DP's attitude to our life is making my own life miserable...but is this my fault?

[whatsyourtune]

I feel like I can't cope with my DP anymore, and I don't know if this is a problem that I have, or that he has.

In a nutshell, on an almost daily basis, I feel messed about by my DP. However, his view is that I get too worried about things and that I am unfair on him.

Here's the sort of things that happen:

• DP will tell me he is travelling abroad with work a few days before doing so and will give me incorrect details. ie flight time, when he is home, potential for the trip to be extended. I have told him many times that him not being clear about these things means my everyday life is uprooted. Ie. if I make plans as a couple for X weekend, then find out last minute he's not here and have to make excuses with friends etc...even after he has apparently 'confirmed' with me. I will say to friends with confidence that DP and I can't make this weekend, for instance, thinking DP has been clear cut on this, and it turns out later that he just neglected to be specific. I am ALWAYS supportive of his job and understand that things change...but I just want to be informed as and when that happens.

• Another regular thing... DP and I will agree to something ie dinner on Friday, drinks with friends, going to visit parents etc. A couple of days before, if something comes up at work or he wants to go out with a friend etc etc, he will deny all knowledge of our conversation, or he will twist it to make it sound like we hadn't actually organised something and finalised it. ie it wasnt a DEFINITE plan. He will usually be apologetic and usually he only wants to change the plan because he's simply forgotten another commitment... it never seems to be malicious, and when we do spend time together, he is generally loving and caring. Frustrating nonetheless.

• When I feel he isn't telling me the whole story (which is often), I can usually tell. Last week I was unwell and he kept asking if I had my period. It was a strange thing to ask and he kept putting it into texts, in the middle of other conversation about whether I was feeling better. It turns out he wanted to ask if I thought I could be pregnant. This is a man who is nearly 30, and I found it incredibly frustrating to have to read into what he was asking in texts, and then clarify with him - are you worried I am pregnant? It often feels like I am in a relationship with someone still at school.

• DP has an excuse for everything. He forgot is a very regular excuse. He seems to forget everything and it's his excuse for all of the above. Another excuse is that he didnt have time to tell me something. No time, and no memory, apparently.

• If I get cross about the above, DP will react by saying I am being unfair, he will become aggressive and shout and say he can't be arsed etc. and put the phone down on me. He will often ignore the issue and he seems to apologise because he knows socially-speaking he probably should, but not because he truly means it, if that makes sense. Truth be told, I'm not sure he understands why I get so frustrated... I think he genuinely thinks how he acts is ok.

Having said all this, DP can be very lovely to me. When we are spending time together, we get on so well and he;'s quite thoughtful. All of this is just driving me a bit crazy, though.

Recently he's made me second-guess myself...Am I in the wrong here? Am I asking too much of him? I've just never been with such a 'difficult' person, in the sense that every conversation and every plan etc seems to cause a big problem with him, and his answer is to blame me by saying I am unfair on him and too stressy. I am stressy BECAUSE of this...it seems to go round in circles.

Is he right that I am bringing this on myself?

We-ell, 'intentional' may be the wrong word.

My mother used to do this to me. Arrangements for family get-togethers and visits would be made without telling me, but she would swear she had. Sometimes she did tell me, only to change it without notice. Or she would vaguely mention something and I would say let me know, only to be presented with a fait accompli that didn't suit later. It would be my fault for not checking. And she would turn up to stay with me without asking before hand. Then become the matriarch in my house and treat me like the lodger. I never even got to answer my own phone.

And it wasn't intentional, in the sense of being a conscious decision to mess me about. But it did come from a very strong subconscious desire to control me, from an attitude that I, her most pliant child, should do as she wished or even that I wanted to do as she wished so I didn't have to be treated like an adult and consulted. And sometimes, on some level she wanted to avoid difficult consultations over things I might not want. She just didn't recognise my autonomy and she did not respect me as an independent adult, much as she has always loved me.

It was an enormous battle to get her to back off but I did it. I am not sure the effort is even worth it in a romantic relationship. He probably won't react well to you trying to draw new boundaries, and it does rather suggest a poor attitude to women.

You are the person in his life he is most prepared to mess around. He doesn't seem unduly concerned about or respectful of your feelings. Everyone can have a blind spot about a couple of annoying things but this sounds to be more fundamental.

Forgetting things is one thing (although it sounds as though this happens with slightly suspicious frequency), but twisting things is almost certainly deliberate.

Try making plans for just you to see friends, maybe after he next tells you he's going away with work and gives you his dates. See what happens.

Maybe he'd rather not have all this planning what to do in advance. I think that could be a bit annoying. So on Saturday you can't say oh I'd like to stay in or I'd like to go out for a meal. But on the other hand the times you do make plans then he should stick to them. So would it work if you made less plans. If you don't live together then in a way you do have to make plans to see each other. I am taking it that you do live together.

