Support for those in Emotionally Abusive relationships: thread 27

[CharlotteCollinsinherownplace]

Am I being abused?

Verbal Abuse A wonderfully non-hysterical summary. If you're unsure, read the whole page and see if you're on it.
Emotional abuse from the same site as above
Emotional abuse a more heartfelt description
A check list Use this site for some concise diagnostic lists and support
Signs of Abuse & Control Useful check list
Why financial abuse is domestic violence Are you a free ride for a cocklodger, or supposed to act grateful for every penny you get for running the home?
Women's Aid: "What is Domestic Violence?" This is also, broadly, the Police definition.
Warning signs you’re dating a loser Exactly what it says on the tin

Books :

"Why Does He Do That?" by Lundy Bancroft - The eye-opener. Read this if you read nothing else.
"The Verbally Abusive Relationship" by Patricia Evans He wants power OVER you and gets angry when you prove not to be the dream woman who lives only in his head.
"The Verbally Abusive Man, Can He Change?" by Patricia Evans Answer: Perhaps - ONLY IF he recognises HIS issues, and if you can be arsed to work through it. She gives explicit guidelines.
"Men who hate women and the women who love them" by Susan Forward. The author is a psychotherapist who realised her own marriage was abusive, so she's invested in helping you understand yourself just as much as helping you understand your abusive partner.
"The Emotionally Abusive Relationship: How to Stop Being Abused and How to Stop Abusing" by Beverley Engels The principle is sound, if your partner isn't basically an arse, or disordered.
"Codependent No More : How to Stop Controlling Others and Start Caring for Yourself" by Melody Beattie If you’re a rescuer, you're a co-dependent. It's a form of addiction! This book will help you.
But whatever you do, don't blame yourself for being co-dependent!

Websites :

So, you're in love with a narcissist - Snarky, witty, angry, but also highly intelligent: very good for catharsis
Dr Irene's verbal abuse site - motherly advice to readers' write-ins from a caring psychotherapist; can be a pain to navigate but very validating stuff
Out of the fog - and now for the science bit! Clinical, dispassionate, and very informative website on the various forms of personality disorders and how they impact on family and intimate relationships.
Get your angries out - You may not realise it yet, but you ARE angry. Find out in what unhealthy ways your anger is expressing itself. It has probably led you to staying in an unhealthy relationship.
Melanie Tonia Evans is a woman who turned her recovery from abuse into a business. A little bit "woo" and product placement-tastic, but does contain a lot of useful articles.
Love fraud - another site by one woman burned by an abusive marriage
You are not crazy - one woman's experience. She actually has recordings of her and her abusive partner having an argument, so you can hear what verbal abuse sounds like. A pain to navigate, but well worth it.
Baggage reclaim - Part advice column, part blog on the many forms of shitty relationships.
Heart to heart - a wealth of information and personal experiences drawn together in one place

What couples therapy does for abusers

If you find that he really wants to change
Should I Stay or Should I Go bonus materials This is a site containing material for men who want to change - please don’t give him the link - print out the content for him to work through.

The Bill of Rights
What you should expect as a starting point for your treatment in a relationship, as you will of course be treating others!!

Really impressed how you're breaking it down into manageable pieces and showing a lot of resilience, tweedle.

So, I am entitled to a reduction of court fees, because of circumstances. I have to provide a lot of evidence, though. Guess what - one of those bits of evidence has to be signed by FW. What a ridiculous system, where to divorce somebody I have to have their agreement?! He has refused. I am not surprised.

One of his gems today was that I "earn" nearly as much as him.

Pondering a reply of faux concern about the dramatic reduction he must have had in his salary and wondering if the fact he doesn't seem to do much work these days has anything to do with it?!

:o Don't worry, I won't really send it. I'll bin it, along with the one that says, "Whatever. See you at mediation, FW."

Pass him the tiny violin - sounds like he needs to play it so we can all hear.
Thank you Charlotte When I think about it still feels overwhelming so I am not thinking about it! Kids have been so wonderful today. I have realised that my take no crap approach is thoroughly appreciated and I have had no melt-downs. However, when FW came home for lunch we had 2 really agitated DC's for half an hour. I think it's his passive aggressive nature. They will ask him things over and over and get no reply. DD asked FW for some fruit for 10 minutes before he even acknowledged what she was saying. I find it exhausting so it must drain them so much.
Off to stay at my brothers tonight then the friend I work with, I'm staying at her house tomorrow as we're going to pick up my new bed. NEW BED!!! It's going to go in my NEW ROOM!!! Box pack total is 8.

