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Mumsnet has not checked the qualifications of anyone posting here. If you need help urgently or expert advice, please see our domestic violence webguide and/or relationships webguide. Many Mumsnetters experiencing domestic abuse have found this thread helpful: Listen up, everybody

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I actually hate my mil

426 replies

bethcutler13 · 12/02/2014 09:17

I apologise for the rant but there is a lot to explain!
I hate and I mean hate (silently hate she has no idea) my mil. To be honest from the day I went round the in laws house to meet them they proved themselves to be petty, manipulative, controlling assholes and I should have run for the hills! My mil screamed at my other half, crying and telling him he was a disappointment because he hasn't been over in 4 weeks (he had a rough patch whereby he kept himself to himself) and they could not stand the fact that since he's grown into his own person he isn't doting on them, calling everyday, visiting every week and smothering his mother in presents (she actually brought up that he never buys her anything nice when he visits!)
Since then, they've done nothing but bully him, make him feel worthless and guilty for not being a sporty, wealthy, sucsessful banker who visits his parents every other day. His mother has moments of screaming and crying at us, one of these being when we told them we were expecting...I got dragged on a walk with my mil where I was expected to explain myself fpr being pregnant! She cried and made me promise if my baby died not to try again until we were "ready" (shs meant they were ready, when it was on their terms!) They continued to yell and scream into the night about how awful it was that a 25 year old man is having a baby and he should be focusing on work blah blah blah until I snapped and told her she was a bully.
Since having my baby, she has smothered her...brought her ridiculous outfits (I have a tomboy she doesn't want your pink, fluffy, netted dresses) and manipulate everyone to get her way 24/7. They threw paddys saying they wanted us over every weekend which we tried to do but it's tough when my oh works full time and we only get 2 days together to sort everything and spend family time and now after demanding our time constantly and screaming and crying when it doesn't happen they've moved to Jersey because they've been offered work where they can make loads of money (theyre money obsessed and already have loads) and now when theyre back they want us to drop everything and spend every second with them, that or hand our dd over to them regardless of the fact they have moved away from her and don't know how to look after her and she doesn't know them!
They have been nothing but bullies the whole time I've known them especially my mil who simply cries to get her way and I'm sick of it. They offer no support, constantly nag and when we try to treat them and be thoughtful it goes unnoticed or isn't enough.
If she fell off the face of this earth I wouldn't miss her. If I had listened to her my dd wouldn't be here, if in my vulnerable hormonal state their bullying had got to me I could have aborted her yet they think they have grandparents rights? !
euggh!
Sorry :'(
Gelp?

OP posts:
IdRatherPlayHereWithAllTheMadM · 15/02/2014 22:14

if she starts being horrible to dp and belittling him I'll stand up for him and tell her I disagree with what shes saying etc

I had to stop going to my in laws before we have gone NC for about 6 months. I never ever heard them say a nice word to him, he was treated like the runt...we were even ushered out of a dinner party once, not invited too, whilst the guests were told " dont worry X ( DH Sister) will be home soon with her DH" rushing us out the door! We were an embarrassment to them! DH sister is Banker....

Anyway MIL would do something like read DH star sign...and it would say ..." very elegant" and she would laugh and say ...." goodness...thats not DH is it!"

This wouldn't sound much if she was putting down a confident successful man, but her son had confidence issues and other issues. It was relentless stream of put downs.

When I started in a really jolly way to say " Elegant! You don't think he is elegant? I think he is very elegant" ....after a while it sent her into a mad tail spin...she didnt react well...because putting someone down like that again show ownership.

Anway its a process you have to go through...but dont hold your breath that she will ever change. Hopefully you will change, and end up with fewer visits on your terms. And defend your dh, every single time she puts him down or tries to order him round.

You know she isnt going to like it, your in for a bumpy ride but when you get through it and you will! You will....you wil be living life on your terms...so much better than being at this womans beck and call.

IdRatherPlayHereWithAllTheMadM · 15/02/2014 22:19

but I think there is a book called toxic in laws, possibly by Susan forward. Might be worth a read?

I have been meaning to get this book for a long time, but mine seem under control and I keep forgetting. But I must get it.

I love my parents but there were lots of issues there. I can see most of them though but when someone else goes on about them...it can hurt.

The best approach is too look at the whole...see some positives...say your mum is a nice dresser, very funny they are obviously great business people....they do have positives BUT...BUT..I am not happy with x y and z..and I think its healthy to be able to say no to your parents...and you should be able to say no, you cant...please read this book!

