DH and his refusal to get a permanent job.

[farendofafart]

He has a good profession but values his 'freedom' above his responsibility to his family (me and 2DC). When he has (temporary) work he is reasonably well paid but a lot of the time he hasn't got work.

We actually separated (my decision) earlier this year due to this and other issues. (The other issues are bigger but I don't want them to cloud this post because I'm trying to work out my stance on just this issue.)

His lack of paid work since the separation has meant that maintenance payments have been almost non existent. In fact I have been lending him money to survive. He is working at the moment but he hasn't paid me back the money he owes me and still hasn't paid any maintenance, because he is still catching up with all the bills he couldn't pay when he had no work. He has barely contributed to the children's Christmas presents.

So I asked him tonight if he would be looking for permanent work at his new temp workplace (which he says is really nice) and his response was a flat no. He wants his freedom. He doesn't want a permanent job, ever. This is a man in his 40s, married with young DC, a shed load of debt not including the mortgage, no pension and no savings.

We had been working towards an eventual reconciliation. I just feel so let down now.

Thanks for reading. I had to write all this down so I could see it clearly. He's never going to be the man I need him to be, is he?

Well, good luck getting it. I hope you do but I hope you aren't holding your breath.

It would be a really good idea to never lend him money again.

He is not your responsibility.

If he's that desperate for cash, he can always... work !

If working is beneath him, surely begging ought to be.

Why are you protecting him from the consequences of his employment choices? Lending money to someone who you can't rely on is irresponsible.

His wanting 'freedom' isn't the issue, his ability to finance it, is.

I think you know where you stand with him. He is not interested in financially supporting your family and you need to start planning not expecting that to change.

You have contributed to a parent/child dynamic which your H, for obvious financial reasons, is reluctant to let go of. What isn't clear, is what do you get out of it?

What do I get out of it?

Hope, that he will wake up and everything will come good in the end and that my dreams for our future haven't been in vain.

Pathetic of me, I know.

I am starting to see that it will never happen. Believe me.

It's not pathetic, but it's unrealistic.

"He became desperate for cash"
Of course he became desperate for cash - that's what happens when you CHOOSE to not work for a living. Very few of us work for the love of it, mostly we do it for the money. And we don't consider it to be beneath us to do so.

If he really values his 'freedom' above all else, then he needs to embrace the financial penalty that comes with it. And to stop guilting you into bailing him out.

Sadly, I have to agree that you are extremely unlikely to get this money back. But just in case, you need to start telling him NOW that you NEED it back, it is to meet bill ABC and you cannot afford to not pay it. Don't wait until the bill arrives, because he will only bleat then about short notice. Tell him now, tell him every time you meet him. It won't, sadly, make him any more likely to repay you, but it might stop him expecting to wring any more out of you. Remember, every penny you give him you are denying to your children. (Sorry to guilt you, but it is.)

Nah, something else is going on. By lending him money you're sabotaging the very thing you say you hope for, you really need to find out whats driving your behaviour.

OP - some people do change, some people do (belatedly, granted) come to the realisation that what they'd like to do with their life doesn't fit with their commitments, and that you can't have your 'freedom' and a finanically comfortable lifestyle without a lotto win. However, your DH will never go through this realisation when also in a relationship with someone who stops him feeling the concequences of his choices. He doesn't need to change right now, because even though you are telling him, you are stil stopping him feeling the downsides of his choices.

Step away. He might sort out, he might not, but you cant fix this.

"What do I get out of it?"

"Hope, that he will wake up and everything will come good in the end and that my dreams for our future haven't been in vain."

"Pathetic of me, I know."

Ah OP, don't beat yourself up. If we didn't have dreams for our future, we wouldn't have anything (((hugs))). You're not being pathetic, you are still grieving for the loss of your dreams, your hopes, everything you had which involved him. It's tough and it takes time. Be kind to yourself.

But, being kind to yourself does involve accepting reality. False hopes are very cruel. He's unlikely to 'wake up'. Selfishness, IMO, is not something that can be learned or unlearned, at least not in adulthood; if you are still selfish as an adult, it has become a fixed trait.

