Support for those in Emotionally Abusive relationships: thread 27

[CharlotteCollinsinherownplace]

Am I being abused?

Verbal Abuse A wonderfully non-hysterical summary. If you're unsure, read the whole page and see if you're on it.
Emotional abuse from the same site as above
Emotional abuse a more heartfelt description
A check list Use this site for some concise diagnostic lists and support
Signs of Abuse & Control Useful check list
Why financial abuse is domestic violence Are you a free ride for a cocklodger, or supposed to act grateful for every penny you get for running the home?
Women's Aid: "What is Domestic Violence?" This is also, broadly, the Police definition.
Warning signs you’re dating a loser Exactly what it says on the tin

Books :

"Why Does He Do That?" by Lundy Bancroft - The eye-opener. Read this if you read nothing else.
"The Verbally Abusive Relationship" by Patricia Evans He wants power OVER you and gets angry when you prove not to be the dream woman who lives only in his head.
"The Verbally Abusive Man, Can He Change?" by Patricia Evans Answer: Perhaps - ONLY IF he recognises HIS issues, and if you can be arsed to work through it. She gives explicit guidelines.
"Men who hate women and the women who love them" by Susan Forward. The author is a psychotherapist who realised her own marriage was abusive, so she's invested in helping you understand yourself just as much as helping you understand your abusive partner.
"The Emotionally Abusive Relationship: How to Stop Being Abused and How to Stop Abusing" by Beverley Engels The principle is sound, if your partner isn't basically an arse, or disordered.
"Codependent No More : How to Stop Controlling Others and Start Caring for Yourself" by Melody Beattie If you’re a rescuer, you're a co-dependent. It's a form of addiction! This book will help you.
But whatever you do, don't blame yourself for being co-dependent!

Websites :

So, you're in love with a narcissist - Snarky, witty, angry, but also highly intelligent: very good for catharsis
Dr Irene's verbal abuse site - motherly advice to readers' write-ins from a caring psychotherapist; can be a pain to navigate but very validating stuff
Out of the fog - and now for the science bit! Clinical, dispassionate, and very informative website on the various forms of personality disorders and how they impact on family and intimate relationships.
Get your angries out - You may not realise it yet, but you ARE angry. Find out in what unhealthy ways your anger is expressing itself. It has probably led you to staying in an unhealthy relationship.
Melanie Tonia Evans is a woman who turned her recovery from abuse into a business. A little bit "woo" and product placement-tastic, but does contain a lot of useful articles.
Love fraud - another site by one woman burned by an abusive marriage
You are not crazy - one woman's experience. She actually has recordings of her and her abusive partner having an argument, so you can hear what verbal abuse sounds like. A pain to navigate, but well worth it.
Baggage reclaim - Part advice column, part blog on the many forms of shitty relationships.
Heart to heart - a wealth of information and personal experiences drawn together in one place

What couples therapy does for abusers

If you find that he really wants to change
Should I Stay or Should I Go bonus materials This is a site containing material for men who want to change - please don’t give him the link - print out the content for him to work through.

The Bill of Rights
What you should expect as a starting point for your treatment in a relationship, as you will of course be treating others!!

Wow, thank you! I always go back to thinking my problems were nothing, really.

Fingers crossed for your plans... but more immediately, your job! (Woohoo!)

And that list - mm-hmm, that's realistic. But they are all about endless entitlement, aren't they? How dare reality get in the way of what they want?!

Yes thatsnotmyname don't you dare do any housework your full attention must be on him,

ARGHHHH FW has just been round as he had to take the dc to a party and bring them back, well all he wanted to do was talk.

Basically he does really love me blabla we argued and talked loads. Why do I feel I want us to try again, well I sort of do and then I remind myself how horrible he is. But I'm really struggling will be so easy to just let it go and jump back on the roller coaster. Although I don't want a rollercoaster relationship I want a steady line with little ups and downs. We argued again and the dc are around but they're just used to it by now

Just have to keep reminding myself nothing actually changes, he doesn't change he is just a prick. (but is he really maybe it is me)

I can picture how awful that party must have been, Charlotte . Yet another memory where at least you can be sure you've done the right thing by leaving.

My FW's list would be similar, thats. Depressing.

Muff, its him, not you. Thats the fog talking, trying to draw you back in. Dont let it.

Ive had an FW-free couple of days as hes been away drinking. Just me and DD, almost blissful. Is this how it could be? He did txt me one evening while away - Id put on my Fbook that I was having takeaway rather than the leftovers he'd left me to eat. His friend saw it and told him. Apparently I shouldnt have broadcast to the world about 'what an idiot you married'. Knob.