MommyBird · 15/02/2014 22:20

You start 2nd guessing yourself cause you think..am i imaging that? Did that just happen?
You do sound so petty and sometimes, i used to feel like there was something wrong with ME.
It was only untill my mom was like...."is she allways like that?" I remember saying "You see it too!?"

She was abit Hmm to why eveything has to be HER way.

Toxic people have a way of twisting things and manipulating people. Your DH is brainwashed. To him she is normal because its all hes ever known.

MIL got intouch today.
To tell DH that hes had some mail. Its the 2nd time shes emailed now. I know why shes doing it to try and get him to go to her house.
I know this because (maybe Atilla?) mentioned it on another thread. Its called hoovering. Trying everything to get contact.

IdRatherPlayHereWithAllTheMadM · 15/02/2014 22:23

Toxic people have a way of twisting things and manipulating people

My MIL is the most spoilt princess who has every thing she wants materially a DH who enables and does anything for a quiet life....I have never known a woman do so little for people and yet expect soooo much in return.

And yet because she cries at the drop of a hat....people feel sorry for her.

IdRatherPlayHereWithAllTheMadM · 15/02/2014 22:24

mommy can you explain the hoovering more! We used to get this all the time.

springykyrie · 15/02/2014 22:29

I know I sound like a tolling bell... but please do be careful that you don't lock horns with her. I tell you, you will lose. It doesn't matter how smart you are, she will trump you and you will be aghast at how she does it. ('aghast' doesn't even sum it up tbh. It will tilt your world.) The depths they go to to 'win' just beggars belief - you couldn't even imagine it. Nothing is out of bounds.

Yes, you are smarter than her. But don't let her know, or show, it! All-out, full-on nuclear war will ensue (that has no end...) if you do. At all costs, keep it under your hat.

going to very prescriptive here: don't show any emotion, or show any reaction. I had something pasted up on my kitchen cupboard* for years: when they do their stuff, make bland statements like 'that's interesting', showing not a scrap of emotion one way or the other. Do what you want to do but don't let it show, don't trump her (don't know if that makes sense) - I suppose like dealing with a tantruming toddler: make statements - not nice, not nasty, but clear (but not in a bossy way - narcs will feel shamed by this which is THE red flag to a [nuclear] bull. Narcs have an extremely sensitive shame trigger).

So far she is relatively content because she has had you all moreorless in her power/control. If you make it clear that she doesn't have control... well, see above. Not being in total control is unthinkable to a narc - they literally haven't considered it.

As for 'she knows she's doing it' - erm I'm not sure she does. I don't mean that she can't help it so much, I mean that she is mad. Best not to disturb the beast imo.

*I tore it down with a flourish when my narc, who had tortured me for years (largely because I locked horns right at the beginning...), died. Little did I know that there are many more narcs that have crawled out of the woodwork since (had actually been there all along). I wish I'd kept that article!

MommyBird · 15/02/2014 22:35

Im sure it was Atilla who mentioned it a few weeks ago.

Basically. If you've cut contact, or have cut down visits.
They will try everything to get that attention/ contact back again..such things like:

"You have mail/things of yours/ here" "when will you be picking it up?"
"I need to talk to you about something very important"

and my MIL's number one..."i'm seriously ill" anything from depression to heart probelms we've had them all.

Also the enabler will have a good go (in our case its FIL) we got texts, phone calls and voice mails. Letting us know how upset MIL is, how she is going through so much stress and we are making it worse, how she is in bits..blah blah blah.

Shes very textbook.

springykyrie · 15/02/2014 22:35

NB 'my' narc was my ex-husband. I had to keep seeing him because of the kids. The advice above is if you have little choice but to continue relating to a narc. The preferable solution would be to cut them off entirely if possible.

IdRatherPlayHereWithAllTheMadM · 15/02/2014 22:38

Mommybird

You poor thing Sad.

How tragic that a mans own mother wants to bring such misery to the woman he has chosen to marry. I had to have a ELC second time round after the treatment of my MIL. They were not told about the birth of our second child, it was bliss...saldy they did find out a few weeks later.and received a stiff email to back off and not bring misery to the joy of the birth of our second, as they did with our first!

She contributed to my PND and honestly didnt care about anything or anyone aslong as she got her own way dreadful.

springykyrie · 15/02/2014 22:42

then you start to wonder if your the mad one

MommyBird · 15/02/2014 22:42

She honestly believes she has done nothing wrong and we are the ones who have been unsreaonable.
It's very odd.
She thinks the way she behaves is acceptable. She cannot comprehend that she is wrong in any way shape or form.

