Useless DP - help me get some perspective please? (SORRY - VERY LONG)

[allofthelights]

I've been with DP for three years and we have an almost two year old. We met, fell in love/lust, and had a baby very quickly (at his suggestion - I sort of got carried away, I hadn't ever really wanted kids, although I obviously adore my child now).

When we met, he was on the dole - he works for a small company in the construction sector and when they run out of work, they close down the company and everyone goes on the dole for a few months, then things pick back up again. We're in a Mediterranean country and this is relatively normal behaviour, although very shitty.

The thing is, he has never once contributed. I had gone freelance about a year before we met and managed to build up an extremely successful business. As a result, when we first met I earned about four times what he was bringing in, so I didn't mind much that he never offered to pay for things, seeing as I had so much more free cash than him.

It's been like this ever since. All the bills have always gone out of my account directly. It's not as if they are excessive - we live in a normal bog standard flat in a normal place, and what he earns would actually cover about half of our expenses. But he has never given me any money towards bills, and even when I've asked, he's given some money but then the next month not offered, and I felt awkward constantly asking him - I feel as if he should just pony up - who wants to live for free?

I bought every single thing for our son, from cot to buggy to muslins, everything. I burnt through the majority of my savings that I'd built up through my business. He didn't buy anything.

Anyway, about a year ago I suggested we got a joint account so that his earnings (a living wage, albeit quite a bit less than what I earnt) would at least go towards our joint expenses rather than me not seeing even a cent from him each month. So far, so good, although his work situation continued to fluctuate. Since the end of July he has not been in work. I have also realised after some totting up that he is owed a few hundred euros for his final week of employment, and he hasn't been paid it. He's had a few cash-in-hand jobs through the same people, inbetween construction contracts, and is also still waiting for the money. Today, he went for a social visit to the people he works with (the line is very blurred between work and friends), to find out when the new construction contract would be. Apparently, they said it may be in the next couple of weeks, but there's a couple of days of cash-in-hand work next week. Oh, and the money they owe him, they're waiting on being paid by a supplier.

He recounted this to me all very blasé; it doesn't bother him at all. He is now without any income whatsoever as his dole pay ran out in August, and probably won't get another pay packet until November. Which doesn't seem to mean anything to him, because the bank account has money in it so he's alright. Meanwhile, they owe him hundreds and he's not pushing them for it and is in fact all ready to go and do more work for them next week, essentially for free, rather than doing something fucking constructive.

He has been lazing around the house since the beginning of August. Meanwhile, I have been working around the clock to try and build some savings back up. I am incandescent with rage at him over this current situation because I don't have the luxury he has of just deciding not to bother looking for work or just doing bits and bobs because my baby would starve. He hasn't bothered to look for alternative work and doesn't seem to care.

He is a good dad to our baby emotionally - by which I mean he loves him, cares for him, plays with him. But when it comes to providing for him or being a good adult role model, he's shit. I also feel trapped - I don't want to financially support another adult - he's perfectly capable of working but appears to have thrown in the towel as due to the financial crisis his sector did take a beating, but despite that there is work, he just needs to get off his arse and stop working for these "mates"!

I am sick of this. I feel used. I feel like I made a terrible mistake getting together with and having a baby with a man who to be fair I barely knew, and now that his true, lazy colours are coming out, I want out, but I'm terrified of the negative effect this could have on my baby. I also worry for DP as he has no money! I know this isn't AIBU, but am I being totally unreasonable?

I've never ever been unemployed, neiljames77. This is what I was trying to get across to him in our talk last night. If I were to lose my job, I'd work in McDonalds or as a cleaner, or in a factory, or as a waitress. I'm not above manual labour and my son needs to eat. I literally cannot get my head around his thinking.

Do you love him? I agree with all of the above but how about a temporary separation? He may just see the light - all you do for him and how lucky he is. On the other hand he might not and then you know the answer to your question. good luck hun x

I think we'd give him more of a break about the work situation if he was contributing at home. My own DH has been between jobs a few times but then he takes over all the household stuff so I can work more. Your DP is just useless all around, sorry.

Don't worry about what your family thinks. Happiness is the best revenge, and getting rid of this guy and setting up a lovely home for you and your son will make you happy. You would actually be fucking up more by staying with him and letting him sponge off you.

