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Relationships

Mumsnet has not checked the qualifications of anyone posting here. If you need help urgently or expert advice, please see our domestic violence webguide and/or relationships webguide. Many Mumsnetters experiencing domestic abuse have found this thread helpful: Listen up, everybody

I'm an ow

406 replies

fuckitanyway · 26/12/2013 22:08

I'm in love with a married man. He's my boss.

I am also married and have a lovely life. I love my husband and children. He doesn't hide the fact he loves his family and his wife.

I'm a member of mumsnet for about 7 years now - I'm not trolling - Friday night bumsex, Pom bears etc.

I'm not going to make the bazillion apologies I'm supposed to and know I should because it's ridiculous. I'm mortified, ashamed, I feel such a complete fucking moron at times. I keep doing it - so it's inexcusable and pointless and disingenuous to try rationalise it.

No one plans on leaving anyone. He's 24 years older than me.

It started one year and four months ago and now has run away with me.

I have attempted to post this a million times. I was too much of a coward.

I don't know what to do.

I'm sorry to anyone I've hurt. Could you help me? I understand and accept I'll be flamed.

OP posts:
CookieDoughKid · 29/12/2013 18:02

OK- I have a bit more time to respond.

I think OP, you're just gutless and selfish.

You say you love your family but I think your definition of 'love' is off (like really off).

And lastly, you are only continuing this because you are getting away with it. You've not been caught yet.

You say you are powerless but you're not.

If you love your family like you say you do, you'd stop now.
But evidently you don't love your family - and sorry I don't buy it one bit when you say you do because if you did - why are you continuing with this sordid affair?

CookieDoughKid · 29/12/2013 18:05

And might I add in my humble opinion I'm not being a bully. I'm giving my opinion and saying it how it is.

Fairenuff · 29/12/2013 18:06

feigning guilt and shame...and carrying on anyway

Yes, that's what comes across loud and clear on threads like this. And that's why it's clear the children most certainly do not come first. Shame.

saferniche · 29/12/2013 18:33

thanks Leavenheath - returned in kind several times over.

The problem is that real life fades out as infatuation takes over. If anyone's interested Baggage Reclaim is a good site for those wanting to get out of toxic relationships - this is a popular (and possibly painful) post: www.baggagereclaim.co.uk/letting-go-of-a-relationshipthat-doesnt-exist/

wouldbemedic · 29/12/2013 21:50

OP, my DP is a good man and I feel sorry for your husband, who is presumably faithful also. The guy you're seeing is not a good man...and he is the man you deserve.

Nothing is justifiable in any possible world if it destroys the lives of your children. There's nothing to say you'll never get caught - people get caught every day. As a mother, I have contempt for another mother who puts her children's well-being on the line for something as expendable as a bit on the side.

This guy sounds absurd. 'it's ok to have something of your own as long as your family come first'? You know perfectly well it would not be ok with your respective partners, who cannot be given the opportunity to give their consent to the situation because they probably would choose to leave. Well, that's an abuse of their rights, isn't it? Any right-thinking person would think so. Yet you're lapping up these platitudes in a bid to soothe yourself (troublesome conscience!) and the penetrating suspicion crosses your mind that he might be spinning you a line!! How can you find such a conveniently, deliberately thick person attractive and how can you stand being such a fool?

In the world you've entered into, you have a shelf-life. Like a courtesan. You've made yourself a lie and now you'll have to live it, in a saggy, wrinkly body, before too long.

I hope you are the only person who gets hurt. You sound as if you've lost your sense of purpose, your self-respect, your peace of mind. As long as it ends there.

nkf · 29/12/2013 21:54

What's the point of the post? I read the first post and couldn't see what the issue was. Happily married, having affair with very much older boss, blah blah. Oh me, I'm so bad. Blah blah.

lostdomain · 29/12/2013 23:36

Leaven, you said up thread that people keep assuming something is wrong in the marriage, whereas it can be as simple as: I'm bored, fancy a bit of spice, oh here's some available.

But that doesn't answer the question of why people use extra-marital sex to cure their boredom, when it has such a vast capacity to hurt and damage their children and their spouses? That's a pretty vicious thing to do to cure a spot of boredom. It's pretty vengeful. There must be some resentment running deep inside the marriage or the motherhood - that or some real self-destruct issues.

Happy people don't imho shag elsewhere. If they want excitement, they sign up for some mega sporty event that tests them mentally and physically to the limits or change career or go on a world trip with their loved ones. They create adventure at home and with the people who most care for them. It's instinctive to want excitement within a happy family or marriage, not apart from it.