Im glad we cut contact. She is an absolute fruit loop.

IdRatherPlayHereWithAllTheMadM · 15/02/2014 22:43

Thanks for that Mommy and that's called Hoovering..Confused.

Yes we have had that too. There would be a family gathering, from over seas at their house, DH would say ...I am going on X and Y days...but that wasnt enough! He had to be there when they wanted him there! when he said NO, FIL would hound him with texts and phone calls....and come knocking on our door!

IdRatherPlayHereWithAllTheMadM · 15/02/2014 22:46

Mommy I am sure you didn't cut contact lightly, its a long road to go down and a hard one.

We have gone down same route and during that time she has turned his whole family against me. I used to be bothered by this. But I have since realised not many of my DH family actually care about him enough to talk to him directly and ask for his side of the story ...so I stopped caring what they think.

IdRatherPlayHereWithAllTheMadM · 15/02/2014 22:53
  • It's often in the minutiae that people like this weave a web around you so you can't move What joy to hear such a statement, so very very true.
MommyBird · 15/02/2014 22:57

It wasnt easy no, we'd not long had dd2 (about 2 weeks?) and the way she treated us vile. We couldnt do it anymore.

We had alot of guilt trips via texts off her then when that didnt work, (step)fil stepped in and tried.

I used to realllly hate her.
I just feel sorry for her now.
"Her" side of the family dont talk to her. She slags off fils side of the family to us then is nice to their face. She reminds me very much of a teenager. The way she acts regarding relationships...'this is me and Im not changing'

Shes lost her only son and 2 grandchildren because of her behaviour, and she honestly doesnt know why.

I just pitty her now.

IdRatherPlayHereWithAllTheMadM · 15/02/2014 23:02

Apologies if it came across as snide, brooncoo. I think I was more concerned that OP wouldn't doubt herself. It is very, very easy to doubt yourself when you're dealing with a narc

yes agree it took me years of wishy washy doubting myself to come to terms with what I had married into.

IdRatherPlayHereWithAllTheMadM · 15/02/2014 23:04

She reminds me very much of a teenager I see mine as emotionally immature. yes it is sad.

brooncoo · 15/02/2014 23:17

Agree that continually locking horns and trying to 'win' never works. It just brings you down and wears you out. However with someone subtlety manipulative (where you might doubt yourself) - confronting and locking horns can result in your excuse to totally withdraw and ignore (NC as such) if they go into meltdown and really show their true colours.

The problem I had with the points you picked on OP, about walking to the pub together and popping in - is that they are too subtle for your husband to see the problems you are having with his mum. I think it will just leave him feeling conflicted and that he might be over reacting. Think you almost need the melt down to prove the point that you have had enough and want to leave them to it. Then you can just back out and disengage as you have your 'reason'. No ambiguity then.

IdRatherPlayHereWithAllTheMadM · 15/02/2014 23:26

The Art of War by Sun Tzu

springykyrie · 16/02/2014 00:20

I would say (re locking horns) it is not just exhausting and depressing, it is dangerous. You're not an even match - you're a soft object (human), they're a titan (inhuman). [I'm not saying that morally, intellectually, whatever, they are greater, but that they will stop at nothing; whereas someone 'human' will draw a line.]

Just to add another death knell ( Grin ): she is rich. ime of a very rich ex (and ILs) he/they had the power and influence to indulge every possible revenge/control fantasy. Best not to underestimate a rich narc . Know your enemy and all that.

DonkeysDontRideBicycles · 16/02/2014 00:59

Just caught up with the thread, nicely dodged a bullet with the planning-your-entire-day gambit by PILs.
If DH can't yet bring himself to turn MIL down flat he is at least finding a good excuse to avoid being bulldozed.

bethcutler13 · 16/02/2014 04:21

mmm I think just because she is used to being a certain way doesn't mean she doesn't know what she's doing. she knew what we had organised (always does) and she had a total another agenda planned. I'm not saying she recognises how crazy she is and all of her behaviour but she does some.
I didn't want to go into her house. ..not for 5 mins A) because it wasn't just a gentle suggestion it was a thought through plan to get us round for the day (which she actually said at lunch) and B) thats where she abuses dp most in the comfort of her own home. for him telling her no there is 10x harder than in public because she's hidden away from everyone and can act how she likes. he told me himself he makes excuses because he's afraid of a tantrum.
I always have my reasons.
as for locking horns, ive done that in the past and it's just resulted in her grovelling becsuse I'll leave the house with dd, but her apologies are never truly meant and she never changes. just because im smarter doesn't mean I'm going to provoke her verbally or enter an argument. ..now that would be stupid, as mentioned there's no reasoning with her and as far as she's concerned she's always right.
It really is like dealing with a toddler! Sad

