Finding a nice single man?

[Impossibleornot]

I'm a regular who has name changed and I am ready for the flaming that I will no doubt get

I have read so many threads on here from OW and about OW that suggest they go and find themselves a single man and leave the MM alone.

Ive been seeing a MM for 18 months. I love him, he loves me. We have an understanding, he wont leave his wife (he loves her and their children) and I dont want a full time relationship as I have children and I dont want to bring another man into their lives, they already have a Dad.

Because I know that we cannot be together I have never closed my eyes to the option of meeting someone else. Oh and I have met plenty of men, problem is, they are all complete nobs!! In 4 years of being single I have never met an available man who dos not have something wrong with him.

So in summary, I KNOW I shouldnt be seeing a MM, but my alternative is to be single (I hate being single, I need to kiss and cuddle someone, I feel desperately lonely when I dont have someone) or to go for 'second best' in which case I might as well have stayed unhappily married as my EX is more normal than most of the blokes I meet.

I am probably trying to justify myself, which is nice and easy on an anonymous forum, but how on earth do people meet nice men? do they even exist?

"Upthechimney - I 'need/want' kisses and cuddles AND sex. I have a very high sex drive, but I am also human and need human contact, however 'nauseating' that sounds, it is perfectly natural."

It is natural, completely. This doesn't give you the right to ride rough shod all over anyone in your path, including a married woman and her kid/kids. It's THIS attitude that is getting people's backs up, NOT the fact that you are seeking love/affection.

To quote Heartbroken, "...leave that poor bloody woman's husband alone."

I'm not sure that anyone is being aggressive towards anyone for being single. Of course, with the right person, things can be better shared but this whole 'I have to be in a relationship' stuff really is boring.

So what if there are no decent single men out there, by the same token there are no decent single women out there either. You don't have to be in a relationship to be happy and if you find yourself unhappy simply because you don't have a man you are not in a very good place emotionally.

People can pick up these subliminal signals and will naturally back away. Been there, done that. It is only when you are truely happy with yourself that you will start to be attractive to others.

I am single by the way, and no, I'm not looking for a relationship and really don't want one. I do fancy a shag now and then but tbh, with all the hassle involved in being with someone else , I'm just as happy having a wank.

I am not saying I'm unhappy because I'm single; if that was the case, I would have been unhappy all my life!

All the same, just as it has its perks, it has its downsides. No sex. (One night stands aren't for me - no judgement there, it's just that they aren't.) Long, long periods of time spent alone at times. Holidays/weekends away/ meals out can be difficult.

I am afraid people do become aggressive if you ever voice discontent and start insisting you have not tried hard enough, I just don't bother!

I also take issue with the fact I am apparently presenting myself as unhappy to single men, hence why I am not in a relationship. I don't meet single men! I meet married ones or ones in relationships! Obviously I don't lure them away from their wives (couldn't even if I wanted to!) Tried online dating, no interest.

It does get a bit wearing being told implicitly and explicitly that you have something wring with you, both for wanting to meet a man and because it has not happened. I am an attractive (nothing special but fairly nice face, hair) well educated, pleasant person. I have my own home, own car, lots of friends - and am single, and it can be fine, it can also be a pain in the arse. I work in a school; to be honest that long six week holiday can be very - well - long!

I don't condone affairs. I don't condone cheating. But I do have to raise the point that we are sold a myth, that we have loads of time, and that 'Mr Right' is around the corner. Often he isn't, and this leads to misery as women force themselves to believe the slobby, lazy bloke who is pleasant and affable enough is their Prince Charming. Ten years later he's having an affair and she's stuck with him.

More pertinently, I am having a child alone because I d not believe I will meet a man - this does not mean I haven't got a yearning for a child. As such I have attended several open days run by the clinic to meet women who are also going alone. Given the costs of IVF with donor sperm and the costs of raising a child alone it probably won't come as a surprise to learn every single one of the women were well educated, high earners. Every single one was at least averagely attractive, and every single one believed 'one day' they would meet their man - but not every single one will have the baby she longs for.

Honesty is what is needed. I think the fixation on somebody for everybody actually leads so many women - and it is women - to accept second best.

It also highlights a huge issue with being single - if you ever express discontent at the situation, even in passing, you are told explicitly as well as implicitly that it is your fault, you have not tried hard enough and need to join groups, be involved in the community and try online dating. If you have tried those things you are clearly desperate and if you have not you only have yourself to blame. Oh and you should be happy single

Oh I agree! I have been there, done that, got the T-shirt. And I think I'm probably 20 years older than many of you. It only gets harder, and I've given up, to be frank.

But ...

The OP expresses a "need" for affection, "kisses & cuddles" as the excuse for sleeping with a married man. That's what gets up my nose. That somehow she is special & different to the rest of us.