Affairs put children's stability, self confidence and happiness at stake. They may be worth it if they happen because the marriage was lousy and the person needed a way out, but otherwise, I can't imagine a situation where sex was more important than DC. Not unless a person is sociopathic, narcissistic or harbouring some real problem at home.

Something isn't as rosy at home as OP says it is.

Fairenuff · 30/12/2013 00:07

Well it's pretty obvious that OP is only in the marriage for the lifestyle, so it goes without saying that she's not completely happy.

nooka · 30/12/2013 00:27

I don't think that affairs are always driven by anything to do with the relationship at home, or at least not wholly so. Sometimes the unhappiness/poor decision making is internal, some unresolved issue or crisis of identity in the person who is having the affair which makes them more vulnerable to an approach or more likely to pursue someone external.

In this case I don't know why the OP responded to the OM with anything other than a 'no thanks, I'm not interested '. He sounds enormously entitled and I'd be willing to bet he has had a string of women on the side with zero angst - he sounds completely self absorbed with his 'little smug smiles' at home as he gets one over on his wife and screws with his children's futures. If his wife ever gave him his comeuppance I bet he would be very angry.

Jackthebodiless · 30/12/2013 01:06

You will be found out. It's just a matter of time.

MistressDeeCee · 30/12/2013 01:17

I couldnt care less what affairs are driven by. Rather than climbing into another man's bed then climbing into bed with your husband - talk about share & share alike - then do the right thing. Give the unknowing partner a choice as to whether they want to be with you, or condone you having 1 foot in & 1 foot out of relationship. I hope the OP & OM end up together, as they deserve each other entirely. See what life would be like without the illicit thrill of a shag on top of photocopier or in stationery cupboard..

Leavenheath · 30/12/2013 01:35

IMHO there are two main flaws with what you say lostdomain and I also think the gender issues are interesting.

Firstly, I've never said (or thought) that boredom in a relationship is particularly a motivating factor in these types of affairs. Familiarity possibly, complacency definitely, but escapism from life itself (not necessarily the relationship) is probably nearer the mark. I also think the chronology is a bit wrong in what you say. It's more a case of: an opportunity presenting but not being seen as one, a connection being made that's viewed as perfectly safe, poor boundaries and then some realisation which is often unconscious that the new connection has added spice and drama to a life that was previously quite content, if not full of excitement and adrenaline all the time. This is when the addiction to that adrenaline and new life force takes hold and the rest, as they say, is history.

It's a very lazy kind of adrenaline fix too. Organising extreme sports, changing careers and going on world trips takes considerable effort and money. Starting an affair with someone at work where you have to be every day and even get paid for it is a low-effort and completely free adrenaline boost.

From what I've seen, these affairs are commonly entered into by people who typically need 'props' to get through life. They manage okay when life is going smoothly, but as soon as something happens to alter their equilibrium, they reach out for a familiar soother. The more inherently lazy and selfish the person, the more likely they will reach for a quick, lazy and cheap fix. The equilibrium distorters can be incredibly varied: getting older, altered appearance, new role or job, loss of an old crutch or prop, loss of an important life role, failure, increased stress and responsibilities.

If there's vengeance involved, I think it's rarely (in this type of affair) vengeance against an existing partner or children. Vengeance against a life that's suddenly got a bit difficult? Yes maybe.

I think you also might be applying a rationality and logic to people's decision-making that unfortunately goes out the window when lust and admiration take over. Lust and romance are incredibly powerful motivators and as long as children especially are safe and well and not apparently directly threatened, people believe that it's not as stark a choice as choosing sex over the welfare of children. People like the OP in fact kid themselves that they are better mothers or fathers because they are happy and that on the contrary, the extra sex and romance enables better parenthood. The realities of mental absenteeism, the lows that separation induce (especially at christmas) not to mention the extra hours spent after work or leave days spent on the affair, get erased.

That said, I do think there's far more judgement about mothers having 'bit of fun' affairs, which is ironic seeing as women who have them are more unlikely to lose residence with their children than a father in the same position- and so their risks are fewer. I also think people are more morally judgemental of women seeking extra sex, than men.

My view is also that it's an old-fashioned concept that people's partner relationships define them so much that any self-inflicted attack on those relationships is thought to be a signal of relationship discontent. We don't apply the same judgements to other 'props' such as alcoholism, drug addiction, compulsive gambling or shopping addictions. When those occur, we tend to look at the addict's life in the round; their working lives, their friendships, their extended family relationships, their interests- as well as their partner relationship.

I'm interested therefore in what this OP was trying to escape when she got involved in her affair and why she felt she needed a prop to get through life at that point. I hope she considers that even if she won't speak to us about it.