How can it possibly be your fault that he messes you about - it won't change until you tell him you want some priority in his life, intentional or not.

By blaming you he is closing down the conversation - highly manipulative.

Ah yes, i'm a PA and have worked for a few bosses like this. There are planners and there are people (who if left to their own devices) would do everything on the spur of the moment (despite the chaos it ensues).

Does he have a smart phone? If so, I would speak to him about making arrangements to go out and confirm it with a calendar invite (and tell him as you are typing it).

Not sure what else to do. It's easier to herd cats than to deal with some people. Accept that you won't change him but decide if this is the sort of person you want to spend the rest of your life with. I suspect the answer will be no so do not be afraid to leave. Life is too short to put up with bollocks.

whatsyourtune - you are asking yourself if he's behaving like this deliberately.

Here are a couple of things that might help you work out the answer:

• he travels abroad for work regularly, so I'm guessing he has a fairly high level job. Do you think someone who is genuinely and constantly forgetful would be able to hold down a job like that?

• is he ever forgetful in a way that inconveniences or causes embarrassment to him (an example might be forgetting his pin number or forgetting his passport when travelling abroad).....or is it just whn it inconveniences or embarrasses you?

On a practical level is it possible to pin him down using calendars (either online or paper) - my dh and I send each other calendar invites for nights out, weekend events planned etc so that it's documented straight away and the other can't pretend to have forgotten. Whoever gets the booking on the calendar first takes priority - the other will have to reschedule.
This also precludes any gaslighting from the other person - if it's not on the calendar then it isn't happening.

It does sound like my disorganised ds with autistic traits who does not like things organised for him and can't see further than the next day or so and is always 'forgetting' things that are inconvenient. He avoids confrontation by saying yes, then forgets. A big calendar in the kitchen helps.

OP how long have you been together? And has he always been like this?

You seem convinced that he is just forgetful yet he seems to hold down a decent job. Do you think he 'forgets' to tell his manager anything work related? Does he miss meetings and important deadlines and blame his boss for being stressy? Or is this twattish behaviour just reserved for you?

Have a Google re gaslighting and see if you think this is reflective of your DHs behaviour. He sounds awful, can you live the rest of your life putting up with this crap?

Are you happy?

It doesn't sound like you are.

I would say: stop trying to analyse his behaviour, trying to take the blame, etc. Just ask yourself if this relationship makes you feel secure and loved.

If it doesn't, it's not a good relationship for you to be in. That's it.

we don't live together at the moment (used to ), and that's why the organisational aspect to our life is needed.

it's not like i pin down every minute detail...but it's nice to know what's happening as and when, so that I can confidently make other plans and have confidence in us as a couple. i also find it hugely disrespectful that he change shis mind/forgets things last minute, which then have an impact on me.

i would never do these things to him for one reason: i would worry that he would fall out of love with me for having such little regard to his feelings/life.

If he were really as disorganised as you describe, then there is no way he could hold down a responsible job which involves so much foreign travel. He would be missing flights, missing deadlines, forgetting about pieces of work he was supposed to be doing, double-booking meetings...

But he's not, is he? He's doing just fine at work. So his memory is fine, WHEN HE WANTS IT TO BE.

Or maybe his memory really is that bad and he's got some sort of super PA who does all that organisation for him - in which case, why doesn't he get his PA to confirm with you when any of the work travel / meetings etc. get changed?

Really, there are all sorts of ways to deal with this, IF HE WANTED TO. A big calendar on the wall in the kitchen. A shared online planner. When you have a discussion and agree to do something, write it on the calendar right there and then, with him present (in fact, make him do it, so it's his writing.) Send each other digital appointments for your online planner.

Basically, either he DOESN'T CARE that he is messing you about and causing you so much stress, or he is DOING IT DELIBERATELY. Either way, it's not looking good. If he were genuine, he'd be apologetic about the mix-ups and after two or three of them, he'd be looking for ways to prevent it happening again. But once a week as a minimum? There's no way that's accidental.

Classic abusive behaviour IME. Listen to the good advice here. Sometimes you can be too involved in a situation to see it clearly and flippinada makes very relevant points there.

I agree with Monstrous, my feeling is that his MO it's unconsciously intentional.

I think he's probably only half aware of what he's doing, he certainly wouldn't know why. Some things are clearly intentional however, he is gaslighting you and twisting things and blaming you.

The bottom line is clear: he doesn't give a shit about you and your plans and he enjoys driving you mad.

When my husband travels for work he is emailed the itinerary by work which he passes on to me. It would twke effort to get details of flight times wrong because he'd have to change them.