Looking round the house you wouldn't even know I have taken stuff because he has so much crap that my stuff hardly makes a dent. He won't let me throw anything of his away. Once I threw some single socks in the bin and man, I never heard the end of that.

FW is in nice mode atm but I know that will change. He has been staying with his parents this weekend so the Me, Me, Me bucket has been filled up, but it doesn't take long to empty. He will need to create something soon.

You will so enjoy not having his stuff cluttering up your new place - it'll feel like room to breathe! I speak from experience, of course.

Oh yes, the not-hearing-DCs. I forget how difficult he can be to be around. Mind you, for the DCs that is normal - that is just what fathers are like. So I think mine are ok with it in the short term, it's just in the long term it's fucking them up rather.

Re the court fees, I think I'll try again tomorrow to see if there's any way round it and if not, I'll probably just pay the fee. £300 for the sake of getting the ball rolling and not prolonging things.

And apologies to those who have REAL problems at court to deal with - I realise this is very small fry... but then it's my first dealing with the legal system, really. I already feel out of my depth, so any resistance I come across knocks me off balance for a bit.

Go charlotte. Great news.

Hang on in there tweezle

Hello all

Fingers crossed for you charlotte, you sound like you're getting on great.

Regarding the FW, I still feel ok about that I think. Just wondered if anyone has any experience of it getting worse just before it gets better? Just because I obviously struggled at first, then was doing great, then at the 6 month mark took a real dip and now I feel better. I'm scared I'll dip again. I'm so excited for Christmas but worried that I'll get emotional missing him at Christmas or New Years or just general January blues. I've just been looking at the John Lewis/Refuge gift list and feel insanely lucky not to be with FW and thinking how bad my life could have become. But then I think I'm being OTT. Was he abusive? Would it have escalated? I just don't know.

I'm massively depressed at work though and counting down the days until Christmas break.

Hi Colin that sounds good (except for work depression, for which much sympathy).

'Was he abusive?' - Yes. 'Would it have escalated?' Irrelevant.

Hi
I am now around 5 weeks out of what was an abusive relationship and it could have escalated if i had continued, he had previously pinned me to bed and had been agressive. Im out, thank god, but it was so hard and i still feel a "hold" over me at times. I have blanked out a lot of stuff , to continue everyday things and protect myself from "breaking" down, i kind of had one of those lightbulb moments as in "what the f**k" happened and what was i doing. I feel quite traumatised by it.. how could i let a man try to take over my life, say abusive things to me etc. A lot of my confidence has gone, some of the things he said to me were truly shocking :-( all because he lost control over me.. Im am still recovering, at the time i truly felt trapped, truly. For those of you who feel the same, there is hope. I hope you too find the strength to get out. I can now have a future and it can be a bright one.

Maoam your name seems to ring a bell - do you have a thread? So glad your future is opening up to you. You are already healing.

This thread is a good place to mull things over if you need to, and we often share WTFwasIdoing moments (and WTF was he doing) - it can be very therapeutic and validating.

tspc, yes i did but it wasnt a long thread! I have been on here throughout the course of the relationship but namechanged a few times, as im sure many have as i got support to leave but went back a few times :-( I am truly out this time :-) that strength has finally come.. thanks yes it will open up to me im sure, i am just sad and frustrated with myself to have let it go on for so long, a waste of my life.. or a lesson?
i am at a stage now where i think i can open up a little, sounds strange, its like i can let so much out but then have to retreat again, like i can only cope with a small bit at a time. does that make sense? yes wtf were we both doing? but how dare he hurt me :-( physically i mean. i also need to get over some of the names he called me and also the criticism of my body. what a truly horrible f*ed up man to also criticise his ex wifes body but to me.. yuk. idiot

Well, I was with my FW an awful long time. For the greater part of that time, I thought it was me holding him back. It wasn't lack of education, it wasn't lack of experience, it wasn't a mortgage or debt hanging over him. After he learned to drive at the age of 41 it wasn't that. After we were able to run a car each, it wasn't that. When we came into money, it wasn't that. When we had our dream house, it wasn't that. By then I was beginning to realise that he was keeping me miserable and gas lighting me, and that even if he had unrealised potential, while it remained unrealised he was a cocklodger, pure and simple.