MistressDeeCee · 30/12/2013 03:23

Although I have zero interest in why the OP chose to have an affair with no intention of leaving her partner in the 1st place - spot on with all else you've said Levenheath. Particularly the 'lazy escapism' aspect.

When all said and done it is a shame women are frowned upon more than men, if they have an affair. However as they're also culpable in wilfully deceiving another woman - namely, the OMs wife - then I lack sympathy in this aspect.

zippey · 30/12/2013 03:46

Aren't you upset that your MM is cheating on you with his wife?
Best to come clean I think. It's not fair on your hubby or his wife, or your kids. Try to stop being so selfish and think about the people you are hurting?

GColdtimer · 30/12/2013 03:59

Op if your husband finds out then "no one is leaving anyone" is highly unlikely. You could well be out on your ear, limited contact with your devestated children and a good chance you could be out of a job too as your mm swiftly distances himself from the fallout.

How much of your lovely life would remain?. None of it I expect. That thought in itself should help you beat your "addiction".

NumptyNameChange · 30/12/2013 07:22

OP if you are still reading do think about going to see a counsellor. it doesn't have to be for long, could just be a few sessions snuck in to talk through what is going on and explore how you feel and why you may be doing this and what you want to do about it and how that can be achieved.

posting here isn't going to help unless you really were just after a good kicking - but you don't really need a 'wake up call' - you already don't like what you're doing and what you're risking. you need some help to work through why you are doing this (as opposed to a load of people's universal theories of why people have affairs) and how you can move forward.

there is nothing to be lost in going and talking to someone confidentially and creating a bit of space to catch your breath and step back and look at all of this. it will be aside from your marriage, aside from work and your affair, aside from all of it. what's to lose?

jojoanna · 30/12/2013 07:42

Leavenheath excellent and insighful post.

"The equilibrium distorters can be incredibly varied: getting older, altered appearance, new role or job, loss of an old crutch or prop, loss of an important life role, failure, increased stress and responsibilities”

Totally agree

bickie · 30/12/2013 08:08

Levenheath - great post. OP - not sure MN is the right place to get anything other than a lot of emotional kicking. In my experience (not my own affair - have never done that) but have seen a lot of it in my career - for all the reasons Levenheath pointed out. These things fade. Contrary to the experience of a lot of the posters here - I have seen many examples where the affair runs its course. Nobody finds out. And life goes on. Sorry to all those who have found out - it must be awful. But to kick the OP as if she is a sinner from the biblical age is a bit much - IMO. I am now senior enough in the workplace that when I see it start to happen/look like it might happen I do my best to council young women not to bite the forbidden fruit. I know of at least one case where I was successful in stopping the affair from happening. But it was from being empathetic to what was really going on in her life - not by howling WITCH from the rooftops.

NewtRipley · 30/12/2013 09:37

bickie

No-one has shouted witch.or anything like it.

NewtRipley · 30/12/2013 09:56

And to characterise people's heartfelt and considered reactions as a witch hunt and bringing Biblical references into it - reactions based on their experiences - is patronising.

You may have seen no fallout from affairs - although unless you have lived with the people you have counselled then I am not sure you can know that to be true.

saferniche · 30/12/2013 10:19

bickie - most people are suggesting that there IS something really going on in her life and that she should address it - however unlike the affair you stopped from happening (wish there were more people like you) the op has already waded in. She's not a witch, she's all too un-magical. And anyway mumsnetters' strongly expressed opinion isn't about 'sin' it's about honesty and consequences, most importantly the consequences for those (like the op's dh and dcs) who haven't been given a choice in the matter. Even if no one literally finds out, there are always consequences. One remarkable poster wrote on mumsnet about how she hasn't told her dh, but that she's worked very hard on herself, to understand her choices - which she now sees as essentially selfish and harmful - and to change. I suspect few people are willing to do that work unless they're discovered, and even then it's unusual.

saferniche · 30/12/2013 10:31

And: 'Sorry to all those who have found out - it must be awful.' You have no idea how awful. Just as awful for a man who finds out his wife has cheated. Really soul-destroying. No one should take this stuff lightly.

cannotfuckingbelievethis · 30/12/2013 10:45

One way or another the truth will come out....it always does.

Fairenuff · 30/12/2013 11:04

There is another thread on mn at the moment about a man who found out his wife cheated ten years ago, before they were married and he has been devastated about it.

It changes everything. It makes the person question whether the whole relationship has been one big lie.

Unless you tell your dh yourself OP, this will always haunt you, you will live in fear that it will be discovered one day.

NewtRipley · 30/12/2013 13:03

well said saferniche

This is not a philosophical issue to some of us. From whatever perspective - the person who has had the affair, who has been tempted but not acted upon it, the child of someone who has had an affair, or the partner.