Gaslighting : ignore or confront?

[jadeddazedandconfused]

Hi, I have just come to the realisation that I'm being gaslighting. I have split from husband but still sharing a home.
Over the years I have found lots of 'missing' things in odd places or even in the bin. Mostly it is small items of mine and the children, sometimes there are cost implications other times it's just annoying and slightly distressing because he always denied it or blamed our small children even when he's hidden things so high the children couldn't have done it.
Sometimes it's been important documents.

Recently when I asked him for something that had disappeared and I'd searched everywhere he produced it and said I'd not looked properly (I had) and he said 'if I was going to take o
Today I remembered how when he was bullied at school he took revenge by stealing from their bags & coats in the cloakroom. I believe The hiding /throwing away stuff is part of that old pattern but it makes me feel unsafe, not 100% sure how to tackle it.

Hundreds of times I have asked him not to touch /move/dispose of my /the children's things but when met with blatant denial it's hard to know how to deal with it. I can't lock everything away being don't know what he will choose next.

I have thought about getting a box and just saying anytime you're not sure what to do with something just put it in here for me to sort out but I feel trying to do things on the sly that won't help
I thought I could mention the bullying story he told me but I'm expecting him just to laugh it off as usual and tell me how ridiculous I am but at least he'd know I'm on to him.

NanaNina gaslighting is when a person stages a situation to make the other person doubt their perception hence feels like person is going crazy. For emample the person may put their reading glasses on bed cabinet before bed. .but the other person who gaslights may hide the glasses. When the person wakes up they think they left the glasses their in bedside cabinet but they are then back in the their bag!

This a common behaviour of a psychopath. They enjoy the fretting and person thinking they are going crazy when things move around the house or get damage. A person who does these acts tend to get worse and can cause a lot of damage.

Yes thanks I get the picture. It is truly awful but I'm intrigued as to why it's called gaslighting and wonder if that is the psychological term as that seems unlikely. However far more importantly than me wondering about a word, I agree with posters who say the OP must get away from this man asap. I know that's easier said than done, but it is scary stuff. Do the perpetrators of this behaviour really understand what they are doing - yes of course they must, sorry thinking aloud.

I agree with the poster who said that the OP needs specialised help as this man used this tactic to get his own back on the bullies at school and he may be "seeing" his wife/partner as one of those bullies, and this could be dangerous. Is it a mental illness I wonder. I've just never heard of this kind of thing before, but think I saw a film about a bloke who did these kind of things to his wife.

NanaNina they may know that they are doing these things to their partner and make the active decision to do it but for them it is a need as it is the only way they can function in a relationship - as someone said earlier, to antagonise and get someone upset.

It gives them the upper hand and keeps them in control and they don't do non-control relationships. I see it as a sign of serious disturbance.

One way for OP to consider it is how she would react if someone wanted to turn her world upside down and make her face her demons, the demons she has probably been trying to hide since childhood. To a psychopath, right is wrong and wrong is right.

This is what you do when you confront an abusive man and the result is often very very ugly. It's the reason you never say 'leave the bastard' unless you know the victim is absolutely safe.

Gaslighting is the old B&W film where the man would move items when the lights went dim to make the woman feel like she was going crazy and the term stuck.

Parents with Munch H by Proxy do it to their children make them sick (for control and attention). Its symptom under Personality Disorder ie Psychopath (ASPD). I person who does this type of thing can get very dangerous taking things further

Could you try reverse gas lighting?

Ie when you find a document on top of the cupboard say "oh now I remember I put this here so it would be safe".

And then misplace something of his.

And then don't tell him things and say remember I told you blah blah.

Just to fuck with him. Because he's a petty jerk.

From my experience (not extreme like yours) the denials that he's done something is bollox, it is crafty because it make it difficult for you to tackle, you come out looking like the hysterical witch, because after all, he's completely oblivious of the problem, or so he makes out.