Thank goodness I could always go out on my own - had my own transport, could drive, could stay over at friends. Very very rarely did we go out together, and very rarely, until latter years, did he go out on his own. Although he worked a few days a year out of the home over the last couple of decades, and worked at home full time for the last couple of years of our marriage, he knew few people. Despite my mh problems I managed to find part-time work, not once but twice over the last 15 years, I have a good network of friends, and relations with my young adult DC are fine.

Because of a) the divorce last year and b) getting together with a long-time friend this year, I have been doing a lot of reviewing of my life - going back more than 40 years in fact. There is a lot of good stuff in there, not as much with FWEx as I could have hope, but many many good times, which have contributed to the person I am today. So although a lot of the time it seemed that I was wasting my life, in retrospect you may find, as I did, that in fact I was doing no such thing.

I'm 61 btw.

silvery I agree. One's life isn't just about one r/s. That can and does dominate, partic when so unhappy. But I think a feature of a fw's victim is that we tend to be very capable of enjoying life, despite our handicaps (a fw) and we don't at all need to write off the time we were with fws, because plenty of other stuff of value was happening all through that time.

breathe that is nice and positive. :)

Welcome maoam you will find here a good place to mull!

breathe sontaran I agree. i think it mAkes us resilient, excellent negotiators and also generally able to see the silver linings. it is not the ideal way to acquire those skills but they come in handy once you remove the FW. bit like making a pearl around an irritating grain of sand.

I know I am a lot tougher in a good way now..partly from having dcs and partly from growing up but also in part from just having to get on with it in trying circumstances. i don't give up as easily. i think more things are possible.

A friend of mine used to wear weights on his legs for over a month at a time just so that he could take them off and have one day of feeling like he was walking on the moon once you get used to no FW getting through life in general is a bit like that.

And there were all the good days with the dcs. mostly when he wasn't there.

Hello all,
It's so nice to have internet again. As you may be able to tell I've moved out, and my internet is working. I must be the only person to feel happy to have bills in my name.
I just wanted to let you know I'm ok.

Evil

Glad you're ok Evil & thanks for updating.

Who else by the way is seeing abuse left, right and centre? I thought a friend of mine had a nice normal marriage, though I do know her husband has had what she describes as bad depression which I have always sympathised with. She was telling a mutual friend that he regularly sulks for days on end without telling her what she's done, literally won't talk to her but demands sex. WTF?! He is too depressed to work but won't look after the children either so the smallest goes to nursery, my friend works F/T and has to do EVERYTHING at home. She was gushing about him on FB yesterday but I'm just . Maybe I'm being too judgy but my FW radar is pinging.

I think mine would be too, Colin.

Yay, Evil, well done - and I know what you mean about the bills; I just got the car documents through in my name and it gave me such a buzz!

YY to good days with the dcs. mostly when he wasn't there. And the point several have made about acquiring skills while in the relationship is interesting; I shall have a think about that.

Dear all, hello.

I'm sorry, I just want to howl today. I seem to spend lots of time wanting to bay at the moon like a werewolf. Even doing it some of the time.

Thanks to a brilliant counsellor and great firm solicitor I'd got to the point of filing for divorce. I'd managed to tell FW face to face I wanted a divorce (he lives in another country, so this took quite some organising, and I'm scared of him, so it took lots of courage). I sent him the grounds for comment. Two weeks later I took (less than) half the money from our bank account, set up a new one, and filed for divorce. I emailed him what I'd done. The writing has been on the wall for ages, he walked out of marriage guidance, I moved out of the bedroom a year ago, we now live in different countries for heavens sake.

