Old friends, babies and do I bother any more?

[theimposter]

I have never been one for living in friends pockets but I have no problems maintaining long relationships and have always had an active social life through my 20s. I may not see people regularly and don't like having 'BBF's' like some friends do but I would say I am consistent and super reliable and always make the effort when required. Lots of my long term friends aren't local anyway but we can always pick up where we left off and I am always there in a crisis.

What's upsetting me is one of my long term local friends has become increasingly distant since having her twins. I am not hugely into babies but she was really odd after the birth (in fact I found out after everyone else that they'd arrived on Facebook which upset me as I was supposedly her 'best friend') and I was hoping now they are a year + that she might have settled with having them and make herself a bit more available.

It's got to the point that she rarely replies to my messages despite knowing that I have had a tough time with DP recently (I nearly walked out) and the last time she did reply said she had a 2 month 'waiting time' for free weekends to meet up with us. It's not enticing me to keep trying.

I recently had a small op which was on my mind a lot and she didn't even know about it! She's not really being what I think of as a good friend but how much of this do I put down to being busy with kids and how much down to just moving apart due to different interests now and the fact I'm not round the corner any more? DP says it is the twins taking so much time but I am wondering what the point of being friends with someone is who can't even reply to a text or voicemail within a week and only seems to want to spend time with her mum or baby friends? I feel a bit ousted :-( She takes bugger all interest in anything I do and I have tried to take an interest in the kids and be supportive (we've offered to babysit etc and have gone round and cooked meals in the early days etc) but the kids aren't great at being handled by non family members (cry a lot) and despite me making an effort to show an interest in return she can actually be quite sneering about my personal passion (kid replacement!) and it upsets me.

Do I just let it go or try and get to the bottom of it? Been friends over 10 years...

I don't talk about my animals non stop. I just said that she can be quite sneering about them.

If she sneers about your interests then she's a pretty rubbish friend isn't she? She might be returning what she sees as your tendency to sneer or be disinterested but still that's no excuse - if she's not happy with how you've responded to her situation she should talk to you or end the friendship. She might be trying to end the friendship by avoiding you, which is again, not a great comment on her character.

I would see the "two month wait" thing as a passive aggressive comment on something you've done.

I see all my friends quite sporadically sometimes once a week, sometimes every 6 months, sometimes it can be a year! But we are all fine about it.. It depends on what you want from a friend. Everyone has busy lives, sometimes I can be spontaneous, so can they, sometimes meet ups take more planning. In the event of a crisis or just need, we are there for each other, no matter how long it's been since seeing each other. If you don't put pressures on friendships such as having to spend x amount of time with that person, I think you are both happier and are better friends as a result. I am basically saying, back off a bit.. She is obviously busy and I am sure you are too? Having a baby, never mind 2, is more time demanding and routine changing than you might think.

She doesn't sound like a great friend to me. I don't have twins but I had 2 under 2 and you sound lovely and considerate, going to them, involving the babies etc. I wish my friends had done that!

People do change a bit when they have kids and it sounds like she's one of the people who thinks child free people have meaningless lives. Sneering about your pets is mean, she's a bell end but she might go back to normal once her twins are older so I'd maintain friendly yet distant relations and reserve judgement.

Can I just say that to some people their pets ARE their family. A friend of mine couldn't have children and her dog was the centre of her world. I think it's unkind to be dismissive of that.

True - my dog stuck around a lot longer that the bloke who I bought it with did!

Clint88 - I love your post! 'Bellend'! Hahaha.

Twins explains being busy, it doesn't EXCUSE rudeness. At all.

Give her some space OP and in the mean time concentrate on your other friends/make some new ones to have fun with x

Oh, I had a friend who did this. Possibly more extreme situation though. Distanced herself massively from me, always had time for her new 'mummy friends' (her words) but her oldest, childless friends got relegated to last on the list as easy to cancel on. When we did see her eventually I got lots of little comments about how busy she was and how I couldn't possibly understand what meaning her life had now. That was in response to me mentioning a difficult situation at work which was pretty awful actually, not that she knew that. So that was me shut down.

I had my first DC a couple of years later and it was amazing how she suddenly wanted to be BFFs again. Too late for me, sadly.

She doesn't sound great at the moment, OP. I'm sorry but I'd distance myself - you've tried, she's not interested, maybe in a year or two she'll want to resume your friendship, maybe not. She'll be very lucky if you do too, because you sound like a great friend to have.

The more I think about this the more annoyed I get that her having kids is a reason for her to be like this with you (taking op posts at face value).

I have lots of single/child free/not having kids yet/struggling ttc mates and as they are my friends their interests and difficulties are as valid as each other and I make as much effort to keep up as I do with friends who have children.

Since I had kids I have changed in some ways but I still like my friends and want to talk about their lives! Having children doesn't make you more special or important and as we see again and again on here, some people who don't have kids wish they did - so be tactful, and some are happy not to - so don't pity them and act like they're somehow less important.

I'll get off my soapbox now, sorry

I hate the 'you'll never know how tiring it is' thing... having two kids under two was more relaxing (and rewarding) than the pain in the arse (and two hour commute, each way) job I had previously.

Baby-tired isn't worse than any other tired. Tired is tired... if you see what I mean! x

A 'friend' who basically ditched me when she got pregnant about 18 months ago is suddenly dying to come visit me now she knows I'm pregnant Funny how she suddenly has the time.