Oh dear you throw everything back in his face
Typical thing for this type of bloke to say to deflect it all back to you and take the heat off of him again.
Don't fall for it.

And fuck your family. You are practically no contact with them anyway and they sound like they did you no favours at all as a child so you shouldn't care.
Just don't repeat the pattern by showing your DS that this kind of man is a good role model. This will be what your DS copies as a role model and as a relationship model. Be the good mum and good role model and just get rid and do it quick.

oh, i just read you saying how you'd feel liberated without him - go for it then, i think thats a powerful statement to make. you need to go and not look back, by that i mean worry about him/feel guilty. He's an adult.

katiekatie I don't know any more. We don't have sex any more and I'm usually knackered anyway from working so much and the constant low-level stress. We don't do anything as a couple or as a family, unless I suggest something. I'm not sure that I do love him. I certainly don't respect him, and that's fundamental I think to loving someone, isn't it? I can't think of any positive thing he brings to my life. He's just sort of there, using up resources that I could spend on myself or on my son. If I imagine my life without him, I feel liberated. I'm just scared, because I feel as if my son should have both his parents together. I know that that's not always best - having been brought up a house where both parents actively hated each other, I think there are a lot of pluses to having separated parents.

Sorry - massive X post. Thanks everyone.

dreamingbohemian that's what I expect of him. And he's not even "between jobs" really. He has his job, and it's a crap job that isn't stable, but he hasn't done anything about it, ie look for another job. If he'd scoured the entire job market and there was truly nothing else then I'd be a bit more sympathetic, but he's just inert because it's comfy working with your buddies. Buddies who, incidentally, are a lot older than him and who have paid off their mortgages so are really only working for pin money.

I think I might print this thread off and re-read it over and over again to give myself the impulse to actually do something about this. Seeing it all written down, it's really not right, is it?

He's obviously just bone idle. You said you're in a Mediterranean country. Could he not do waiting on or bar work? I know it would mean you didn't see much of each other but the childcare shouldn't come into it if you work during the day and he does a few shifts at night.

It would really annoy me. People have to work together and that means not opting out of contributing financially towards household expenses.

You need to have the Cost Of Living discussion with him (if you want to stay with him at all).

And watch how you talk about things - he is NOT "giving you money". He is covering HIS Cost Of Living and that of his child.

Work out how much the rent/bills etc amount to and demand he cover half every month/week etc, if he wants to give the relationship anything of a chance. If you buy the food etc, include that in the Cost Of Living figure.

NEVER talk of this as him GivingYouMoney. He is NOT giving you money!!

Personally I think having a joint account with someone so financially piss poor and irresponsible is not the way forward - it just encourages him to think your money is his money.

This may work, though if he is a committed/entrenched cocklodger it might not.

It's not fair and it's not right; that's obvious and you've had that message loud and clear from other posters so I won't add to it*

What I would like to ask is whether there's a cultural aspect here? I spend a lot of time away from the UK and money has often become a point for conflict. I have found that a lot of people simply do not care a great deal about money. They're not lazy either, as such, and will work like stink in the the right circumstances. But somehow money is just a whole lot lower in their considerations. I can't explain it properly as I don't understand it, but it has occasionally struck me that they are somehow 'liberated' from financial worries. This applies to both men and women in equal measure btw.

This isn't an excuse for him. I agree with you. But I wonder if it isn't a factor.

• Except to say that I deplore the use of the term 'cocklodger'. From a feminist perspective, we can't petition for an end to terminology that demeans women and then come up with our own set of insults for men.

Just re-read. If you've lost all respect for him and don't find him attractive, it's doomed anyway.

BeCool I've done that. I downloaded an app last month called You Need a Budget which is like a spreadsheet where you can put in all your expenses. I showed it to him and explained that these are all the things we have to pay out for every month and so he needs to be covering half of these expenses. He just didn't say anything. He's so confrontation-avoidant.

He did use to pay towards part of the bills when we first moved in together. That lasted two months and then on the third month a family member of his was involved in an accident in his home country and he asked if it'd be alright to send what he would usually contribute over to his home country to help pay the medical bill. Which of course I agreed to. I'm not sure if he sent anything or not. The following month he just didn't give me any money, and I felt awkward asking because, well, what the fuck? Why should I have to ask him to pay towards the bills; he should just pay. It's not as if he was going out blowing money on himself; he was just frittering away his pay on lunch at work, etc.

