Can a marriage be saved if he's having a passionate affair?

[Truly40]

First time on Mumsnet Talk - but completely shocked by my husband's revelation yesterday evening that he has been having a 6 month affair with his assistant. He is MD of a company, and has plenty of valid opportunity to travel away (and play away obviously!)
We have been together 4 yrs, and have a 2 yr old together and another 3 children (8, 14, 20) between us. He is 50, I am 40 and other woman - early thirties.
We have always been adoring and affectionate with each other, even during the last 6 months - and the only reasons he can give is that he's frustrated at my disorganisation, and finds 'family life' i.e. children - difficult and tiring. the children all get along well, and we're a close family - no step-family difficulties at all. I suspected all was not well, only as he seemed distracted and very protective of his phone recently.
He says he still loves me, but that he loves the other woman (who I know!) and is pretty sure he wants to be with her and the "idea" of a carefree life. he says he hasn't made a decision yet, and that if it had been the other way around he would fight to the ends of the earth for me...
However I've just been reading his texts to her full of "adore and love you hugely" messages, and which seemed to suggest he was going to leave me last night, and asked her to be ready to collect him - however we drank wine as all this was revealed and whilst he told her he was in the spare room, he came to bed with me and snuggled up and said we would discuss further tomorrow.
I have also just texted her asking her to please give us space to work things out, and begging her not to let him leave his family, and to think of the children. All very civil and polite.
Please don't say not worth saving - he's my soulmate, my world and we have a good life together. Yes, I'm devastated at his betrayal, but he's deceiving her also.
What do I do next, I don't know how to fight for someone who is on the verge of leaving for someone younger, prettier, in front of him at work every day, and carefree??

Please cancel the weekend visitors. There is no way you can go through this while maintaining any kind of façade.
Make him go. If he wants to salvage your marriage he will not go to her. Where he chooses to go will be very telling and help you make your decision.

Truly as long as he believes himself to still be in love (in lust) with the other woman then you have no chance at all of rebuilding anything between you. Yes he is confused but the only way to unconfused him is to tell him to move out. Only then will he start to sort out his feelings. When he is no longer living with you he can start to actually miss you. Not while he is there with you. If he goes to her, so much the better. He will realise what she is actually like as a person not just a fantasy figure. He will most likely not like what he finds either. The love (lust) will disappear and be replaced by reality. Reality that he misses you. But none of this can happen while he is still with you, seeing you every day. Kicking him out is the quickest way to get to that point (in my opinion).

BUT another thing will happen when you tell him to move out. You will at first be devastated and wonder what you did. Then day by day you will start to see that you can live without him and will live without him. You will value your own space and more importantly you will feel proud of yourself and start to feel happy in yourself again. Only small amounts at first. During this time you will go over everything (keeping a diary from now is the best thing to do ) and you will start to feel slightly stronger. You may find that you are genuinely not sure if you ever want him back. This time is important for you.

You will probably find that he wants to try again once he is no longer in love with her. You will have had time to yourself to then decide what it is you now want to do. Having had space and time will enable you to make a decision that is right for you either way.

I don't think anything can be achieved while he still believes himself in love with her.

Wannabe and Pobble are spot on.
You lost control of the situation since he disregarded Wednesday's deadline and you didn't assert yourself.
He's now having a bit more time to wallow in self-absorption and ponder what might suit HIM best, see who makes him the best offer and enjoy feeling like the centre of two worlds (or six worlds when you include your blended family).

Neither of you have made a decision, you've both waiting to see what the other one will do - he is waiting because he thinks he might get to keep the best of BOTH worlds.

You shouldn't have to wait, when he told you he should have told you because it is OVER, because he's remorseful, suggested marriage counselling, assured you it was a stupid mistake and cut ALL CONTACT with her and began working to show you how sorry he is and how much he loves you and that he wants to make amends.
He hasn't done ANY of these things, instead he's basically said "hmmm, it's a tough call, I fancy you both, I can't really choose - ooh the pressure!" he is openly continuing his affair under the pretence of honesty and it's just the physical element has been put on hold. Temporarily.
At this rate, neither of you will do anything - he'll keep disappearing to see (shag) her and continue to string you and your children along and you'll continue to feel miserable and desperate and the children will be affected by the sadness and tension and uncertainty.
Tell both parents, go and spend a few days with yours and let his come and stay - leave him to deal with entertaining and explaining to them and caring for your toddler - he needs to get used to single-fathering his young child and YOU need the space and a break.
You seem like a strong, intelligent and lovely woman and he is nothing but a fool, but he's taking you for one at the moment and it makes me feel very very sad.
The hardest thing will be telling people in RL because it makes it harder to go back or pretend it will go away, but in the long run it will make everything so much easier.
Be strong. x

It's a shame that while he's with you he isn't feeling so guilty that he actually gives the OW the heave-ho.