As for the 2 months thing, I currently work shifts, 3 weekends out of 5, so between seeing family and other friends (some with children, some without) it often is 2 months or more before I have a free weekend - but then I would explain that and make an effort to let that person know I really do want to see them.

I have had this experience of a friend who has babies, and then suddenly is too busy to see her childless friends, but meets up with new friends with kids. I think just let the friendship go. And personally if she came back in a couple of years wanting to be great friends again, I would brush her off.

One of my friends also just had twins, and I never hear from her. I assume this is because having two young babies is one of the most difficult and exhausting jobs going. Imagine having no night where you get more than 4 hours of sleep, EVER, because one baby wakes the other up. That alone would be exhausting, let alone all the breast feeding, the physical work, the washing, and the fact that leaving the house is like organising a military manoeuvre. Seriously, give the woman a break, or better, get in touch and see what you can do to lend a hand, because right now she needs those practical kind of friends.

struggling - Nobody is denying that. People are talking about mothers who spend lots of time with new mum friends, and ignore older childless friends.

I can understand if your friendships arent really that important to you and so you want to spend time with new mum friends instead. But you can't do this, then expect to pick up old friendships again a number of years down the line.

But I do try contacting her in order to offer help i.e. coming round with food for dinner so we can see them etc but if she doesn't answer her phone it's a bit difficult Struggling100! Like I said I don't live just round the corner any more so just dropping by is not an option and I think that is rude anyway to just turn up unannounced.

Ditch her. Not worth it. The 2 month wait comment is SO rude! I can't bear women who disappear into the mummy zone when PFB arrives - if you have a partner and a healthy, NT child, there's no excuse. In my experience it's a particular type of woman who does this...

Ditch her. Not worth it. The 2 month wait comment is SO rude! I can't bear women who disappear into the mummy zone when PFB arrives - if you have a partner and a healthy, NT child, there's no excuse. In my experience it's a particular type of woman who does this...

Sorry, theimposter, you did say that and I didn't read your message properly! My bad.

I think my answers are being guided by my own situation too much, maybe I'm too close to be able to offer good advice. In the case of my friend with twins, I know through the grapevine that she has REALLY struggled through the first year- marriage nearly collapsed, knackered all the time, no quality of life at all. I actually suspect that it's been so hard that there have been times when she wishes she hadn't gone down this path, and I can understand that maybe having someone like me around who is relatively footloose (not to mention irresponsible!) might not be that helpful. I also think she probably just feels more comfortable with friends who also have kids right now because it feels more mutually supportive. Whereas I am sure she is reluctant to let me babysit because I'm childless and therefore lack experience, even though I might be well intended. I don't really know how to help, but I don't blame her for not being in touch. We will pick up again in a few years. :)

I'll be honest - I used to feel jealous when my child-free friends were suggesting times to meet up. I felt quite resentful... I wonder if this is what's happening with OP's friend?

Might be she is cutting herself off a bit because she's struggling? And too proud/fed up to say?

It is a difficult time, sure enough. I feel sorry for OP though.

... or maybe she just can't be arsed any more! Ha.

I have to say I have found it harder meeting up with childfree friends as they expect a night out the same as our pre-children days (understandably) and I'm just not up for that. It's so much easier to meet up with friends who have children as it's taken for granted that children will be there, no one minds the mess and the chaos and the running around after little monsters. It's so much easier as it feels like we're all on the same page, whereas with childfree friends I feel I'm expected to go back to a version of my pre-children self, which frankly doesn't exist anymore.

I'm sure that as the children get older I will come out of the fug a bit and going out will be easier and more attractive. But for now it just seems like a chore.

Cailin in my experience, most childfree friends DO understand and DON'T expect mums to be available in the same way any more (of course there are some who don't, and they are daft). Obviously work circumstances mean actually meeting up daytimes can be tricky unless they are nearby for a quick lunch. It's the total lack of communication that seems to happen that hurts the most. It really does feel like they don't want to know us any more simply because we don't have a child. It literally does take 20 seconds to send a text once in a blue moon. I think it's very sad that childless or childfree friends who were probably very close prior to your being pregnant and had probably been there for you in some tough times are so easily discounted as a "chore".

Caitlin - I never expected that. And a meet up can be half an hour for coffee with kids there. I think few chilless women would expect a woman with very young children to socialise in the same way.

I have lost a lot of friends since having kids. I think I just found everything really hard and if I did get a spare moment to myself I would spend it having a stare and enjoying not being touched by someone else or being expected to know the answer to everything.

I can't blame the childless friends who are no longer in touch really, but it didn't happen because I wanted it to - just because I wasn't able to maintain relationships which required anything of my old self. Hanging out with other parents is different because then it feels like a group of parents looking after a group of kids rather than the frustration of trying to hold down a conversation while simultaneously stopping someone interrupting/injuring themselves/running off.

I'm just starting to feel like myself again now my youngest is 3 and at preschool. If that makes me pathetic or annoying - well, then you can't be my friend I suppose!

The friends themselves aren't a chore, but making time to go out, getting ready etc is a chore. My fellow parent-friends are fine with children being there while we chat but I very much get the sense that childfree friends don't much enjoy watching me run around after my 1 year old who won't sit still for more than 10 seconds. And I can't blame them really.

Cailin you get the sense but have you actually ASKED them or are you just making assumptions?