And now he's sending me these explosive emails. Its like having him back in my head. Accusing me of not communicating. I feel in the wrong again. I don't get how I can get free of him. I feel I was only able to sneak away from him because he was preoccupied with work, and while that happened I managed to get myself a job elsewhere, move myself and the kids, and its like he's only now waking up to the fact and coming after me. He's meant to be having the kids for Christmas and is so angry he won't engage or confirm anything. And I feel really scared again after months of feeling safe. I seem to be really vulnerable to being accused of being in the wrong. I can make this choice too. I can decide its over, even if I'm the only person who thinks its over, my choice and views are still valid. But it doesn't feel like that. And him sending me these furious angry emails makes me terrified.

He says its about communicating, but I guess its about me saying very clearly, and with evidence, its over. That I've told other people and taken action. I wrote a very clear email. I didn't consult. I said one person can end a relationship without consulting. But its like hes in such a bubble of denial he thinks he can shout me back into submission. And its like I'm standing apart from myself and seeing how terrified I get from these furious emails. And I suppose, remembering how terrified I was by being up close to that anger. And scared, if he is back in this country for Christmas, that I might somehow be bullied back again. It really scares me. I like being free.

People who know me would say I was strong. I don't quite know how that dissolves inside when there is this torrent of anger. I feel terrified and vulnerable and helpless. I'm scared I can somehow get hooked back in.

Hi everyone, red I want to/have been howling to.

I am a prat and now I'm a pregnant prat. How great is that

Have no idea what I'm going to do, he surprisingly doesn't want anything to do with it or me now. I would of thought he would be jumping for joy at me being stuck dependent on him for a year or so.

I sort of want to keep it, but then he is such a cunt (fw isn't strong enough atm) and I will be stuck either having to constantly keep my boundaries up or be off and on with him even more. Arghh I don't know what to do.

red, howl away. Bet it feels like two steps forward, two steps back.

You are free, though. You can make that decision without consulting, and he does not have the power to get you back if you don't want to go. Gather around you the things that help you stay strong: a good friend? The fact that you are in a house he can't enter?

If you can break down your fears into specifics, maybe you can plan for them? If for example you feel you can't cope with his vitriol by email, is there a way to contain it, even get someone to field them for you and relay anything that's actually important for them? If you fear him trying to enter your house, speak to the police on 101 to discuss what you should do if it happens and get your house and number logged. And use the thread, too, of course. (Sounds like some Star Wars quote!)

Fwiw, I don't think it will be like this forever. I think once a divorce is through, he must (surely?) accept to some extent that this has happened. And you will feel more secure, that you can't be drawn back in against your will.

One can but hope!

Oh Muff. :( What a terrible decision to have to make. Take your time over it. for you, too.

I have no idea what I'm going to do, I do actually want it but then I think how hard it will be. He shouted and shouted at me when I told him, brought up loads of old arguments and said why would I really want to bring a child into us. He has a point but I have done two dc on my own I can do 3.

It's not just how hard being a lone parent is, though - it's the other parent the child will have. Plus the fact that you would be tied to FW for another - how many? 5? years. (I don't know how old your others are.) And the fact that you haven't sorted out your boundaries with him yet - it's going to be way harder to do that with raging hormones and sleep deprivation.

Otoh, I realise that's easy for me to say - and tbh I'm not sure I would be able to have an abortion, so I'm just very glad that I never had to make that decision.

Then again, I did have to make a decision about whether to get pregnant with DC4 or not. All the pointers were against having it, except one: FW wants it. And that was the one I didn't feel I could say no to. So I talked myself round on every single other thing.

Boy, did I pay. It was much, much harder than I every thought. For YEARS.

Still am paying the price of that decision, really - always will. Wouldn't be without DC4 now, of course - but barely a day goes by when I don't wish I had more time for each child, more energy for day-to-day life.

red I totally get the scared thing. You are obviously a very decent person for making yourself tell him face to face. I find that pretending I'm a braver person than I actually am helps. After a bit you almost start believing it ;)

I think at this stage he's lost his right to moan at you about communication. I mean he must be equally bad if not worse if nows the first time he's objected.

muff (((hugs))) for you. Are you physically ok? It's a huge decision and take your time

Shit! Just read through the verbally abusive / emotional abusive links. I don 't think I was in a 'bad case' but there is a lot in there I can recognise in my own relationship...
I knew I was right to find an end to this, but going through the mill at the moment. Thanks MN for giving me some convincing evidence that I'm doing the right thing!