He can't bang on about his 'guilt' and then proceed to cruelly show you text messages between himself and his lover, surely? It doesn't add up.

If he felt truly guilty about the pain he has caused you, the agony even…then he would be taking steps to put it right.

But he isn't. He is compounding the pain, piling on the agony and continuing the cruelty.

I think you will feel better if you take some kind of control of the situation. Waiting, while he dangles you on a string until he has made some kind of decision, will be so painful.

And have you thought about how things will be if he decides to stay with you and you let him? He will think he has done you a favour… He will think you should be grateful for the sacrifice he has made by giving her up.

I wouldn't give him a chance to make a decision, and certainly not while he is still in contact with OW. I'd be taking charge of that decision.

Have namechanged because of the inevitable flaming I will probably receive.

Three years ago I had an affair. It wasn’t as long term as your h’s because I only actually met up with om twice but the emotional connection was there. In my case it was slightly different because the affair highlighted to me the fact that I no longer actually wanted to be in my marriage to my xh who was and still is controlling and emotionally abusive. But two wrongs don’t make a right and there was absolutely no justification for my actions, and the affair will remain something I will regret for the rest of my life.

But in my case the affair ended before my xh found out. But he found out because I had distanced myself so far from him by then that it was inevitable really. We had already talked about separation/divorce by then but he hadn’t known the reasons why other than that I had rebelled against his controlling behaviour, (refusing to allow me to go out, making it difficult for me to go back to work, moving us away from my support network) . When he found out he actually said he could forgive me and we could rebuild our marriage. But the condition was that I would have to break off all contact with the om (we were still friends but not together at that point). At that time I could have gone back. On the surface I had it all, nice house, financial security as h had a well paid job, all the material possessions I could have wanted and stability for our children. But I couldn’t bring myself to do it because in my heart of hearts the marriage wasn’t what I wanted. I had seen my marriage for what it was and couldn’t even contemplate going back there. Unlike your h though I held up my hands and said no and didn’t play any more games either though. My h filed for divorce on the grounds of adultery and I accepted without contesting it.

With the benefit of hindsight I should have just asked for a divorce but I didn’t have the strength to do it. But that still doesn’t justify what I did.

I am by no means comparing your marriage to mine, but the point I am trying to make is that if your h wanted your marriage to work he would have done whatever it took to cut contact with the ow and make you see that you are the one he wanted. The fact he hasn’t speaks volumes. You deserve better.

I am now in a relationship with the most loving, caring man and the one thing I love about it is that it is very open and honest with no secrets and no suspicion because everything is out in the open. He knows about my past and my affair because that’s not the kind of information I could withhold, but I can honestly hand on heart say that I would never, ever do it again.

But the refusal to break contact, the refusal to choose, the refusal to give himself back to your marriage tells you all you need to know about where his feelings lie.

You are worth more than being second best. X

So sorry you're having to endure this OP. I't happened to me 10 years ago. . I think you really mustn't just allow things to happen around you as I did. Assert yourself, get angry until he really engages with you on the matter and makes a decision. I say bollocks to all that calmness and dignity stuff. What men want is a quiet life, (at home and with their bit on the side), don't you dare give it to him. He's already betrayed you.

I say bollocks to all that calmness and dignity stuff.

You can still kick him out and tell the families while being very calm and having lots of dignity.

In fact, by letting him mess you around like this, you will be losing your dignity little by little, as well as your self respect. :(

Of course calmness and control for the children's sake. I'm saying don't let things just slip back into normality because you love the bloke. That could easily happen if you don't kick his arse, (so to speak). In my experience I discovered his affair, OW's miscarriage etc. I offered him discussion, reliability and understanding. He ended it with her - he told me. He started being all kisses and cuddles with me, and like a twat I let him.. He took me out for dinner, we were cuddling up to each other on the couch, and all was calm and lovely. Two months on he pissed off to Miami with a new squeeze, leaving me alone with two dd's.

I still think you should get out of the hellhole that your home must be at the moment, and leave them all for the weekend. You need time and space.

I would be surprised if the ow actually wants this pitiful sad old fart long term. He will be dead from the waist down in a couple of years complete with sagging balls.

Love is not something you do at someone, it is a connection. It is made of trust, respect, a bit of lust and compromise. If one of you is doing all the trusting, lusting, respecting and compromise, that is not love. If you are jostling for control that is not love. It dies if it's not both transmitted and received.

Even if he decides to stay, how will it work? What will you do? He's still in love with the OW and is refusing to break contact.

It's still about him isn't it Truly?

I think if my OH had told the OW what your OH told her, I'd have hit the roof and not come down again. You deserve far better than this. He is taking the piss.

And I agree with the poster who wrote that actually children get over divorce more easily than adults.

I usually feel sad when I read threads like these on here but after reading your update, I feel so angry, I want to break something: your husband's nose preferably. What a twat.

