"I'm good for just one kiss, not legendary love..."

[FolkGirl]

I'm over halfway through my Sunday night bottle of wine. So please forgive me if this is utter rambling bollocks...

I'm watching I Married the Waiter for the second time this evening and I can't really get my head around it all.

I don't want to be unkind to anyone, or whatever, because this is more about how I feel about myself than what I think about them. But just to say that I don't understand how some of these women genuinely believe that these men love them.

I'm 39. Not unattractive. Not slim, but not overweight. And I don't believe that anyone would genuinely be interested in me. So where do these women get their confidence from?! It baffles me.

You are defining self worth by weight.

Partly. Yes.

But only as far as I'm concerned. I don't apply it to anyone else.

I just know that if I went to Turkey or Greece on holiday and someone chatted me up/asked me out, I wouldn't even have a 'holiday romance' with them, let alone believe they were in love.

But not even Turkey or Greece (they're just he countries featured). Any country, including England, would apply.

I know exactly what you mean. Not for a single second would I think they were genuinely interested. It is baffling!

Just there is a man now saying that he was the biggest lover on his island. She is smiling and she believes that he loves her. I'm not saying I think she is wrong, or that he is lying, just that she doesn't mind what happened in his past, she accepts that he loves her now.

I couldn't.

I feel like I will never have a relationship now because I will be competing with every girlfriend they've ever had. Every young, pretty woman they've ever been out with. And I can't compete with that. I don't know how to do it.

gin I've recently finished with a boyfriend. He wasn't English but living here. That in itself wasn't an issue, but the fact that he'd been out with French, Italian, Australian etc women previously was.

I couldn't possibly compete with them. And ultimately, I didn't. I chose not to.

But the women who are in their 60s/70s who believe that a gorgeous young Tunisian man is attracted to/loves them...

I just wonder where they get such a positive self belief from. I want some of it!

I don't think there's anything positive about that particular self-belief; they are utterly deluded.

You sound really defeated OP. why would you be competing with every young gf in the past? Not every bloke has had countless model-like 25 year old girlfriends.

they are deluded or desperate or both

that is all

so, let's say you have enough self belief to get with some 25 yo waiter from Turkey

er...fill me in on the advantages of that ... ??

Maybe your self sabotaging, why do you feel like your competing with past partners the fact is they are not with them anymore.

Have you ever been in love?
Were they, on paper, the best looking, smartest, most travelled, funniest, most interesting person you'd ever known?
Probably not. There is something about a connection between people that isn't dependant on their quantifiable attributes.
The same goes for you.
Oh, and those older women abroad you mention (and their male equivilants), it's not positive self belief but self deception. And more than a bit of exploitation.

Confidence? Some of them got conned. That poor granny, she was beyond deluded.

Margot Maybe not, but they will all have been younger and, ergo, more attractive that I am now and will ever be going forward.

I'm quite comfortable with my decision to not date/have a relationship. In fact, I feel really contented with that decision. But part of me would like to think that it isn't forever, but then the rest of me knows that it is because I'm only going to get older and less attractive. And that the older I get, the less attractive I will believe I am, so the less seriously I will take any interest shown and the less willing I will be to believe anyone.

I've tried telling myself that one day, I'm going to look back and 39 is going to seem so young to have decided this, but I can't not think it, because I'm going to be 20 years older in 20 years time. If that makes sense.

I think it's not being helped by the fact I've got a couple of married men sniffing around at the moment so I feel like I'm not really considered 'good enough' for a proper relationship, but I am good enough to be the OW.

There will always be dodgy MM sniffing around a single woman

they think you are desperate, but you know better right ?

tell them to fuck off and hold onto your self respect

you might meet a decent bloke, you might not (I think it more likely you will, but I don't think you want to hear that right now)

AF the things is, I get that. But I don't believe anyone is genuinely interested. That's the issue. I think.

Green Now, in this conversation, yes, I think I'm self sabotaging. However, the rest of the time, I just feel like I've got the measure of it all.

Wrigleys Yes, I have been in love. And when I think back, it's their imperfections that make them uniquely them and that is what I fell in love with. But I worry that I'm not enough as I am. I had some counselling earlier in the year and she told me that I value myself in terms of what I do rather than what I am. It's true. My life is very full. I do some amazing stuff, but I always feel like I need to do/be more.

And I don't think that 'perfectly imperfect' thing applies to men falling for women. I think I need to be perfect for that.

Left but she doesn't think she is deluded. She believes it. And, yes, on that occasion, I agree, she was deluded. But to her, the notion that a man could love her isn't fantastical. To me, it is.

For now.

You seem to put a lot of weight on the fact that love is all about looks and how attractive a person is. If they are attractive, they deserve love.

I am not a model, infact I have a cold, and I am snotty, sneezy. Yet my husband looked at me last night, refused to go close to my head, but said - I love you, especially when you giggle like that.

He loves the whole package. As I love his. I find him attractive, my friends do not. As I don't find their husbands remotely attractive.

Everyone fancies different, and it is not before they look good. It because everything is attractive.

Oh yes, AF, I know better. I'm not flattered by it. I find it all rather distasteful.

I don't want to hear it, you're right. But only because it feels/sounds like nonsense.

I have a friend who has been single for a very long time. She is now in a position to date. Her perspective is the opposite to mine. She believes that it doesn't matter who came before her, because she'll be the one who's there now and in the future.

I genuinely think she'll try dating for six months and believe she was better off on her own.

FG, remember my user name

if you still feel the same in 24 months time, you can kick my arse on the town hall steps, ok ?

Oh dear . You are measuring your self worth by who fancies you . You are externalising it and that's not good . When you like yourself everything will flow from there but I don't think you're ready to work on that yet .

Aussie That's kind of what I need to hear/read. I feel like I need to have it drummed into me. But it doesn't feel like a 'truth' for me right now.

If they are attractive, they deserve love.

That is how I feel. My mother didn't love me. She was quite open about the qualities that made me unattractive (and they weren't just looks based). I think I've always just felt that if I was 'attractive' enough, someone would be blind to my other failings, or put up with them, at least.

But I feel I'd be permanently at risk of being left for/cheated on with a more attractive woman because I don't have any other qualities that would keep someone interested/faithful.

Hmm, this is turning out to be deeper than whether or not I think a Turkish waiter would want me or not.

Dodgy married men aren't sniffing around because you're in your 30s; it's because you're single. I got divorced in my late 20s and experienced the same thing. It's because some men buy into the idea that single women are desperate and therefore fair game. You know that's not true, so treat them with the contempt they deserve.

And don't consign yourself to life as a singleton. I'm not going to promise you'll meet someone wonderful, but there some genuinely nice men out there, and absolutely no reason why you won't meet up with one of them. There are plenty of septuagenarians and octogenarians who have met and fallen in love; at 39 you're a whippersnapper in comparison.

AF ha, I might hold you to that.

Drum Yes I am.

a Turkish waiter would want you, but wouldn't try it on

and that is a good thing, you are too intelligent for a start