On the plus side, I do believe that everything will come good in the end. It just won't involve him. (((hugs)))

Isetan, you're probably right. A few other reasons I gave him money:

I find it hard to say no when anyone asks me for help. Especially him. I've been financially 'rescuing' him since we first got together. (Would just like to point out that when he has money he is too generous with it and will spend it on me happily. He isn't calculatedly taking me for a ride, he just is very very irresponsible with money.)

Without the money he would have been unable to start his next temp contract as he wouldn't have been able to travel there. The children and I need him to be working.

He is very supportive in terms of his time and caring for the DC while I work. We are co-parenting pretty effectively at the moment and the DC and I really benefit from this. It worries me that if I become difficult and non-obliging (in his eyes) he will withdraw his support.

Chunderella, no because he works office hours and I work out of office hours.

Chunderella, theres nothing to apologise for. The OP works a few hours a week yet expects the ex to get a full time permanent job so that she doesn't have too. The odd couple of hours a week changes nothing.

It's very sexist and old fashioned to believe the man should go out to work whilst the woman stays home. In this case it's her ex so she has no say in how he runs his life. As long as he pays maintainence it doesn't matter if it's from temping or a permanent job role. Given that tax payers are supporting the children and not herself she can't berate him if he doesn't othwise it's very double standards.

Hope you have a nice view of the rest of us benefit scroungers from your lofty moral height daisy.

thing is, Daisy and Chunderella, the OP said it was a joint decision to move from the OP being the working parent and her DH being a SAHP to the other way round, except he didn't like having to do a full time job, but didn't wait for the OP to get one before giving up work.

OP, I really would look at office hours, full time work. At least that way if he does get a contract somewhere and stops doing childcare or if he does get less cooperative once he discovers you aren't going to fund him, you should be able to find paid for childcare relatively easily.

Once you've separated your finances, you can look at what benefits you are entitled to to cover the childcare costs.

If he had decided to be a full time stay-at-home dad you could have worked round that, if he'd decided to take another permanent role in a different company, you could work round that. It's the bits of money you can't rely on, can't plan childcare round etc that makes this working pattern so selfish - he wants to make his job a little bit easier (not doing the admin side of being full time employee) by making his DW and DCs lives less secure and a lot harder. He's putting himself very clearly first. Selfishness is never good in a partner.

You need to stop giving this man money, learn to realise you are a single parent who will have to support your children alone (he never will) and start working towards how you can do this.

Ahh, I didn't think this dynamic was a recent development. If the amicable co-parenting relationship is dependant on you lending giving him money that you can't afford, then it's not amicable. The 'amicable' co-parenting relationship sounds like another half truth you tell yourself in order to have a relationship with this man.

You can say no to him but you choose not to and choosing not to, benefits you on some emotional level or you wouldn't do it. The price for filling that emotional need, is not being able to pay your bills.

OP you're co-dependancy in this relationship needs challenging and if you can't to do it on your own then please seek professional counsell.

"I find it hard to say no when anyone asks me for help. Especially him. I've been financially 'rescuing' him since we first got together."
That will make it hard to stop, but stop you must.

Isetan "You can say no to him but you choose not to and choosing not to, benefits you on some emotional level or you wouldn't do it. The price for filling that emotional need, is not being able to pay your bills."
Keep telling yourself - money I give to him is less for the children. It's easier to say no when you stay focused on the consequences of saying yes.

He's a cocklodger. He'll sponge off you forever, while you hope that this time he'll repay, this time he'll get a permanent job, this time....

But, you are getting free childcare whenever you want it, and that's worth a lot.

Just don't give lend him any more money.

Ditch him.
Tell him you need a man and you're off to find one.

I can't believe you never saw this before. Did he ever show any inclination to provide for a family, or have you carried the family through the whole relationship?

Remember OP, you described this as the smallest issue you have with your relationship. And on its own, it's enough for most of us to call it a day.

You said that you're "trying to work out my stance on just this issue." And that you "find it hard to say no when anyone asks me for help". I'd say that the inability to say no is your number one problem here. Until you get on top of that, you are very vulnerable to manipulation. I'd hazard a guess that he is quite manipulative/charming, and that he zeroed in to your inability to say no like a predator .