Does being a SAHM cause problems?

[airhostess]

Hi,
I'm lucky. I'm told " I'm lucky and I don't realise how lucky I am".
I look after our two children, home etc but I don't think I will ever have his respect until I earn my own money.
Anyone else in the same shoes?!

I've never been lucky enough to be a SAHM. I would've loved it, but life didn't work out that way for DH and I. And I don't mean 'lucky' as in 'has it easy', I mean 'lucky' in being able to have the role in life you've wanted.

But my sister has always been a SAHM, never held a 'paying' job in her life. From day one, her DH has treated her with respect and appreciation for the hard work she has done in raising their children, keeping their home, and enabling him to do the hard work and long hours he did to keep them in cushy comfort. He consulted her in his work vs family life decisions and never (well almost never) questioned her expenditures. He would tell all and sundry "I could never have done it without her" as she would say "I'm so lucky that XX's hard work means I can be home". She has never had cause to feel he resented her 'easy life' as a SAHM, nor did she ever take him to task for his long hours and sometimes absence from family events. To me, that's an equal partnership.

OP, it seems to me that you are very vulnerable. You cannot make your partner respect your contribution to your family. Even a 'legal wife' cannot do that, but at least she has clearly defined rights within the law. You need to take legal advice as to your position. Not with an eye to divorce, just so you know where you stand. Knowledge is power.

I've always earned the same or a bit more than my DH, so I was able to approach any marital problems from a position of power, knowing I had the means to walk out the door with our children and start a new life without struggling. I'm the first to admit, it's a great feeling to know that I didn't have to put up with shit for fear of not having means to leave or money for a place to live.

People are dicks in different ways Pagwatch. If a bunch of guys are dicks in the same sexist way then that is a pattern more significant than general random dickishness.

After years of supporting him
and his career, he's decided to give it all up and I am not getting a penny.
I know lawyers do secure maintance, assets etc but not if he disposes of them first.
If I could go back in time I would never ever have given up work and if that meant no children then so be it

im not minimising it Twinklestein.

My point is that it is not justified, it's not an attitude created by the situation. A reasonable man does not suddenly turn into a dick because his partner becomes a sahm to his children.

Talking about it as a problem created simply by being a sahm misses the fundamental point that only a dick would regard his partner and the mother of his children with no respect because she is caring for them at home.

I'm with Pagwatch.
A decent man wouldn't behave like that.

the grass is always deemed greener on the other side.
Going & doing a hard days work apparently seems harder than being SAHM, mostly because a SAHM gets on & multi tasks 18 hrs a day without complaint. & then often has broken nights/school stuff/sports/food/house/ etc etc..... we know what gets done, but the dear menfolk often have no idea. Its not mind blowingly difficult, its not rocket science, but it can be lonely, relentless & more often than not thankless.
Personally I find going to work a LOT easier than staying at home & doing the drudge.
I would suggest he did a day/week/month in your shoes, & let him see how simple it is. & then discuss your situation. I seriously advise you to bite the bullet & have this talk, because if he stone walls you you are better off without him.
Sorry

Pagwatch

Eh? I didn't say you were 'minimising' anything, nor that the 'attitude' is 'justified' nor 'created by the situation'.

You seem to attribute to me a view that I do not hold that a man would suddenly become a dick when his partner becomes a SAHM. I didn't say anything of the sort, and I've no idea where you got that from.

Indeed nothing you have said bears any relevance to my posts and I'm not sure you've grasped my point at all.

You seem to have confused mine with the OP's outlook.

[baffled]

I wasn't aware we were arguing. I'm not attributing anything to you.

I was clarifying my point because you seemed to be querying it.

Fucking hell I've just read your post stating your position.

He'll pay the extra childcare? You feel guilty spending his money.

Sorry but I'd never be a SAHP in your situation. You've not got equal financial standing (surely it should be family incomes and family expenditure with lefts overs equally split if it's an equal partnership?) and no lie how your future will work financially either.

Get organised and financially secure FFS for you and your children.

We've been trying to settle FILs estate and he had a will yet that was hard enough

My P and I both WOH but he doesn't have the commute or the long hours that I do so he does more school runs / childcare runs than me. I earn more than him and do more in the house than him (allowing for the time I am out of it - I mean I do more in the time we are both home, so longer hours overall WOH + housework) but guess what? He doesn't respect me either. He doesn't respect me because he doesn't think I spend enough time with the children (how?) and when I am tired considers me weak. he thinks I am mentally ill in a contemptible way.

When I was on maternity leave he didn't respect me even though I did everything in the house and dinner was on the table nearly every night, and we paid for my mat leave from my savings.

Some men don't respect women.

you don't always know which ones before it is too late.

OhSo that's awful , why are you still with him?

airhostess Listen to what he is saying. You are very vunerable right now. Order of priority is for you guys to get married and then write a will. No big ceremony is needed. Just get the piece of paper ASAP.

Yes it sounds like you guys are struggling financially so why don't you look at the cost of going back to work. It might be an idea for you to train now so once your DC start school you can start work. Studying is easier than working because it's easier to fit it around the DC. Since he is travelling a lot I suggest you get an au pair if you have the room once you start working.

Also, don't feel guilty about spending your money. I'm not working right now. DH and I are a team. All money earned after we married is sitting in joint accounts we both have full access to. We wrote our will and living revocable trust together and we each have our pensions with primary beneficiaries as each other and the 2ndary beneficiaries as our trust so our DC are taken care of should something happen to both of us.