Eventually, I lost it totally with DH and yelled at him that it doesn't matter how he thinks he behaves, it's how it appears to me that matters, and, lo and behold, the behavior he denied doing stopped immediately.

So of course, he did know what he'd been doing, so if I was you I would tell him to stop this as you are bluddy sick of it and aren't his school bully classmate. He'll look nonplussed but deep down know what you are saying.

Not that he might change, but at least you have told him the truth.

Aussiemum78 your approach gave me a good chuckle thank you. Yes he is a petty jerk, I want to rise above it, although it is hard because I have no idea what it will be next, sometimes I don't realise something is missing until it's too late, what really bugs me is when it's the children's things, it's always art of a set of other things, so blatantly not rubbish and the kids and I spend ages looking for things, of course when I ask him he's humorously oblivious and as someone said up thread I just appear like an unhinged material obsessed harpy, whereas I have never been particularly bothered about possessions.

maggiemight yes I think I need to have my say for let him know I remember the school bully story and leave it with him to consider whether he ridicules me or not.

I have no constructive advice but wanted to offer my sympathies. My ex h did this for years, I honestly doubted my sanity. He was abusive in lots of ways but it was this that chipped away at my sanity and self esteem.

Thank goodness you recognise it for what it for what it is and you know it's him, not you.

LumpySpacePrincessOhMyGlob sorry to hear you went through it for so long. It has been happening here for years some so subtle I could barely notice it or I believed his excuses but now we're split up I see it clearly and also believe he has upped the tempo.

I am in the fortunate position of being in counselling and we have discussed boundary issues and safety but the counselling is very much about finding my own solution. This board is a great place to share experiences and wisdom. I am lucky I spotted what's going on and had the light bulb moment of remembering the bullying story.
I am not a bully I just came to the end of my tether with his weird secretive behaviour and rejection of me I have upset his status quo and he's trying to get his own back.

I have been very ill for a long time so haven't questioned things, now I'm assertive and challenging it's knocked him bandy as Delboy would say.

If you want to confront in a non-confrontational way you could print off a description of gas lighting and leave it lying around. At least then he'll know you're on to him without you having to say a word.
I also like the idea of reverse gas lighting.

You must get a lock on the bedroom door and keep it locked at all times. Just ignore the stupidity it is his way of keeping control of you and engaging with you, so don't give him that satisfaction. Don't challenge him he will continue to deny. He is playing games. Be prepared for him to up the ante when he sees you are opting out of the games.

Understanding his personality is the trick to seeing through his behaviour. Manipulative? Controlling? Angry? Paranoid? Selfish? Once you have worked it out you regain control.

Rather like the reverse Gaslighting . It sounds really rather petty and childish and I have never been on the recieving end . I loathe being lied to though and this sounds very similar .
Could you not move your own things into places where he would put them ?
Does he have a 'go to ' place where things suddenly appear ? Maybe being unable to find 1 sock of his every day would be enough to let him know that you know all about is little games and are wise to them . Socks always hide inside duvet covers ime, sneaky little tykes they are.

Get some spare keys cut and leave with a trusted neighbour if you have one , plus stash passports etc in aplace he cant get too in case he escalates things further.

Maybe the staright forward confrontational approach might work. If you are certain he has removed something of yours and hidden it and it isnt one of the DC's ask him straight out ' Where have you put my XXXXX ?' then do not break eye contact or say another word. His eyes will flick down and left and something on te floor will become very interesting all of a sudden .

You do risk him upping the anti if you gaslight back. But try and see what happens! I think if you hide his car keys he would then chuck yours away etc Putting lock on door also he will possibly annoy him to go further and ignoring his behaviour doesnt stop it in my experience. A visit from police would be the sharpe shock needed to let him know you are not taking this behaviour.
It will get worse otherwise as he is enjoying the pleasure of making you distressed.

When does he move out? Is he doing this to get you to leave the house? Recording this behaviour with the police could eventually lead to an injunction? He then would have to leave you in peace.

