SIL angry I won't be their surrogate - how to handle?

[MinnieM1]

Bit of back story - my brother and his wife have been together as long as I've been with my DP (7 years) literally met within months of each other. DP & I have 2 DC's, Brother & SIL have none but have been trying since they met. They are now desperate for a baby and have pretty much given up getting pregnant themselves and came round a few days ago to ask me if I would consider being a surrogate for them. His sperm, her egg and I would purely be the womb - very Phoebe from friends.
I thought for a day or 2 and discussed with DP but have since told them I won't do it.
My reasons -

1. I'm not great at being pregnant, always have health issues, 1st pregnancy I was very anaemic and had 2 blood transfusions and had morning sickness for the whole 9 months, in my 2nd pregnancy I had low blood pressure and kept fainting, 3rd pregnancy (which ended in miscarriage) I had HG and was hospitalised 4 times in 11 weeks

Which brings me to my 2nd point in that I had a miscarriage in September and just don't feel that emotionally I could deal with another pregnancy, particularly one that wouldn't even result in a baby for me! I'm scared I would grieve for losing a baby all over again.

1. I almost died giving birth to DD, my second child, so would be considered a high risk pregnancy and would be terrified of something happening again

So after discussing all of the above it just wouldn't be fair to my family if something happened or if I was ill for 9 months, what about my own children? So I said no to my brother, he accepted it and I thought all was fine until I heard that my SIL was (drunkenly) being quite nasty about it. She was apparently saying the only reason I won't do it is because if they have a baby all the attention won't be on me and my children anymore! I mean what the actual fuck!?! So to the point of my post, Should I confront her and tell her that I'm really upset by her comments and that she's asking something HUGE of me and I'm well within my own rights to say no and she's being a bit of an arse?! Or just let it go? WWYD?

...sorry for mammoth post by the way!

As an aside,made me smile the "he doesn't know that I know" when you mentioned Phoebe in your OP.

Also, whoever said it, I hate the whole thing of comparing grief. I left a different forum mostly because after my first baby who was born alive at 20 weeks I had a lady hound me because holding your baby whilst she dies is better than having miscarriages so she told me in any post about my grief. At that point we'd been told that all they could say was something was wrong with me not her and it was possible this would be my future. I don't doubt she'd struggled through every single miscarriage but my grief is mine and hers is hers, we can't compare each other is not fair on anyone and certainly not fair to bring it to someone else's thread, especially to lay your feelings on other people.

ConfuddledDOTcom didn't even notice I'd quoted Friends haha
So sorry to hear about your experiences that's awful! I hate all this competitive grief, it's ridiculous!

Why couldn't she surrogate for her brother if she wanted?
My brother and his dw are the only people in the world I would consider surrogacy for.

The person who told you sound like a pretty unpleasant person. I hope they're happy about the hurt their gossip has caused.

I suspect your sil felt she was in a safe place, with people who cared about her (big mistake), and let off steam. She is hurting and she said some things she shouldn't have. She will probably be mortified to find out that you know. It doesn't reflect well on her and she will know that.

You are in no way unreasonable not to be a surrogate and I can absolutely see why you are hurt that your sil couldn't quietly accept that, but if you can bring yourself to let it go, then it will probably be for the best. I'm not sure what's to be gained for either of you to confront her.

Absolutely don't confront her - she didn't say it to you. Infertility can make people quite mad with grief. No one is going to think she's reasonable so there's no reason you can't let her rant away.

And (not relevant to you but to some of the idiotic comments on this thread) of course you can carry a surrogate for your brother! In the same way as you can carry one for your sister. Just because it's boy/girl, it doesn't mean it's incest . Good grief.

I'm very sorry that they're struggling to conceive, but why would you be their only surrogate option? Don't they advertise for someone suitable (i.e. that they don't know) and take it from there?

I am staggered that anyone would consider asking someone who had a miscarriage 3 months ago to become pregnant on their behalf, even leaving aside your other pregnancy problems. I think I would make sure they knew exactly why you had to say no (not least you would be risking leaving your own children without a parent, for god's sake) - perhaps by writing a letter that makes no mention of the drunken outburst but simply sets out your reasoning as you gave it in your first post.