Truly, please don't be fooled (or convinced by your OH) that staying with him, even just as a trial, is necessarily the best for your children.
Children pick up on everything, even if they don't understand what is happening they can percieve an atmosphere.
My best friend is irreperably damaged by her parents staying together "for the children" despite huge conflict on their part. They chose not to get divorced so they wouldn't "affect the children".

The result is three sisters who have exceptionally unhealthy relationships with men and substances.
BF's eldest sister has slept with over 400 men, she is 23. She would go out and pull, shag them and then come out again. She also never ate and was extremely thin which she would then use to say "I don't both with contraception, I'm too thin to get pregnant". She has had an abortion.
My best friend has also slept with what she describes as "too many men" and is heavily into extreme drugs.

Whilst I'm not AT ALL saying that staying together will mean your children will get damaged (ABSOLUTELY NOT SAYING THIS!!!) I give the example to illustrate how "staying together for the children" does not equal happy family.

Choose what is best FOR YOU, so that YOU can be the best you can be - this will then filter to your children.

What advise would you honestly give your children if they were in the situation you are in now?

Truly, your dh told you about his affair. He was, and possibly still is, planning to.

He doesn't think you should stay together for the dc. He planned to go. Its all rubbish, what he's telling you now. Why else would he tell you? What, in all honestly, did he think would happen? Something else is stopping him going. Its not you, sadly, I don't think as he would know how you would react. Maybe the ow got cold feet.

He didn't tell you so you and he would have all this upset, and stay together. Its hardly strengthening your relationship.

Thinking takes time, and I think he's rushing you. And you want it over so you are too. That's why him leaving gives you time to process and think.

He's a total arse expecting you to rally round. What, is he running for president?

And I cannot believe he is discussing it with you. Clever though. Makes it feel like a consensus, involving you in his dilemma. All you think about is his problem. Not yours, ie what to do with your feelings and emotions. You've not been given space for that have you?

Lavender - that's interesting - what did he think would happen? He thought i'd kick him out. I genuinely think it's the kids that are stopping him from making the decision himself to go. It would definitively paint him as the baddie - walking out on your kids without even trying.
I think that's quite possibly why he wants to stay - so he can say " Oh I did give it a week or two - but your mum made it impossible"
This is a clever, manipulative, very rational man.
I'm pretty certain he can't give her up - so besotted, seeing her at work, probably sharing fag breaks and emailing each other like mad, raging at the evil wife keeping them apart. But I'm going to play him at his game, - rational, calm, sooooo understanding of his position, of course he loves the kids, of course it's unbearable to leave them, but of course I understand that he can't live with his OW, and therefore - yes, of course i just have to let him go to be with her.

The parents are coming - both sets have been told that we have some problems at the moment, and just to give us a bit of space when we need it, and to understand why I look like a bag of bones.
I can manage this with my head held high, with dignity, and with the knowledge that he's actually a weak, cowardly, pathetic excuse of a man.

My game face is on. Not to win him back - but to play him at exactly his own game.

Update after Easter weekend x

Not if it's passionate. Possibly if it was an affair with a librarian.

Truly I'll be thinking of you and sending you a load of strength and guts. Good luck.

For heaven's sake, go get yourself some self respect. What is your problem., you are putting up with this crap from your husband instead of kicking his saggy old ass out the front door. Sorry if I don't appear to have any sympathy but had me and my siblings not have been put through similar shit as children maybe we might have had a chance of normal relationships in adulthood.

I genuinely think it's the kids that are stopping him from making the decision himself to go.

I find this difficult to believe, but even if true, I wouldn't want to be in a relationship with him.

This game thing. Is this really a game? If so, how is this a winning position?

Truly, he had already decided to go. That's why he told you. You would hardly spill to the dc- well, perhaps the older ones but your 2 yr old? No.

He didn't think you would kick him out. He would have gone anyway, perhaps. He had already decided. I wonder if the ow has said " actually, fuck off" and he has told you - so now, he is creating all this to make you think he has chosen you.

I hope you've been to see a solicitor. He's not fit to lick your boots, frankly.

He has already made the decision to go - you are just hoping he will change his mind miraculously and choose you over her. You really need to get him to leave now. How on earth this weekend will work out happy is beyond me. Recipe for disaster I reckon.

Why is your game face on....what are you hoping to achieve....

Not to 'win him back'?

Thank The Lord for such small mercies....

I think you are hoping he won't go....and will be showing what a real 'trooper' you are. Entertaining all the family.

If you are prepared to entertain them all then good luck to you. Please don't be a Martyr to his cause....like a 'bag of bones' with your family worrying about you.

Take care

I hope he doesn't just go after the weekend to save face with the family.

I seriously cannot understand why you are still having the parents over the weekend. If so tell them exactly what is going on, why do you appear to be protecting your husband? Whatever happens now, even if your husband stays with you, you were second best and it will only have been for the children.