My MIL is snide and manipulating and I want to emigrate to get away ....

[looki]

I have made a big effort to 'get along' with her. I have put up with her racist, ignorant and snobbish remarks for six years.

I have smiled at her while she told me that her husband could never have owned a (specified) small business because he is an 'academic who needed to use his brain' while knowing my own father owned the same small business. I have listened to her while she recounted stories of throwing stones at neighbour's pets while their owners were out because she 'didn't like their owners'. There are a hundred other examples - the children's birthday parties must be held at her house, she knows best about every single thing in the whole fcuking world.

I have nodded and smiled until now as she is raising her game and is getting snide with my young children, 'advising' me that young children can be 'horrible and sneaky' and need to be 'taught to be obedient'. I have adorable girls but her view is that boys are better. I have bitten my tongue for the sake of my husband. I want to run away from her as far as possible but her son fails to see anything wrong in anything she says or does and I am at my wits end. I can cut down visiting but I cannot avoid it.

She will expect us to spend Christmas with her. I am already dreading it. We will be told to arrive on Christmas Day 'on time'. We will have to tell her a hundred times how good her dinner is, we will have to be profusely grateful for being somewhere we don't want to be. Her (single) daughters in their forties will be there. They are versions of her. They will ask me questions on her behalf and 'suggest' better ways I can do things with the children. When I say that I'm happy with how things are, they will smile and say yes yes but we are right. Her words, their mouths.

I don't have the energy for her or them anymore. I am tired. I am determined she will not have an undue influence over my kids!

I think what people are saying is there is no solution to your problem where everyone's going to be happy and pleasant. You can only control your own actions, do what you want to do,accept there will be fallout, shake it of and keep restating your stance.
Your DH said "whatever you want". Take him at his word, don't react to his sulking, that's just odd!

Ah, that makes it difficult then with your parents out of the picture.

Your last line is very telling....did you really mean that?

I imagine feeling constantly like you're last on the totem pole in your own family for so long would sap your strength.

I imagine you husband feels less able to cope with her wrath, than yours which is why he accommodates her and his sisters. So one option would be to reverse that by being just as assertive, but it's not a very nice way to live.

Tonight I spoke to him and suggested we stay at home for Christmas. He said 'whatever you want' and left the room and went to bed!

I know this won't fix your relationship and attitude to in laws but take him at his word. Say, yes I will do what I want and what I want is to have xmas with our own small family. We will visit your mother and father on boxing day.

When next he raises it say - you told me to do what I want so I arranged it that we would be home at xmas.

If your MIL kicks off, just smile and say "oh but we are just starting all the traditions for ourselves that you have had all these years - just following in your footsteps. And how nice you have all your daughters to be with you". If she continues, just smile and say nothing. then leave.

there is actually nothing wrong with doing what you want. Except most women are reared to think it is rude/unfeminine/selfish etc. Doing what you want - having an xmas for your own family and avoiding dysfunctional inlaws is actually a quite unselfish thing for a mother to want.

I wonder if your dh would be slightly relieved if you became the dictator of his life instead of his mother?

Sometimes I think christmas is just an excuse for families to behave badly.

Well tell him, it's them or you and kids. Then tell him you'd prefer it if he picked them!

In your DP's defence, he has been well trained by his mother to put her needs first at all times. I have a mother like his and it is a type of conditioning/brainwashing that is extremely powerful. It doesn't just melt away when you reach adulthood. Your DP may be feeling pulled in all directions, trying to keep his mother happy at all costs but not wanting to make you unhappy either.
Having said all that, her behaviour is disgraceful. You do not sound paranoid at all, its entirely reasonable to worry the amount of control she wants to have over your lives. I agree with other posters that you should stand firm and make sure you have your own family Xmas. Standing up for yourself and saying no really does get easier with practice. But once you tell her no, you must be prepared to smile and deflect with her and any flying monkeys she sends in. Good luck OP

He said it. Whatever YOU want. So do it.
Start your own family memories.

We have opposite issue mil is leaving. But is manipulating us into doing everything for her up until leaving day. She's staying with us at present. Because it's too stressful for her to be alone.

We're expected to visit every year (can't afford it). She'll come back every year to visit us - but we have to move house as our spare room isn't suitable.

My ex's (ds's father) is a tad toxic. We moved and rarely hear from her. I've seen her slap her grand daughter across the legs for dragging her brolly across the floor, then she denied it after. She went into ds's school unannounced and asked for a copy of his school report as I 'didn't tell her anything' and she'd collect him from school without being asked. On the day of my best friend's wedding she gave ds so much water he threw up in her car, all over me (she was giving us a lift) and I've seen her sulk because ds wouldn't let her borrow the book that he was reading until he'd finished it. I slowly withdrew contact as I didn't trust her. Ds received a card on his birthday which was a blatant attempt at manipulation.

I do think you need to be clever about this. Your DH has said 'do what you want' but this is putting all of this on you, and will make you seem like the unreasonable one. You need to work together. Emphasise that you never spent Christmas at one grandparents house constantly and there's memories that you want to make with your children in your home. You want to go to the panto on Christmas Eve, you want to make mince pies and leave gin out for Father Christmas. Invite her around on Boxing Day. She won't come, you'd have taken control off her and she won't like that, but it gives you a get out clause as you won't be the unreasonable one.

