Marrying into a middle class family

[derbyshire]

I'm working class, fairly well educated but sometimes find myself adrift with my MC in-laws. Been married for 15 years, 3 children in primary school. I think most people would say I'm a good mother: BF kids, they're all doing well at school, nice children etc. but often feel I'm just aping the middle-class mores around me.
My ILs don't understand why I'm not more chilled about birthday parties/dinner parties etc but I've never admitted to them that I never had a birthday party when I was young. Certainly no such thing as a dinner party - dinner was something you ate at noon and never in somebody elses's house!
I get so stressed about all those things they find "normal". I've never joined in with the forcing kids to eat veg - my fussy kids eat more veg than my mother! She won't cook for her GC as she said she didn't know how to cook that "stuff" (pasta).
I admit I'm ashamed to admit how much my childhood varies from their upbringing - food really is a class issue!
Strangely enough, educationally I probably outrank them - its all the niceties of life where I'm lacking. Think I'm probably considered "weird" but we never had drinks/socialising at home. I think the gap has become more pronounced as the years have gone on........just find myself struggling more as the years have gone on. Suppose it just feels more and more false.

Some good sense/information re fish knives here

I have some fish knives and cake forks that were inherited from my maternal grandmother's side of the family. They were solidly middle-class German Jews and having silverware/'good cutlery' was important in their circles.

I like using them because of the link to the past. Many of their possessions couldn't be taken out of Germany when people emigrated after 1933. Some of the possessions that did get over the UK got destroyed during the Blitz.

So it's possible to use these things for personal/historical reasons rather than as some kind of game whereby some people are 'in' and other people are 'out.'

Nod and smile. Nod and smile.

oh Morris that's so MC!

See, you'll probably take that as an insult. Or that I have a 'chip' to say so. We all have a culture, a 'way of doing things' and it isn't until it is threatened that you realise it's there.

Spend some time on, say, a WC housing estate, or a WC secondary school, and it would become glaringly obvious that you are MC and approach life through a MC mindset. Denying you are is a bit annoying tbh. As is denying that ILs can be very upsetting.

I didn't deny that I'm middle class!

Does this go both ways? Am I allowed to lambast my MILs working class ways, and get sympathy?

Of course some people/ inlaws are epically annoying, but my point is that being annoying or rude etc is not a class thing.

I don't think that was your point about ILs, Morris re:

If I'm honest I've never understood the level to which people get upset about their inlaws on here.

No mention of class there?

You won't be allowed to lambast your ILs for their WC ways because that would be seen as the height of unPC, snobbery. Though it wouldn't be, it's just that class is a very touchy subject. My family can be staggeringly ignorant in a WC way. I can say it because I'm WC, I suppose - I'd wince at someone else saying it, even though it's true. But if someone sniped at them for holding a fork like a pencil, that would be nasty.

Perhaps it goes that we can take a pop at people who have some power, therefore responsibility; but it's not ok to take a pop at people who have none.

I do find that it is the MC who insist class is irrelevant - or that 'we're all MC'. Or, even, that we're classless

A knife like a pencil ffs! Bleeding hell.

I do find that it is the MC who insist class is irrelevant - or that 'we're all MC'. Or, even, that we're classless

I agree.

Normally said by MC who are rarely taken out of their comfort zone and surround themselves with other MC. Thus ignoring the existence of any other class.

I think the WC are very much aware of the class divide.

But be honest, traditional social class boundaries are shifting rapidly. Home ownership, further education etc were once the preserve of MC, but now much more common across all sectors.

Social mobility exists, my parents are living proof. They were both brought up in council houses, by parents who didn't read. Both now v much Guardian reading, MC lentil munchers. Houses rammed with books, culture up the wazoo. Dust everywhere.

I'm definitely MC, my partner was raised WC and now straddles both camps. Our son will be very much MC.

I don't accept that I can be slagged off with impunity because I have 'power'. Look at the younger generation - none of them can afford home ownership. It's not as if being raised with certain values or culture gives you a free pass to success.

On most class threads on here its the MC who are accused of being class obsessed.

sorry, that's not much use. Maybe someone will come along to argue your points more succinctly than I can, Morris

On most class threads on here its the MC who are accused of being class obsessed
hell yeh - after a lifetime of unpleasant comments from working class heroes (self perceived) including some in my own family - it would almost be amusing if it didnt piss me off so much.

That's all very materialistic Morris. And tbh you are proving the point made by the OP. She has moved into the realms of the MC, by way of education, marriage, money etc.

So on paper she is MC, but in reality she is WC. Partly due to the unwritten rules that she didn't learn in her WC environment.

There aren't any unwritten rules in my environment. The OPs MIL sounds annoying.

We have mixed plates, cutlery etc and nobody gives a toss who uses what.

My parents were born WC, and are now MC. They aren't pretending, nor am I. Class mobility does exist.

There are always rules. Though sometimes you only discover what your own rules are when somebody comes in who has a completely different set.

So do WC people have a set of unspoken rules too?

yes they do, the main one being some kind of innate superiority a la burchill.
another one is - 'thou shalt consume Heinz Salad Cream'

ewww that's a bit snobby burberry . Nobody has sneered at the MCs yet on this thread

BUN FIGHT

Don't be foolish, of course there are unwritten rules! Everywhere, always! You don't say 'I'm going to open the door now'. Culture is about unwritten rules.

personally i have found the most snobbish people to be working class heroes....but there u go!

So basically we can slag off MC all day long but to make any generalisations about WC is snobby and sneering.

yep spot on Zapp, exactly

All For One and One For.... you two

Read back through the thread. No-one has slagged off the MCs, been snobby or sneering about the MCs. It's only you two who have introduced snobbery and sneering.

Guardian, you say? I'd change that iiwy. You'd be more suited to the fail

I blame the heat

Springy, read your post of 15.59 yesterday. That isn't slagging the MC? Really?

I have no idea why you think I should read the Mail, but I'm open to hearing it.

jeez i only mentioned salad creme!