is over. This is the man that had no idea when or if he could talk to you again, just a couple of days ago. He couldnt even look at you! And why, because you had an opinion. Well, you are allowed a fucking opinion!

Why put yourself through this? Why should you be dreading him coming 'home'? And if you dont live together, it is not his home anyway.

I am still attached to the idea I had of him.

That's what keeps us with these arseholes, the IDEA that deep down they are nice people who are just having a blip. Because we are that way, and we want the same for ourselves.
Nope. If that was the case, it would be natural and therefore easy to be pleasant habitually.
But we then have to question our own judgement, which is uncomfortable. Having low self esteem makes it more likely that we go on to blame ourselves for the problems and failings in the relationship rather than deflect the crap back where it belongs.
Please don't give him another opportunity to mess with your head. I thought DH couldn't hurt me any more once I'd filed for divorce but he found several ways in the months before he finally moved out.
He's not worth it.

I think the going cold on you for 'crimes' you have committed is actually cruel. Especially when the things he accuses you of doing (manipulation etc) are the very things that even he acknowledges (at a time when he isn't punishing you) that you don't do.

It's also cruel getting you an engagement ring, keeping it in the house but not proposing. When you already know about the ring.

It's toying with your feelings in such a calculated way as to be almost sinister.

You can't be with someone who does that.

Is he back yet? Have you decided whether to dump him face-to-face or by phone or text?

"I saw my psychologist today and, although she was far less black and White about it than you lot of vipers are, she did help me to keep focused on what I'm trying to achieve."

This made me smile, btw! I guess that's because she's a professional and "LTB" is probably against the rules But seriously it's great that she's supporting you to think through and make your own decisions. Remember her words as well as ours if you falter!

The really bonkers thing OP was that your last "crime" was to dare to go home when he told you - at 11 pm - that you couldn't stay the night! What did he expect to do, sleep in his garden? He's got you coming or going hasn't he - what a manipulative wanker. Well done for making the decision to bin him. And good luck doing it - I know these things aren't easy, keep talking to us through it!

This is awful. You are so right to end it.
When you do talk to him, imho, keep to the fact that your relationship simply will not go the distance. He sounds so manipulative (and the Good Guy persona is a manipulation/superficial facade as you now see the truth of him) that he will twist anything you say back on you. Don't engage with an argument; it is ok to let him have "the last word" :you don't need to verbally defend yourself to him because you are defending yourself by speaking with your feet and leaving the relationship. Make your script; keep it simple; and out loud practice it. Then in the moment- have your say and repeat if necessary, but hey, if you need to make your exit in the middle of his reaction- then do it. It wouldn't be any worse than how he has cut you off so many times. (And it is brilliant that you have already collected your stuff!)

AF-love the LTB label!

Hello everyone.

Sorry I went missing for a couple of days there.

I spoke to him on Wednsday night. He was acting as though I had totally lost my mind. He had only been slightly less chatty than usual. He wasn't ignoring me. He would never be that rude and he's shocked that I think badly of him.
I'm over reacting in a monumental way and maybe he doesn't want to be with someone who makes such a massive drama about absolutely nothing.
I couldn't really counter anything, as it felt so much like we were speaking different languages that I thought any comment I made about what I've been through in the last few days would be taken wrongly and used as ammunition.

So I kept pretty quiet. Waited until he'd told me how mad I am and then said that there's nothing else to say then is there?

And left.

I didn't really stand up for myself, so I'm slightly disappointed that I had no way to argue back with him.

But it is done.

And I spent yesterday in a bit of a fog. I'm devastated now the reality has hit. I don't feel relieved yet, just utterly desolate.