He is doing it deliberately. He just doesn't give a monkeys about how you feel. It goes like this:

1. you plan something
2. he later decides he wants to do something else
3. he pretends he knew nothing about the original plan so that he can just get on with what he wanted to do
4. You get a bit annoyed (rightly so)
5. He doesn't like being called up on it. He expects you to just let him do what he wants.
6. He tells you no such conversation took place about original plans in a hope to get you off his back so he can carry on with what he wants to do with minimal 'fuss'.
7. You might drop it, but if you insist he has to up the anti to shut you up.
8. He shouts at you and storms out and does what he wanted to do anyway.
9. He might punish you by not coming home for a few days (has this happened yet?).

10. Finally, he gets used to shouting at you and he has to up the anti again. This is when he will get violent (throwing things at first, smashing up stuff). Each time he has to up the levels to get what he wants without you interfering.

I lived this life, gradually getting worse. It took me 4 years to work out that he was totally selfish and did it all on purpose to get his own way. I think there is something sociopathic about it. You can't quite believe it yet because you are looking at it from 'normal' eyes, where you wouldn't treat someone like that on purpose. But make no mistake, many people do. And it sounds like he is one of them.

I think whether he is doing this deliberately or not is the key issue here.

If he's doing it on purpose, then all the calendars and organisers in the world are not going to make a blind bit of difference.

mitzimaybe we have tried the calendar thing...he doesnt use it unless I bang on about it and force him to, which is exhausting. and usually from day one he cant be specific anyway, so anything that was put in there, would have to be altered...and he woud have the same excuses...he forgot about something else, he didnt mean to, he didnt have time to update it etc.

Whilst i dont think he intentionally tries to hurt me in this way, i do think he is oblivious as to why i get frustrated, and doesnt seem to be phased by how upset i am by it, which doesnt say much about his attitude towards us :(

I think if he were just disorganised there would be none of the intentional stuff. The presence of definite intentional manipulation indicates that all the behaviour may be intentional even if he's unconscious or only half-conscious of it.

It must be very difficult to go from living together to not living together. Could this not be the problem. He now wants to be more free to do things on the spur of the moment. Not saying that isn't selfish. I think you should just start making your own plans and not including him unless he asks specifically and says he wants to be included. Have you plans to live together again. Hope things work out for the best.

vivien we do plan to live together again...currently apart due to work. i dont think the living apart has helped... however, before we moved in he was similar to this, though i didnt notice it too much as we moved in quit quickly.

i dont think the fact we live apart is a good reason - people live apart and dont do this sort of thing. plus, he should be more keen on being consistent and organised with me in this situation.

i just feel drained by the constant upheavel to my life and constant arguments where i feel utteraly confused as to why he has messed me around..again...with the reason that he forgot.

The worst of it is not seeming to care that he has angered you. Bad sign. Make more independent plans, see how much he really wants to be involved with what you do.

How bad does it have to get before you decide to give up OP?

Can you live like this for the rest of your life? Do you want to bring kids into this relationship? Can you imagine having kids to organise on top of this? And more things for him to forget?

I would cut your losses now and don't waste any more on this.

I expected a lot of replies daying abuse or gaslighting.

I've been through this with DH who also works abroad a lot or does unpredictable hours.

I told him if he was that useless, he'd not be a middle manager.

I asked him how work felt when he didn't tell them he was away. Of course they knew, they had to arrange flights and hotels ect and he'd have to cover the work in this country.

I told him he only forgot because he never gave me a second thought when he was working and always knew Id cover for him at home. I told him how much it hurt our daughter that even we he did tell me, he'd not tell her.

Upshot was, when he updated his calendar on his iPhone, he had to send me and invite. Likewise if I arranged anything, I'd copy him in.

It was that he was taking me for granted and compartmentalising his life when he needed to overlap them.

We don't have the problem anymore

Oh and I'm glad I didn't cut my losses and that we had kids.

A simple addition to the iPhone calendar was all it took. He's got a shit memory and tunnel vision.

Does he ever forget things that inconvenience him ( not you ) ?

So does he forget to call clients , submit his expenses or write work reports ?

Does he forget arrangements he has made for things he wants to do , like go out with his friends ?

Does he forget things that cost him money , like insuring the car, car tax, submitting his tax return ?

Does he have a bad credit history because he forgets to pay bills ?

Do you do all the household admin and manage all your money in a joint account because he's so disorganised ?

Does he miss trains and flights for work ?

Has he been in trouble at work for forgetting things and being disorganised ?

If you say you will do something for him, does he remember ? Eg if you say you will buy him socks next time you are in marks and Spencer and you then say " you need socks " , will he say " I thought you were going to pick them up"

Does he remember when it's your turn to do a chore ?

If he does all these things , then I could believe that he does have some problem - being forgetful, perhaps a learning difficulty - and that none of this is intentional . Otherwise .......