What a dreadful situation.

Just adding support to you in a heartbreaking situation for you all. It's true that there is no way any ethical medics would even consider this arrangement for more than a nano second so it would be totally impossible, in this country anyway.

Your SIL said nasty things but she is probably beside herself with grief and disappointment. I can imagine that you, her friend and fertile SIL must have seemed the answer to her prayers and she had probably mentally seen that dream baby in her dream nursery and in all honesty you won't have featured very large in the whole fantasy.

Although you must feel incredibly hurt and misunderstood, I would urge you to be generous in your heart and be gentle with her. I see no value in saying how hurt you are to her. You've said it here and had absolute validation of your feelings.

Let the dust settle. Have they actually had all the invests and treatments? (Sorry, haven't had time to read all posts). I hope they will one day achieve their dream and that whatever happens you will all remain close family. It matters.x

Ignore me please, am full of cold and its obviously blocking my brain!

We discussed me being a surrogate for my brother and his wife a few years ago but I couldn't as their problem was her lack of eggs. Now I have thought I can see the difference.

I am appalled that they have asked you going by your history. Can only be their grief and emotions clouding their judgement. Treat her with love and compassion as it is a hard place to be.

It's weird you should say that confuddled. Assuming the same outcome, I always wish that I could have seen dd's eyes open, heard a cry, felt her take a breath. Not in a comparing grief sort of way, but I still feel so cheated of all those things - that we never made a living connection outside the womb.

Misswing I am gobsmacked that you think that being childless is more painful than losing a child? I mean really you think? Does that allow me to say losing mine just before her 2nd birthday is more painful than a miscarriage of a much wanted baby?

Both result in no one growing to adulthood or grandchildren but hey thanks for pointing it out to me and others on this forum.
But I shall say sorry for your loss, and you write complete bollox.

I would say yes to that guilty

I lost dd at birth. I'm grieving who she could have been, who I imagine her to be, what I think she would look like. But she didn't quite make it long enough to show me. You are grieving someone who was.

I can't imagine your pain and I'm so sorry

I know you don't want to be a surrogate OP (and I completely agree with your reasons) but another important factor is that you likely would not be a suitable/ideal candidate due to difficulties in previous pregnancies and the fact that (I'm guessing based on what you have written) you may want more children of your own?

Obviously a simple no is more than good enough, but those are factors you could outline if pushed to explain why you said no. If you wanted to that is, you really don't owe anyone any explanation.

But I recently had a visit from a friend who cannot have children and have come to the conclusion that being childless is the most painful thing of all. Because it endures. It means no adult children. No grandchildren.

MissWing - I can see what you're saying and for some it may be true, but not necessarily. I've known since puberty that I'd never have children who were biologically my own, coming to terms with that was hard and I won't deny that it was a long process. I've since adopted and the gut wrenching fear I felt when my DD had to be resuscitated and spent days fighting for her life was beyond anything I had ever known. To have lost her would have destroyed a part of me. To morn for what you will never have is hard, to lose what you have come to love...

OP, you made the right choice and with your history it was very wrong for them to ask you. I think whether you say anything or not should be based on your next interactions with your SIL, a drunken meltdown is forgivable but is she seriously thinks you should have gone ahead then you probably need to talk to your brother.

I'm so sorry Minnie, they've put you in an awful position

Of course the sil is angry and grieving but so is the op, it's not ok to take it out on her. Being upset that it can't be done is one thing, accusing the op of being selfish and jealous of the attention of a new baby is not on at all

It's not been long since your loss Minnie, you should deal with this however you see fit. Her pain is not more important than yours and fwiw I think you've absolutely made the right decision

Hi slithy I feel our losses should never be compared as this isn't a competition anyone would ever wish to enter or win lovely, un mumsnetty hugs to you

Just wanted to bring in a view (sort of) from the other side. When I found out I couldn't conceive I went through a period of quite a few years where I felt irrational hatred for anyone I saw pregnant and if I knew them I even felt betrayed. I don't know why, but infertility is just terrible when all around you people are falling pregnant and giving birth seemingly at the drop of a hat. Your thoughts are not rational and you feel like you have failed at the most basic act of being a woman.