Worlds, because he isn't that bad really. it is quite a subtle thing the lack of respect and it makes me sad and angry but I am over sensitive. He doesn't do anything cruel, just belittles me in subtle ways. I am, honestly, always - always - havering between "not that bad" and "fuck how can I get out". I am afraid he will take the children away from me as I work longer hours. And I am afraid of what a split would do to them

OP I recognise so much of my exH in what you have said. We went from being equals when we first got together in terms of qualifications and salary, to me earning a lot less due to moving for his 'dream' job and therefore me having to take a job that wasn't ideal for me, to me working part time and then eventually being a SAHM after DC2 came along. When I worked he belittled my job, it wasn't as 'important' as his. When I was a SAHM he criticised my housework, and seemed to think the fact we had very little spare money was all to do with me going out for coffee with my mates all the time and not at all to do with the fact we were supporting a family of four on one wage. Oh and of course it was always fine for him to go out to the pub after work, that money didn't count, he had 'earned' it.

In his (slight) defence, I think he did feel very pressured being the breadwinner and it really got to him and affected our relationship. No surprises then that he left me for a 'career woman' (his words) and left me high and dry with two small children.

If you think your relationship is worth saving, I would start thinking about going back to work, for your own personal security more than anything. Now I am a full time WOH single mum and it is hard, but manageable, and life is a whole lot better than it was.

Oh I also jointly own his business as his wife. DH wouldn't have it any other way even though I don't take a salary. We are a team.

Well I have sampled the sahm thing only when on maternity leave and truth be told felt resentful that dh got to go out the door and do an interesting and challenging job all day then come home and be presented with two children who are happy to see him, not moaning or whining and hanging on his every word. Staying at home all day with two small children to me was relentless and mundane. I've also tried working full time - no good either, hated not seeing much of the kids and resented my job for keeping me away from them!! So sometimes I think it's tough for both, you have to find a happy medium that works for all. For us it was me working part time, having a bit extra income in the pot and keeping my career going. What do YOU want to do op? Are you happy being a SAHM or would you feel happier working even if it means big childcare bills? I don't know your dh so won't judge him - only you really know the answer.

OhSoName Bloody hell - what an arsehole. You're so right, you don't know you've got one until the children arrive and the chips are down. Then their idea of where the power should lie becomes incredibly clear. Really, please, do find out what your options are...it sounds like you need to find out what might happen re: children, because at the moment the 'great unknown' is scaring you. Seeing a solicitor might help you be more sure of yourself. Respect is so important. How can you respect him if he's like this? Not nagging - just feel your pain.

Broadbean I had one of those once. It's a shock. Your comment about coffee with mates chimed strongly. He complained about that all the time, said 'having coffee with my mates' was the only thing I cared about - to the exclusion of everything, including the children. He really meant it!

Another one here who hopes you sort out your financial position, OP, especially as you are responsible for two small children.

To each their own, but the desire for a "flash car" does not sit well to my mind with having two small children.

The problem worth saying that men are'dicks' if they don't appreciate the same is that they are the ones that are facilitating th e sahm ING. If they don't want to be the sole breadwinner, unless you have independent income, you have no choice. You can't be a sahm. I am at the stage where both my children are at school and I am being constantly told how lucky I am by sahms that I can work because my job is flexible and pays enough to cover childcare, ignoring the fact that the only reason that is the case is because I have been paying massive childcare bills to keep my career and work experience current for the past 8 years.

Sadly, if you are not able to have a fairly high paying job it isn't financially beneficial to return to work, however, in terms of egality & self worth, & not being belittled it is still worth it.
So perhaps this is the road to take?

Have a sit down with OH, tell him that you don't feel he recognises your worth, you are not "equals", nor a "team". You don't feel appreciated or protected financially, inspite of forfeiting your financial independence to support his family. Therefore you are going to actively look for a job, & thus child care will have to be found & financed. obviously the car needed to drive them to & from childcare will have to have child seats (so the snappy little 2 seater won't be happening) in consequence he will have to be a lot more hands on with house & children as you will no longer be skivvy at domicile. & completely vulnerable with no respect nor financial security.

You know, this thread got me thinking about 'now vs then'. My mum was a SAHM when we were growing up (mid-50s - early 70s) and although society was more patriarchal and staying home was just what was expected of a woman, my father always treated her with respect. He valued her home-keeping and woe betide any of us who cheeked her. Mum's word was law when it came to domestic decisions and child-rearing. And I can't think of a major financial decision made that Dad didn't take her opinion. She didn't always have the final word on spending or such, but Dad always heard her out.

Nowadays I seem to hear so much more about SAHMs being disrespected and their opinions disregarded by their spouses. Their contributions to the family being treated as almost worthless compared to the salary the 'man of the house' contributes.

Where, when, and why did that change? What can we do to bring it back? I think a large part of it is our not respecting each other's choices to stay home or work. If we don't give each other the respect we each deserve, how can we expect men to give it to us?

I now step down from my soapbox and hope that OP demands and gets the respect she deserves.

fancyanotherfez

They are dicks if they tell their partner how lucky she is and behave as the ops DH does.

And I doubt the sahm telling you that you are lucky are doing anything other than making conversation.

I think telling anyone they lucky is mostly dickish actually.

My DH didn't fascilitate my sahming. I'm not a resting actor or a dilettante.
One of us had to give up our career and I took the bullet. He is mostly pretty grateful understanding that fucking ones career to be at home with a toddler would not be everyone's choice.

My wife is a SAHM. Not a problem for us, if both of us worked life would be much more stressful. Without my wife looking after the kids I wouldn't be able to be in the office from 8.15 to 5, so she enables me to work.
I must admit I'd like to be a SAHD sometimes, but that isn't going to happen!

supermum

Why are you telling OP to marry a guy who's such an arse?!

yes he is an arse and should be having a proper conversation with her if he's not happy instead of insulting her. But he will only know the reality of two working parents if he experiences it.