He has just opted out of all adult responsibility. I run the house in terms of dealing with the phone company, ensuring our son has his place at nursery, all the admin sort of stuff. I wash all the clothes, all that sort of stuff. He's like a lodger at a boarding house. But one that lives here for free.

WhyTheCagedBirdTweets I don't think it's cultural. I mean, he made the decision to leave his country of origin and come to this one because he landed a job contract and apparently is really highly skilled in his field. That was a decade ago and that company went bust a while back so since then he's been in a less skilled field working for this crappy company.

I think most people would agree theres no going back once you've lost respect for your partner. It sounds as if you're pretty much a single parent anyway and a very strong woman - even if you dont think so, all you have told us about everyhting you do should be shared between you and instead he's a dead weight. Thats great that he has an emotional bond with his child but you should expect more from him.
Imagine yourself still in this situation in 6 months, 1 year...if things are no different, what about your state of mind?!

After reading all your updates: You will one day look back and be astonished you did so much, for so long.

Also, it has to be said - you sound awesome. You are like a little dynamo, and seem hugely capable. You sort everything out. I wish I was more like you.

He just didn't say anything. He's so confrontation-avoidant.
I don't think he's necessarily avoiding a confrontation - he's simply doing what he wants to and he knows you will pick up the slack.

My XP was very similar - esp with needing money for 'family emergencies' etc. He didn't see that it was actually ME who was paying for all his (grown up adult) families expenses. He did get it eventually (when it suited him), but I was resentful at having to drag him into a place where he was covering his CostOfLiving and behaving like a half decent person.

It certainly affects the level of respect you have for someone. Note he is now an EX.

You will one day look back and be astonished you did so much, for so long.

Oh yes yes yes to this ^.

I look back now and think "WTF was I thinking/doing?" carrying this guy who actually saw it as my role to financially support him and our children while he spent his money on god know what???? And when he was unemployed he lay on the sofa for MONTHS until a job literally fell into his lap (via a friend of mine).

I suspect that part of the problem is that what is wonderful when you first get together (whole days in bed, late nights, not a care in the world, going out in the evening staring into each other's eyes, drinking wine in the warm night air...) is hopeless as a long term lifestyle, particularly when you become a parent. For most people this just occurs in the honeymoon phase, so you weren't to know that this 'relaxed' approach is his whole attitude to life...

Are you attached to where you live?

I think that this is the moment for the 'Big Challenge'. He is highly skilled, clearly the market for what he does is poor here, he is not earning what he could. Present him with the idea of moving somewhere else, a different country perhaps. Work out some plans (albeit fictional) and see how he responds.

Hopefully it might shock him into a response and you will get the discussion or argument you need to enable you to move forward, with or without him.

To add, I sense from your posts that you are finding it hard to end things while he is being so passive - hence suggesting that you provoke a discussion about it.

If you decided to relocate, are the laws in that country different regarding paternal rights?

Annarose2014 you just made me cry. Thank you for being so lovely.
BranchingOut I've said to him that I have no roots here where we live and I don't mind moving to another place - before we met I'd lived in four different continents, and I speak plenty of languages so I'm not afraid of change. My business is such that I can literally be located anywhere, too.

I've said to him variously in the long stretches of time he has had either unemployed or underemployed to see this time as a bonus and to use it to upskill so we can go to another market. He doesn't speak English, which is a massive barrier, so I bought him a really good book and offered to go through it with him and even teach him (I have a TEFL cert so I could totally do this)... And nothing. None of this works. I got him the class schedule of an English language school and managed to get a discount on a course but he didn't sign up for it either. And I can't be expected to hand him his life on a plate. It is massively stressful trying to be someone else's career advisor.

It's as if the more dynamic and the more almost manic I am about making sure our son is provided for, the less he becomes.

He's just come over to me and hugged me and said "just love me". Which infuriated me. I said that it's really disrespectful to just expect that everything will always blow over and that I'll continue to accept the status quo. I don't want a fucking child. I want a man. An adult. Someone who's capable. What if something happens to me and I can't work? Who will look after us then? I feel under massive amounts of stress to build up a buffer and seeing him floating around doing sod all of any use and then trying to turn on the charm is just sick-making.