'I am not responsible for how you feel'

[CowardlyNNChanger]

If I ever mention that I am upset about anything that DH has done or not done, or a way he has acted, this is the response I get. I understand it to the extent that we cannot control the actions of others but we can control how we respond to them. But it still upsets me, makes me feel as though I am overreacting and causing myself to be unhappy.

Does anyone else get this?

What where says

Don't know where to start with all this, but others have mostly covered it.
I will add, however, that if picking up a few toys when he comes home is deemed by him to be work, how come when you do it, it 's perceived as dollying about all day doing not much at all?

He can't have it both ways.

And how about, next time he offers you a coffee, say "Oh, thank you, yes," and sit down and put your feet up while you drink it.

Op

If you said "don't talk to me like that, it's disrespectful." what would he do?

Cowardly I'm sorry you are in this position. Your ex sounds quite a lot like mine, very fussed about the state of the house when he came home to find kids stuff around etc (he once called me a lazy cunt in front of our three year old because I hadn't emptied the bins while he had taken her out to play for an hour - too bloody right because I was too busy collapsing in exhaustion with a cup of tea and having five minutes to myself!).
The thing is with your partner - there are GOOD signs that you can fix things between you. As someone said upthread its the ones who don't accept the idea of counselling or other help that are a waste of time. For example after a looooong time trying to persuade my then husband to go to Relate with me or just to see my counsellor on his own he eventually went to see her once, with extremely bad grace. Said absolutely nothing on his return and carried on ignoring me as usual the next few days. When I finally begged him to tell me how it had gone he told me that they had talked and then the counsellor had agreed that he was absolutely fine and it was all my fault and my problems that needed sorting out! I kind of believed him until the moment i told her this and she practically exploded with fury!

I think the fact that your partner has taken steps to see a GP and agreed to see a counsellor is a HUGE thing, and yes a sexist thing to say but especially for a bloke as I think counselling is more unusual and less talked about amongst men. I really don't think your relationship is dead in the water, if he is able to get some help and you then both get a chance to sit down with a third party and talk calmly to one another about the issues you have described (and those that he will surely bring up as there are bound to be a few surprises in there for you too). Its worth a try because honestly divorce/separation and all that entails is really really hard to go through.

My dh is a perfectionist. He probably harder on himself than on anyone else. If he has had a really bad day, he will come home and huff and puff and tidy things. It drives me nuts but I have learnt to ignore him. It is his way of "gaining control" of his life - he has had some depressive episodes. Give him half an hour and make him a cup of tea and he is fine. At no point does he make snarky comments, complain about anyone else, lose his temper etc. And this happens very rarely. He will then happily sit down with dd and chat about Blue Peter or whatever.

Your DH on the other hand, sounds like a complete knob.

I know full well that there are normally two people at fault in a relationship

I get soapboxy about this. Yes, in a relationship between two reasonable people with reasonable expectations, problems that arise are probably no one person's fault. But it's a trite little idea used far too often to unfairly share out the blame for what is in fact one person's shitty, disrespectful, unreasonable behaviour, which is what I think is happening here.

And the person who is reasonable, by their nature, tends to take the possibility on board that they might need to modify their behaviour, but the unreasonable person generally doesn't. As a previous poster said, you could drive yourself bonkers trying to figure out how to behave so you don't "make" him act like this towards you.

"And the person who is reasonable, by their nature, tends to take the possibility on board that they might need to modify their behaviour, but the unreasonable person generally doesn't"

This should be stickied.

I know full well that there are normally two people at fault in a relationship
This is trotted out by every vicious, abusive tosser and their entourage. Victim blaming at its very worst.
Abusers will also go to any therapy going. All that focus on them.
Only, as someone on MN thread there is no known treatment for being a shitface

Talking about going to counselling is not the same as going.
See if he really does go. When he has had several counselling sessions. Then see.

But of this is just a promise to keep you happy then don't let it lie...
And don't go to counselling together. Let him go and admit he doesn't like being around kids who fuss etc..yes a good counsellor could give him strategies if he is willing to try and improve so he can enjoy family life...

Oh yes - it takes two is another reasonable sounding statement which can become highly victim blaming in practice. It suggests equal responsibility where there may be no such thing.

It's akin to saying it takes two people to be mugged. Technically correct - but the victim didn't opt for it...

So much to think about! Thanks for taking the time to reply.

To answer some questions, my family life and example relationships were great, functional, equal, happy (at least they seemed to be). Interestingly, my mum is the only person who can see DH's perfectionist nature and calls him on it, telling him to relax, sit down whatever, and he doesn't argue. I don't know why this is but although she doesn't know the full extent of his nature it is nice to have someone fighting my corner occasionally.

His parents are lovely and have a relationship that, after nearly 50 years, obviously works for them. However his dad speaks to his mum in the most dismissive way, wont let her help with the washing up not because he is doing it out of kindness but because he knows she can't do it right. I hate the way DH's dad speaks to DH's mum sometimes and was determined not to allow that to happen to me, so I'm not sure how it has. He is really rude to his mum, to the extent that she offered to come and stay with us after DC2 was born but in her words, 'I would be more of a hindrance than a help as DH wants things done a certain way and I know you would end up doing everything anyway'. It made me really sad she felt so unwelcome.