OP posts:
bethcutler13 · 16/02/2014 07:40

brooncoo just realised I didn't really acknowledge the point you made about dp understanding why we couldn't just simply go In...its a valid point and he DID think "what are you on about crazy lady we're just meeting there" so on the way home I did try and explain, but although he said he got it...im not sure he did Hmm
that's a worry for me, do I let mil get away with some of her maniuplitive tactics to avoid dp thinking im sh*t stirring? and just pulp her up on the things that are obvious to him too ? or do I go all out on put my foot down when she tries anything.
guess it's about choosing your battles. last thing I want is ME causing issues with me and dp. Blush

OP posts:
AttilaTheMeerkat · 16/02/2014 08:36

It's very hard to have a simple, uncomplicated good time with a narcissist. Except for odd spells of heady euphoria unrelated to anything you can see, their affective range is mediocre-fake-normal to hell-on-Earth. They will sometimes lie low and be quiet, actually passive and dependent -- this is as good as it gets with narcissists. They are incapable of loving conduct towards anyone or anything, so they do not have the capacity for simple pleasure, beyond the satisfaction of bodily needs.

There is only one way to please a narcissist (and it won't please you): that is to indulge their every whim, cater to their tiniest impulses, bend to their views on every little thing. There's only one way to get decent treatment from narcissists: keep your distance. They can be pretty nice, even charming, flirtatious, and seductive, to strangers, and will flatter you shamelessly if they want something from you. When you attempt to get close to them in a normal way, they feel you are putting emotional pressure on them and they withdraw because you're too demanding. They can be positively fawning and solicitous as long as they're afraid of you, which is not most people's idea of a real fun relationship.

Run for cover when they start acting normal, maybe expressing a becoming self-doubt or even acknowledging some little fault of their own, such as saying they now realize that they haven't treated you right or that they took advantage of you before. They're just softening you up for something really nasty. These people are geniuses of "Come closer so I can slap you." Except that's not the way they think about it, if they think about it no, they're thinking, "Well, maybe you do really care about me, and, if you really care about me, then maybe you'll help me with this," only by "help" they mean do the whole thing, take total responsibility for it, including protecting and defending them and cleaning up the mess they've already made of it (which they will neglect to fill you in on because they haven't really been paying attention, have they, so how would they know??). They will not have considered for one second how much of your time it will take, how much trouble it may get you into in their behalf, that they will owe you BIG for this no, you're just going to do it all out of the goodness of your heart, which they are delighted to exploit yet again, and your virtue will be its own reward: it's supposed to just tickle you pink to be offered this generous opportunity of showing how much you love them and/or how lucky you are to be the servant of such a luminous personage. No lie they think other people do stuff for the same reason they do: to show off, to perform for an audience. That's one of the reasons they make outrageous demands, put you on the spot and create scenes in public: they're being generous they're trying to share the spotlight with you by giving you the chance to show off how absolutely stunningly devoted-to-them you are. It means that they love you; that's why they're hurt and bewildered when you angrily reject this invitation.

AttilaTheMeerkat · 16/02/2014 08:39

Narcissists have normal, even superior, intellectual development while remaining emotionally and morally immature. Dealing with them can give you the sense of trying to have a reasonable discussion with a very clever six-year-old -- this is an age when normal children are grandiose and exhibitionistic, when they are very resistant to taking the blame for their own misbehavior, when they understand what the rules are (e.g., that lying, cheating, and stealing are prohibited) but are still trying to wriggle out of accepting those rules for themselves. This is the year, by the way, when children were traditionally thought to reach the age of reason and when first communions (and first confessions) were made.

Having a narcissist for a mother is a lot like living under the supervision of a six-year-old. Narcissists are always pretending, and with a narcissistic mother it's a lot like, "Let's play house. I'll pretend to be the mother and you pretend to be the baby," though, as the baby, you'll be expected to act like a doll (keep smiling, no matter what) and you'll be treated like a doll -- as an inanimate object, as a toy to be manipulated, dressed and undressed, walked around and have words put in your mouth; something that can be broken but not hurt, something that will be dropped and forgotten when when something more interesting comes along.

Beth, you indeed have my sympathies.

Ultimately I feel you and by turn your child will have to cut all contact with his parents for your own sakes. It is truly not possible to have any sort of relationship with a narcissist.