MuffCakes, conversations are such a waste of time with FWs. Avoid and avoid again if you can!

I know I know but I can't seem to stop myself shouting at him for everything hes ever done.

muff he's trying to draw you back in- part of the cycle. Do you have anyone to talk to about it, counsellor or women's aid? It is so hard to see it when you're right in the middle. My kids were used to hearing us argue as well. So pointless!

nini glad you enjoyed your takeaway! How ridiculous of him to think your comment was all about him. And to scold you for it! So the only contact you've had was him telling you off for something trivial that you wasn't even about him. So you have to feel on guard even though he's not there, I know that feeling!

I'm having a cup of coffee and some nice quiet time and reading 'verbal abuse- survivors speak out'. If fw wakes up I'll have to sneak it back quickly into a zipped pocket in my handbag. It is a great read. I am finding myself on every page.( It's by Patricia Evans btw) I need to fortify myself as I start my job tomorrow morning and I'm sure he will throw a lot of obsticles in my way, I've already said I will take the train rather than use the car, even though it's quick and easy to drive, as he'll make me feel 'grateful' if I do.

Urgh and it works every time.

Can feel my resolve slipping and thinking of the nice him. Will make a list now of all the bad things to remind me what he's like really.

Although I should apparently forget all the past let it all go and start again. This is where I start feeling its me not him, if I could just not care about certain things we would be lovely.
And if he wasn't a FW we would be lovely to but do we just have destructive relationship or is he abusive. Is all our issues resolvable or am I kidding myself.

muff I have asked these questions of myself for years and blamed myself for not trying hard enough! Ask yourself, how hard is he trying? You might see that rather than trying he is blaming you, and saying you need to do the changing... Don't let it drag on for years and years, like I've done!

And keep re-reading your list! So helpful to have specific incidents to refer back to. I tend to gloss over what are really terrible shouting incidents and brush everything under the carpet. It's great to go back and read about some things he's done... Or I listen on a secret recording I made of him shouting at me for having grey hair (wtf?) and remember how powerless I felt. V motivating.

Only problem I'm having now is the great waves of pity I feel for him... I also wonder it he's psychologically deranged!

MuffCakes you said Can feel my resolve slipping and thinking of the nice him.

This nice him probably doesn't actually exist, it sounds like he is hoovering and it's just another part of the abuse cycle. It may feel as if you're getting through to him by shouting and getting angry, but it's just feeding him supply. As a NT adult you'll feel guilty about your behaviour and he will ride the wave of his hurt feelings until you start to assert yourself, then he'll pull out the 'I DO love you' etc. and the whole shit cycle starts again.

I freed my mind and heart by realising that XH CAN'T love, not me, not our children, not even himself. It's tragic to be that empty and souless, but the damage was done in his childhood and it's NOT my fault. Just as it's NOT your fault.

My list so far

He's a prick
He changes everything up all the time, one minute he hates something and the next it's his favourite thing.
He's so pushy when it comes to sex it has been rape a few times
He's recorded us dtd without my consent or knowledge
He's slapped me (although he will say its a joke)
He couldn't even get out of bed half eight last Xmas morning to see the kids open their presents,
I don't like myself around him I'm bitter spiteful petty and jealous and miserable.
He goes through my phone my fb if he can and keeps going on and on about one time I refused to let him in and I must of had a man there.
He doesn't ever tell me what's going on in his head fr arrangements and then gets upset with me when I carry on because it's not what he wants to happen.
I'm so separate from the rest of his life, have never met his mum, dd sees her quite frequent but I've never met her.
He does whatever he wants to do and I have to go along with it,
I never feel secure for long periods of time with him,
Also there is always a issue with his ex wife urgh and I feel so jealous of her even though I was not a OW or caused their divorce.

Otoh he's the first person I would ring in an emergency, if the dc needed to go AnE (we have sat there all night before when dd broke her wrist) when I get tonsillitis he looks after me and the dc, when were good I really feel like he's on my side against the world, he can be so lovely and thoughtful,

I can never it out.

I cry more then shout high cost but yes this is a regular occurrence till the next time. I always do feel so guilty and wonder if I'm the abuser.

That'snot I really should do a secret recording, would be great to remember it all properly.

MuffCakes I would second thatsnot and (secretly) record any conversations. It really helped me to identify the lies and constant turning the blame around. During thebraintwisting arguments your mind is racing and you're on the defensive. Listening back afterwards is so eye opening, you can really hear their bullshit and manipulation. I listen to my 'Twunt Tapes' all the time...now they make me laugh at his emotional stupidity (it was awful at the time while they were happening).

