Can love work between the classes?

[matchgirl]

I am 31 and a post grad student in London at present, originally from Scotland and from a pretty poor back ground, glasgow council scheme, free school meals, Dad was out of work at times that sort of thing. Not complaining at all love my folks and they did everything to make my life better but just giving you an idea of my situation.

Anyway I have met a guy in London last autumn, through some friends I have at Uni he is 37, single and works as a journalist no problem but he is posh, not just a bit but like Eton posh, really rich, he is much posher than he is rich.

When we met it was a total thunderbolt for both of us, lust at first sight I don't think he let go of my hand for about 10 minutes when introduced. It was crazy, never have experienced anything like that before.

We started seeing each other very quietly at first, I think we both felt it couldn't last but it did and it actually went pretty quickly from just a sex thing to something more, yes there was culture clash but also real friendship, desire and we fell in love.

It has been great, he is a really lovely man and when it is just us two its is great no real barrier but we both realise that things are getting serious between us and he wants us to think about a real future together. I am thrilled but it wouldn't just be him I would be marrying but his whole family, his social circle and his job and it would be in London, forever not Glasgow with my family. I don't mind but I worry that I would have to change my identity to fit in with him and his life. His older brother makes it plain he can't stand me and makes little digs at me when he thinks he won't be overheard. His Mother on the other hand seems to adore me and finds me charming so go figure.

I am not used to fancy places and got a very gentle telling off for piling up plates for the waitress in a fancy restaurant and my accent embarresses me at times, Kirsty Young I ain't.

These are all minor I suppose but I am back home visiting my parents they have met him and think he is lovely but they both are worried I will feel isolated if I marry him.

I don't really have doubts about him or our feelings but I wonder can it really work with such a gulf between our background? Will he be looking at all the elegant Imogens and Felicitys in a few years wondering why he married a peasent like me?

My best friend at school was fab common as muck. cov. girl ..she married posh rich man ..lots of his friends didn't like her (she wasn't good enough ) 10 years on she has developed the most ridiculous accent and attitudes just to fit in ...I now find her difficult to.be around ....all I'm saying is be true to yourself always. never be intimated, you are everyone's equal .

OP.

I had a relationship with someone from a totally different class to me. He is upper class (boarding school, titled, by 30 he had (sorry was given) his own 6 bed farmhouse complete with indoor swimming pool, sauna, steam room etc, tennis courts, the lot.

My family aren't poor, but we certainly aren't rich and compared to his, we are working class.

Add to all that that he is incredibly good looking and charming and he had all the Hetties and Imogen's throwing themselves at him when we were out.

It lasted 18 months. I loved him, I did. But his dad (who held all the money) disliked me, barely spoke to me. Some of his friends were lovely and I knew them anyway from before I met him, some however were absolutely awful and again, seemed to almost take an instant dislike to me.

I changed as a person, I've never really been insecure or anxious but that's what I ended up being, and also becoming obsessed with class. I constantly felt inferior and had no confidence.

This man though, didn't stick up for me or support me and it all got too much and I ended it. Once I did he confessed his undying love for me, said how all his friends and family love me, I was the love of his life and all the other BS. I left him and never look e back.

I am now with someone from a similar class background, but like me he has worked his way out of his class. I haven't once felt inferior or insecure re my class. We just got. Other man is STILL in contact begging me to go back to him, I once, for a split second considered it, but knew even though I would never want for anything and if I had children neither would they, that I would never be able to truly relax and feel comfortable with who I am and would always feel inferior around his friends and family.

HOWEVER, despite all of the above. The fact that his mum likes you is really good, keep her on side. Ultimately though, to make this relationship last, you NEED to be confident and self assured and comfortable in your skin. If you are, people will back off and accept you, if you're always apologising for who you are, people won't. Maybe consider counselling or something occasionally to help keep your mind on the right track and keep some perspective!

No, but I was just using it as an example of how table manners can be jarring when someone doesn't follow the unwritten rules you're used to.

I was at school with an aristo and he and his family were lovely, whereas the nouveau riche or some of the aspiring middle classes were really snobby, particularly the ones living in gaudy footballer's wives style nice homes.

I went through something similar when at university. I'm from Glasgow, working class background. Went to Edinburgh University, which is about 50% middle class English.

Ended up with an English girl from a very upper middle class background. Her father was a diplomat, her older brother was being groomed for some high office with a string of very prestigious arranged internships etc.

We eventually broke up, but we went out for years. I never for a second let my background embarrass me (why would I?), and this confidence is probably key to you being accepted and in turn being able to brush off whatever minor friction there is between your social circles.

To be honest, these days it's way more embarrassing to be posh than it is to be from Glasgow! I don't know if the working-class-made-good role is a bit easier (or worse) when the working class one is male?

I think your over thinking it. Everyone has issues with the inlaws, mumsnet is proof of that.
I'm common and northern and dp is posh and southern and it's great. Who wants to agree on everything that would be extremely dull.

Interesting thread!

I've dated across the classes, even the races and relationships can work or not whatever the mix.

Oh, and as for boarding school, none of me or my friends who went there sent DC there..... and they've all done great.

What the hell is wrong with Glasgow anyway? A fantastic city. The University of Glasgow is the 4th oldest in the country. Only Oxford, Cambridge and St Andrews are older. I'm proud to have gone to that university.

Blimey, Lashes - looks like you dated the same knobber I did. The fact that my dad is also from a Glasgow council flat made no impact on his decision that I was "posh" at all.