I'd be wary of antagonising him by trying to play him at his own game, no matter how tempting. This hiding of stuff and seeing you stressed, doubting etc about it - its him punishing you for perceived slights against him - the way he did to the 'bullies' (who may have been bullies, or may have just been children who he was jealous of or annoyed with).

He has already decided that you are someone he can punish. He enjoys causing your distress and believes you deserve it. It could be that he wouldn't do anything more than these sulky, behind your back ways of punishing you but there is a danger that he will escalate his behaviour. Concentrate on leaving safely.

You don't need to have him acknowledge that he is doing these things. Withholding this is the power he enjoys holding over you. I would just assume that he is the cause of any future suspiciously lost items and wouldn't get into the drama of the accusing him, his indignant denial and you struggling to prove to him/yourself that he's behind it. He clearly would love that too.

Get legal advice about whether you would lose any housing 'rights' by leaving with the children (I am not a legal expert, but would have thought you wouldn't), and make a decision about whether they are worth keeping yourself and your children in this hellish situation where you are all punishable by someone who ought to care for you. Its a horrible way to live, and as he is happy with the situation he will be obstructive about resolving it. If you do leave, take or store outside of the house everything precious to you and the children.

Good luck.

Iw will qualify this by saying my only qualifications are that of knowing a couple of manipulative fuckers

BUT

I'm guessing that he is trying to make himself feel better, bigger stronger by gaslighting you, for this to work he needs to think you are upset and destabilised by it.

So the flip side is to act the opposite, even if you don't feel it. Treat him with pity, like you would someone in the early stages of a progressive illness. 'Oh dear, you moved my keys again and forgot about it? Never mind, we'll find them. It's such a pity you don't remember isn't it'

Obvs, might be dangerous if you think he will up the ante. But it might get him to show his proverbial hand.

I think I need to have my say for let him know I remember the school bully story and leave it with him to consider whether he ridicules me or not.

That would be like a red rag to a bull. You're confronting him by saying you're stronger than him and he is weak. His weakness due to his childhood trauma is what he's trying to over-compensate for or push into the past.

You both need professional specialist help - it might be good to contact Childline as they are experts. They deal with historical abuse as well.

Christ I've got you mixed up with someone on another thread! So sorry . Ignore my last post although I stand by the red rag post.

I agree with spiritedwolf. All you will do is aggravate the situation. Just opt out and be wary of his reaction. He thrives on you reacting, so don't. You will never get him to take responsibility for his actions so don't confront him, it will get you nowhere. He will never accept he is wrong and his punishing you gives him power. Take that power away by not responding.

Haha horsetowater you are right about us both needing professional help!

Very interesting how opinions are split between confront and ignore the behaviour. My friends are astonished at how serene I appear. I just can't see how getting angry will benefit anybody, that's not to say that there aren't times when I feel so enraged that I just don't know where to go with the anger. I try to exercise if I can or absorb myself in arts and crafts or singing.

I have a philosophy which applies to just about anything! Any course of action really.

It is 'will doing xyz change anything?' If not it's not worth doing.

If you think confronting your H will have a positive result (and you know him best) then do it, otherwise ignore it all.

Sneezecakesmum whenever I've confronted things in the past he's just become more secretive and childish. I have to grow wings and keep rising above it. I have copies of some important docs at work, I will try and get together a box of the most important things and get them out of the house.
I'm quite poorly at the moment so I won't do it straight away but it will get done .

It's very easy to get a lock on the bedroom door. I would personally let him play his own games and not join in.

I am actually not saying ignore him, exactly. React to his behaviour, by keeping the things you value locked in your room. This keeps you in control, until you are free of him.

As to the kids things, explain to DC (with him there), that random stuff can be put in a hot-spot box, dedicated to their stuff, so if it isn't where it should be, that is the first point of call. Once a week (say), you and the DC sort out the stuff and put it in its right place.