DH is indeed a perfectionist and it makes him very unhappy. He says he wants to spend more time with the kids and yet when he gets in from work, always wants half an hour to himself to unwind. I have tried to gently suggest that this half hour might be better spent with DC and then unwinding when they have gone to bed but he can't see the wood for the trees, can't think that delaying his 'relaxing' might actually make him feel more relaxed as he gets more time doing what he claims to want to do.

My friends would describe me as self confident, no nonsense, capable. I am not sure why I walk on eggshells around him, I certainly don't with other people. I am exhausted though from having spent so long trying to make him happy, because I really do want him to be happy, we had some real fun together in the beginning and he deserves to be happy, but I am coming to the realisation that I might not be able to and that makes me sad.

If someone came on to a thread and said that their DH had 'told' them to tidy up, complained that their dinner wasn't made, 'reminded' them on mother's day that shirts needed ironing so maybe it would be prudent to do them asap instead of going out as a family/relaxing in the evening, I would advise them to tell him to fuck off. Which is where I can't believe I haven't said this to him. Well, I have in the past and it has made a slight difference for a short time but we always end up worse than before. So I have tried but it didn't make things better and I think I have given up.

Apologies, trying to give the background that pp have asked for. It is good for me just to get these things out so thanks.

And I don't necessarily think the relationship is dead in the water, but I am beginning to realise I have made all the effort and changes I am able/willing to. I feel when I am with him I am not myself and am worried I could lose myself altogether if we carry on so I kind of feel now it is up to him. But I think I am feeling strong because of seeing the counsellor and talking things through, I have felt strong enough to challenge him before and then gone back to living in a way that makes me unhappy and I worry that I will do this again. When it comes to my relationship I seem to be totally pathetic, sorry to use the word again but honestly, I can't think of another way to describe it. I want to challenge him and am not actually afraid of him, so why don't I?

I don't want this to be automatically the end but at the moment, I feel it might be.

I used to hear this a lot from my stbxh. It eroded my self confidence to the point where I dare not have aby type of response to things that hurt or upset me because he'd invariably make my life ten times worse if I did. This from someone who always considered themselves outspoken and strong willed.
Now I'm out of the marriage I feel that self confidence coming back and I speak my mind to him. He uses it as an excuse to not visit our DC because apparently standing up to him makes me a bitch.
I felt like my feelings stood for nothing to the person who they should have meant the most to. And he was responsible for acting like a dick, he just chose to make it my fault if I got upset.
Not a nice way to live OP.

All things can change. However I think you have to go forward thinking that if they don't, you are prepared to accept that this chapter if your life has reached its conclusion and you can move on without him. Without this, if you don't think its possible to end the relationship, you are always going to be accommodating him to keep the relationship at all costs, however he behaves.

The worst of this would be if your children also learnt there was no choice but to accommodate bad behaviour.

I would give him the 1/2 hour to unwind - no more than that I dont think.
Or else he unwinds in the car somewhere before arriving home.

A lot of people need that time. Or even 20 mins.

I would also google "How to live with a perfectionist".
And how to live with a depressed person.

Half an hour to unwind?
Are people really that precious as to "have to" have this?

Half an hour to unwind?
Are people really that precious as to "have to" have this?

Oops!

Rabbit I don't mind him having half an hour to relax, it is then draining to have to listen to how he never has enough time with the children and be expected to sympathise. In couples I know who both work, neither gets half an hour every day to relax on coming home.

I have now googled living with a perfectionist but DH's expectations have got higher and higher each year and I don't know whether I am always going to be just getting used to how to deal with him and then have to up my standards.

I am feeling so defensive because I didn't choose to live like this and I feel like everything is for him. I am so angry and upset, at myself more than him, but at the situation more than anything. The more I think about it, the more frustrated I feel.

OP, are you planning to go back to work at all ?

I suggest you get onto that, pronto

To be honest, I am terrified of what my life will be like when I'm working. He will still want things done to a certain standard and I will have no time to spend with the children at all.

I have offered to go back full time (easy sector to get back in to, have been keeping up with developments and doing voluntary work) if he wants to go part time but I said that his main responsibility would have to be the kids, not the house. He wasn't keen.

I can just about manage living like this at the moment as I have enough time to look after the kids, the house and him. If I were working full time, he would do his share of housework but the level he needs to make him happy is so high that we would both be cleaning all the time.

If I'm working, he will not be any better off in terms of housework, cooking, childcare etc. and I am still trying to make us both happy.

I am thinking in terms of his escalating unreasonableness and entitlement

I would not be a SAHM and financially dependent on a man like this. It is madness.

the very fact you feel panicky at how you would "manage everything" (by which you actually mean manage him ...) if you were to go back to work speaks volumes I am afraid

to look at it another way...you are trapped emotionally and financially by this man who by your own admission is making you "lose yourself"

terrifying

You see the way his parents are.

How exactly do you think he's going to be any different? Look what life's taught him, and worse, still teaching him.

I'm sorry love, he knows you don't like living like this, but he carries on regardless. Only tweaking his behaviour a tad to keep you just where he wants you.

Please leave him? Don't show your dc how to disrespect and belittle you.

Please go back to work, please.

Why are his expectations of the house if you are both working full time (a) more important than yours and (b) nothing to do with him in terms of workload?