If you do decide to see her and she starts to rant, just say 'come on DC, it's time to go'. Get up and leave. Don't expose your DC to any racist rants or any other sort of shit from her. As for her daughters, just do the same. Make your visits shorter and shorter, with a longer gap in between. You're busy, your DC have things they would like to do

Good luck!

Living with a sulking man is a really exhausting controlling tactic. You have mysympathy. To take a little control back in your own life you have to just take him at his word.

Don't feel the need to have a big conversation about it or justify it. He has said "whatever you want" (all be it in a passive aggressive manner) so just take him at his word and move on.

If he wants to bring it up again then just remind him that he said that you could have Christmas at home with just immediate family. If he protests, remind him that you've spent past Christmasses with his family and it's your turn to make your family Christmasses at home. If he protests more, tell him he can go to his mother's but that you and the dc will be staying at home as agreed.

Living with a sulking man is so horrible though. Itsy designed to keep you in line. And I imagine just a part of his overall character. If you intend to stay with him, then it might be an idea that you read up on this and definitely important that you stand firm on things that are important to younsuch as this.

It really is a reasonable request. Don't let him make you feel that it's not.

Be prepared for him to tell his mother it's all your fault. But so what. Really.

On a lighter note. I love that LadySybilLikesCake leaves Gin for Santa.

I'd imagine he gets a bit sick of sherry.

He only got milk at my house growing up. This explains why I never got the Mr Frosty I wanted. You guys were all plying him with booze and making me look bad.

I have experience of this from the other side as it was my father who was toxic and difficult and controlling. One Christmas visit pre-kids, we escaped on the pretext of walking the dog and went to the pub. Dh, we had been married about five years I think, said ' I can't bear this, this is coming between us and affecting our marriage' (paraphrasing, it was a long time ago!) That brought me up short and I have never forgotten it. I was married, my relationship had to be priority. That's not to say the withdrawing wasn't without its dramas and unpleasantness but the fact that it was damaging my marriage was the shock I needed to address it.

Your Dh has to make some decisions here, it will only get worse, good luck.

Sounds like it's dh who is the biggest problem op. Stop putting up with it now or set the blueprint for your daughters future relationships.

If your children sulked because they didn't get things there own way you would let them sulk. He uses sulking because he is planning to get his own way. Plan a lovely happy family Christmas , he may get to see what he has missed out on all these years.

Yes, your DH needs to back you up. There's power in numbers. Chances are that he can't see her behaviour though as he's use to it.

Gin, mince pies and a carrot for the reindeer

DH has agreed- just make plans for Christmas at home; as other posters have said he's got years of conditioning and manipulating to undo too.

Sounds like your husband is as manipulative as his mum!

If she throws her toys out about Christmas, just smile and say "Oh, Dh said we could choose" smile, head tilt. Agree, it's your Dh who is complicit in this. If he sulks kick him up his metaphorical arse and make him grow up.
And keep dd away from the clones, if they take her out, follow.
It's not going to be pretty, but be strong.

Oh I wouldn't "emigrate" with your DH, unless he had a major and long term personality change.

BTW you do realise that your MIL is having a negative effect on your DDs? Do not assume they do not hear her snide comments about "boys being better".

I agree with the OP who suggested that you are clever about this. It's about more than Christmas so make plans for the longer term.

You have the advantage as the behaviour patterns are doggedly similar so you know what's going to kick off and when. Your MIL and DH are trying their best to manipulate you into adopting their family's way of living. The good news is that you don't have to. Honestly - you are an adult and can make choices about your relationship and your life.

Take time to get your head round your own sense of power then take all the advice going about how to manage the toxic behaviour of the family you have married into. Their way is not a God-given right. You have choice here.

I do feel for you. It's incredibly hard to go up against people like this. But... it is so worth it. I love my freedom and having a relationship on equal terms.

Stay strong. Think of them as a bunch of bullies. They actually have no power over you.

Well its not entirely surprising that DP reacts this way - he has learned from his mother how to manage conflict and its not pleasant for those on the receiving end. You will need to take the lead here OP as it sounds like your DP is not ready. That's nothing to do with him needing to 'grow up' - you can't undo all of that conditioning with a click of your fingers. But you are absolutely reasonable to want your own version of Xmas so go for it. And when you do it, and the world doesn't come to an end, you will have set a precedent, and it will be easier for you and DP to set boundaries with his mother and sisters in the future. And heaven knows that needs to happen.

Oh, and in our house, Santa loves his bottle of Bud

If your husband has agreed - great! Who cares I'd he was being sulky and passive aggressive?

Whilst it's common for people to sped Christmas with parents, it's by no means the only accepted way of doing things and it's quite nice for children to have Christmas at home, playing with new toys.

Make new traditions - perhaps try and make it awesome for your DH too so he's more enthusiastic about it in future*

• I am assuming here that he is reasonable, but you've suggested you're sick of him too so your problems may be a little more serious.

Whatever you want is a YES , a go ahead, no matter how grudging. Get planning!

Sulking - try and carry on as usual. It is probably a result of his upbringing and not being able to learn to ask properly for what he wants with his domineering mother, and sisters. Ignore the sulking, don't draw attention to it and when he comes out of it (which he will, because there is no point) include him in plans as to what to have for dinner (easy stuff), when to have it, along with the children.