OP, I wish you luck but i wouldn't rush into marriage. The issue is not him, it is his social circle. I agree with the PP who got flamed for saying that the Posh stick together. They've been to the same schools, they know the same people, they do Ascot and Twickenham and Henley. There is a social code. You will not know it, and they will make you feel bad for your mistakes.

Wills and Kate have been mentioned. Some of his friends used to say "doors to manual" whenever she joined them, poking fun at the fact her mum was once an air hostess. What comedians.

OP, Glasgow is full of open minded people who travel the globe. This attitude of reverse snobbery, and even talking about class, is not something I associate with your average Glaswegian, no matter how poor they are. Its something entirely different. Ditto moving to London or staying there (you have already moved anyway). And who do you expect to meet if you do a PHD anyway? Your local postman?

You should be asking how he gets on with your family. Gawd, some of the posts on here about people still doing the "season" - time moves on and not everyone does it. FGS.

Is this possibly more an issue of independence? How old are you? People move all the time, live in different countries, and at some point many of them move on from worrying about whether someone will fit in with their family and base their decision on whether they can live without their partner.

Meritocracy only exists in text books, it'll take a long time, if ever, to penetrate the upper classes. They rule the joint, didn't you know? They live by their own rules and are so powerful they can pretty much do what they like.

I married a toff, op; I come from a similar background to yours. I would say you're embarking on a massive learning curve. It will shock the pants off you. Nothing prepares you for it - and there is so much to learn. Largely because the UC have an uncanny ability to fly under the radar. You don't know they're there unless you are one (though their footprint is everywhere).

Imo you won't be able to help being dazzled by the excitement of getting a ticket into the impossibly attractive upper echelons - it's the prince and Cinderella isn't it: a fairytale. I was seduced by the whole thing and I defy anyone not to be, despite what they say. All that privilege, centuries of it. I was also very ashamed of my roots, which was a huge surprise to me and everyone who knew me. I got over that eventually but it took time. I felt ashamed of my ignorance (some of it real..) - again, I defy anyone not to be bcs the entire UC is structured to highlight interlopers.

He hasn't chosen you, you have chosen each other- he's lucky to have you. Ime it was in the rough and tumble of family life that our differences became stark and problematic eg micro-communication on the hoof. We assume that bcs we come from the same country we are moreorless the same - but we so are not!

There no point me saying be careful and think hard because you are very in love and that has its own powerful momentum. I do say though that it's a tough road - and that's even without his family and set. Marriages are community and family affairs, not just the two of you; the snarky 'mind the gap' jibes do have an effect.

And get yourself ready, your kids very probably will go to public school. Not just private school but public school. Day pupils or weekly borders, of course

If he wouldn't compromise on something like boarding school that is because he is narrow minded and not open to change, not because his if his class - just the same as somebody from any culture.

If you have achieved a post graduate education from a background with comparatively few advantages, OP, you have achieved more than most people from a privileged background will ever be able to achieve.

If you study most people's family trees their background is a complete mixture. People from the upper classes have just kept track of their link to one particular group of ancestors and follow certain customs but then so do dog breeders and travellers.

The travellers' culture is a good comparison to the UC (or UMC) culture. Similarly powerful cultural rules and behaviour; just that the UC have all the power of money and connections, too. And breathtaking charm (if they choose) - don't expect anything to be as it appears. Their normal is not our normal, op.

Though I agree that the UC and the WC are quite similar (just that one has all the power) re no-nonsense, straightforward. It's the climbers you have to watch out for. But it sounds like your man has arrived (centuries ago) and he, and his lot, won't have anywhere to climb. It's probably why he likes you, op - refreshingly free of all that cultural weight he's grown up with.

Not read the whole thread.
Oh gosh of course it can work! do you live him? Does he love you? I know that sounds simple but seriously? Imagine if you let him go just because of a class issue? Ignore the Bil and enjoy your lives, and any haters can fuck off! Enjoy each other!

I'd imagine that the fact you are both so different in terms of your backgrounds is part of your appeal to each other- neither of you would be the people you are without your upbringing- don't let that get in the way of being with "the one"!

Go for it. If he is kind and loving and you get along with his mother all will be well. You don't need to see much of the brother.
You will always be you and it is you he has fallen in love with. Of course it can work.

I dont see why it wouldnt work. People make it work with much more different cultural differences than social class, although i do worry that both of you seem to accept that your social class is inferior to his. It isnt.

Dont ever forget that the rich get/got there on the back of the working class.

I hope to god noone ever judges me on the back of my brothers attitude

Sorry to split hairs branleuce but imo there is no greater difference than social class. At least different geographical cultures expect there to be differences, whereas we haven't acknowledged class difference; and there is nothing more powerful than when key elements are underground, unacknowledged. Imo we are largely ignorant of the true nature and characteristics of the different social classes. Ppl are posting here 'just go for it, you'll make it work bcs you love one another' but sometimes love just isn't enough.

Read some of the books recommended here op. At least to give you a heads up about what you might be facing. And your man can read some books on the white working class (though i'm assuming here you are white!). I really do think you both need to do this so you both know what you're facing.

I am concerned you are deferring to him, assuming his ways are 'better', more sophisticated, more sensible. Don't get off on the wrong foot, op. I appreciate a Glasgow council estate pales in comparison to glittering, high end London but you cherish your roots, don't give them up in the excitement.

I'd think long and hard about this - you say there are differences in politics and religion between you, not just the background/class issue.

You might be fine with it for a while and be prepared to compromise on some things (is he prepared to compromise too btw?) but I guarantee the problems will begin when you have children. It's such a massive change and sometimes brings out a very different side to people (not just your partner but his parents, siblings etc).