To have asked you, they must have been talking about and thinking about this quite intensely and I agree with PP who said even to the extent of the dream baby asleep in his/her bed and she probably saw this as the perfect solution. I would imagine by your DB that he was less convinced by how readily he accepted it. At the end of the dream she got drunk and ranted. I don't find this so hard to understand - her dream has been shattered, she is hurting and projecting that on you.

Having said that - I would suggest that you don't confront her, but talk to her as the friend you have said she is. Don't let on that you know, tell her you wanted to talk to her to explain your reasons. I think that would help both of you.

PS, I am sorry for your mc, you are hurting too and she needs to know that

Slithy it sounds like we were in an similar situation and, FWIW, I agree with you, too.

If he has viable sperm and she had viable eggs then why aren't they just having IVF?

Whilst her behaviour might be understandable, I wouldn't say that it was in any way acceptable. If she wants to rant and rave, then she does that in private. She crossed the line when she said things like this in front of a third party that you both know.

I would speak to your brother. Be understanding, but firm. Something like "I understand this might be heartbreaking for X, but she does NOT get to spew vile comments about me, and about as something as personal as this, in front of anyone other than you. If I hear she's done this again in front of mutual friends, I'm going to get angry. Please make her aware of this".

Totally agree with DorisIsABitPartialToSprouts.

Minnie from all you have written you would be a very bad candidate to be a surrogate. Both the medical situation, the recent miscarriage and the fact that you may want more children.

Those who are saying you cannot be a surrogate for your own brother maybe do not realise that people in this situation do not use their own eggs!

Can I just ask if your SIL knows her eggs are OK and knows the problem is with her getting pregnant or carrying a pregnancy? The reason I ask is because I think most pregnancies fail because of the egg, not the womb. So if her womb were OK she could consider donor eggs. I am assuming her attempts at getting pregnant have been with a clinic and things like her eggs and her husbands sperm have been checked etc? You may not know or feel able to say but I am just checking as it is not clear how she knows her eggs and your brothers sperm is OK and the problem is the womb. (but you do not need to tell us, I am just mentioning it as I have had treatment with donor eggs, sadly unsuccessful).

No knowledge of this organisation but it does suggest you are not their only hope!

www.surrogacyuk.org/

Oh love, your reasons are
More than bloody valid! If you just said no, totally fine to.

I think sil probably in a lot of pain. But not your fault.

I heard that my SIL was (drunkenly) being quite nasty about it

Christ - who was so insensitive as to pass this on? She was pissed, she was feeling bitterly disappointed...

People can be quite monstrously unkind and thoughtless at times.

PS Personally, I would not confront her, she was drunk and upset and it was a stupid thing to say.

I had fertility treatment off and on for six and a half years and it does turn you a bit loopy! Luckily, I have a fabulous daughter (by birth, care of IUI) and a wonderful son (by adoption) and over the years have explored pretty much all the ways of creating a family (except by surrogacy).

IMHO if I were you and if your sister in law's unhappiness, and her harsh words, continue I would sit down for a heart to heart with her which would end with my firmly telling her firmly and kindly that I was not willing or able to be a surrogate but I would be there to support her and hold her hand and wished her very well.

I found the conception boards on mumsnet very helpful and the adoption boards on mumsnet invaluable. But please do not suggest adoption as an option unless she wishes to talk about it, one really, really needs to grieve not having a birth child, (or in my case not having another birth child) before moving on to what is possible - IMVHO.

All the best.

To add to the others, I wouldn't confront her. However, perhaps a quiet word with your db asking how she's coping with the news and mention that you've looked into it, given your history and wanting more dcs if your own, you'd be turned down as a surrogate anyway, if they were thinking of asking others, they need to think carefully about the health of the possible surrogate as it would be even harder for SIL to take to get even further down the line.