Article in today's Observer.
Afraid the article is depressing and the comments even more so: all the usual - men are at greater risk of violence from women and victim blaming - these women have only themselves to blame.
But it does have a link to RISE if anyone is near Brighton - although I was a bit confused at their plan to send workers into 'working men's clubs and factory floors' - dreadful, we the working class are
Anyway - here is the article if anyone is interested.
www.theguardian.com/society/2013/nov/16/domestic-violence-survivors-abandoned-budget-cuts?guni=Keyword:news-grid%20main-1%20Main%20trailblock:Editable%20trailblock%20-%20news:Position3

Arth !!!!! terrifyingly unenlightened of the Guardian!!! speaks terribly of where they are at as a paper, especially thinking that it must be a working class issue and poor men! don't know if I can brave a look at such an ill-informed depressing male dominated article preferring to embargo the Guardian

i did have a peak.. and it does speak of coercive control and gender inequality biasing the power/control in relationships. They do it because they can! [men]

and the real issues of diminishing services and the tendering process undermining all the years of good done by WA!! awful.... reading on (just had to call back to balance previous comment I made prior to reading).

It does talk of the report into fe/male DV, which talked of one isolated incident, which the report says men are more likely to suffer than women, but not the coercive control which involves more than one instance. still reading

'coercive control is almost entirely a male pattern..'

I just don't get the 'commissioners' idea of sending these DV champions into 'working men's clubs .....' The idea being? Judges, Police, politicians, teachers, doctors, paediatricians, SENs, Pastors, etc.... don't do DV do they, Oh No! not at all. working men's clubs are the breeding grounds along with factory floors! hmmm.

It is a depressing read, and a true reflection of the damaging effect on women, thro diminishing services, myths, and bad advice!

The chestnut of female v male violence started in the US. It is based on a fundamental misuse of statistics.
What they did was to 'count incidents of violence reported to the police' and then report the raw data (turning the raw numbers into percentages does data analysis make).
There was no attempt to define 'incident' or 'violence'. No long term study of the effects of sustained abuse over time - no nothing except these 'numbers' of isolated, undefined 'incidents' reported to the police. These are the 'studies' people who have a vested interest in deflecting an open discussion of what abuse is use to end any useful debate by 'genderizing' abuse. I have never understood the logic of this - if abuse is widespread, then all the more reason to fight it on every front.
These 'studies' are ridiculously flawed. Not only do they not use any qualitative longitudinal research, the only criterion is 'police report'. And we, here, all know about FWs running about crying 'abuse! abuse!'
My own FW, like all the others on this very thread, was very vocal in his insistence on my abuse and threatened to call the police because I was harassing and stalking him (we were still living in the same house :( and I had suggested, quite forcibly for me, that we needed to talk about how best to separate.)
When, recently, a local man attacked his wife with an axe and then punched her in the face breaking her nose, both were taken to the police station to be questioned - she was taken there from A&E :(
It would be interesting to know how these 'incidents' would feed into the 'research' being bandied about.
As for it being all our faults - well we looked high and low for a sufficiently abusive FW, didn't we - and then stayed with them, despite such excellent understanding and support for victims of abuse, because we were having such a fun time.
Sorry, am in a bad mood - I don't even know if any of what I have written makes sense.
I HATE FWS!!!

And for those who espouse the view of domestic abuse as class based - the recommended reading is Ruth Rendell - actually, everyone should read her anyway.

Hi fingers hope things are working out for you. You and I are living proof that abusive men are not just poorly educated working class stereotypes. Our FWs are highly intelligent professionals but that doesn't stop them being nobbers!

Go Arth!

yes, recently there was a count of show of hands at local FP to see who's FW had reported the woman to the police for abuse!! Guess what, totally significantly supportive of your proposal that they [FWs] misreport hugely

I also know of cases where a FW has bruised himself in order to report a woman for abuse!!! Truly FWitted.

yes, sublime support out there, superb understanding of the issues, and well, as the for myths, very mystical ... hmm

The class thing, I only really know of teachers/priests/paediatric/SENs/childcarers/and other professionals (hate to put FW ex into anywhere near 'professional' category, but that is nevertheless how others would class it).

nobbers great word Kouign and well said

Think that article may have been amended today. was it different before? Seems to admit the figures are a bit skewed.

muff I am sorry you have such a list of horrible things that have happened to you but use them to keep yourself strong. you will get over him and move on to live in a happy freedom without him or maybe with someone who really is worthy of you. he is stuck with himself but thankfully you are not stuck with him.