I might want certain things, but I don't turn that into a need, which excuses bad (if not quite atrocious and self-deluding) behaviour. And a mental health condition does not excuse her either.

Absolutely, Chimney, I agree with you there. Want is not a need.

I just felt I had to put in a word for our defence regarding 'nice single men' - they aren't as easy as that to find!

As an aside, my brother is neither single nor (pains me to say it) particularly nice. He is physically handsome, but is crude, boorish, employed through an agency with casual shifts after being dismissed from his professional role - essentially he is 35 this year and has done a total of ten months' work. He's also got an occasional penchant for physical violence if you really upset him (only if you're a woman or elderly man, though.)

He is dating a pretty doctor he met on plenty of fish. I imagine she's with him through desperation. Why a nice looking and well educated woman has lowered herself, I don't know, but she is 35 and probably wants babies.

I know that's off topic but it isn't just us!

Do you realise how daft you sound? "I need someone to hug and kiss". Are you 15??!

You don't need anyone... you just think you do because you don't know yourself very well, you haven't learnt to be self sufficient at all especially emotionally. And I think you're scared of being hurt actually which is why the mm is nice at arms length!

I was on my own for many years when my ex dh left me..it seemed like the end of the world. I thought my.life was over. But actually it made me so much stronger. Cliche but true. I was completely single for ages and even though I then went on to remarry and have another dc I'm never afraid of being alone now which actually makes you in a much stronger position in a relationshipas you won't put up with crap for the sake of having someone to hold and kiss.
Then and only then will.you attract the right sort of men.

Blackbird - I think you have completely hit the nail on the head, you express it so much better than me, but your life sounds very much like my own (apart from my affair obviously :-( )

I find it very frustrating that everything I have said has been picked up on and pulled apart. Because I admit to wanting a man to love me, kiss me, hold me, I am juvenille and pathetic.

For the record, when I was 15 I didnt need anyone at all, I was happy hanging out with my mates. Its now when the days and nights are spent with no adult company that I 'need' someone.

Yes lots of women do it, but I find it hard going on days out or meals out with just me and the kids. I do it, but I dont feel comfortable doing it. We are not going on holiday this year because I cant bear the thought of sitting alone by the pool when the kids go off and do their own thing, or sitting alone on the balcony when the kids are in bed.

And its not about not attracting the 'right' sort of man, I meet plenty of men, its not like I repel the decent ones! by my age, the decent ones are married or taken, the ones left behind seem to be the ones with the issues.

Yes lots of women do it, but I find it hard going on days out or meals out with just me and the kids. I do it, but I dont feel comfortable doing it. We are not going on holiday this year because I cant bear the thought of sitting alone by the pool

It's this utterly selfish attitude that others are objecting to!

Poor ickle you -- you find it "hard" doing things on your own. (You're actually not on your own, BTW.you are with your children).

So you grab the partner of another woman. Because you are soooooo special, you just "need" someone, and no-one else matters.

It's very unattractive from where I'm sitting.

I think I'm going to have to hide this thread. It makes me quite angry to read your repeated justifications for amoral and selfish behaviour.

Yes Upthechimney...me too .

I don't know why I am even writing here...as I said I usually don't on these sort of threads...it is the poor ickle me attitude I find reprehensible.

Not go on holiday with your children because you will be alone? FFS! You will not be alone..you will be with your children! I wish I could afford to go on holiday with my beloved children who are also teens.

It is the selfish attitude and sense of entitlement that is vair annoying ...

I just had an hour long phone call with DM (who lives in Singapore) about my 'love life' haha...lack of really mummy said I! I am sort of seeing a bloke atm...but not serious...he is single and actually decent as in own hair and teeth, tall, solvent, good job, smart and a bit into me! But am not rushing into things as I am not desperate to jump into his arms...man, I would rather be lonely than jump into someone's arms just for the kisses and cuddles...DM said yes yes...in admiring tone (from DM rather rare TBH)

I did feel sorry for you esp with MH issues then I read your last post...grrr...you miss the point of what most of us are saying...leave the MM alone. He is a nob. A big hairy yukky nob for what he is doing to his DW and DC and also to you OP.

Ermmm for what it's worth you have "issues" yourself.. an 18 month affair with a mm and you're convinced he's a nice man? Your moral compass is all off. So don't be so dismissive of older men who have so called baggage or issues when you clearly have plenty yourself!

Also I'd imagine you can't introduce your mm to your dc anyway? So surely all this stuff about not wanting to holiday alone still stands... as the poster above says, your dc would be there too. You wouldn't be "alone".

And I don't have the moral high ground. I had an affair with a mm when I was 18 and he was 31. I am deeply ashamed of that, I was young and very naive and stupid. I didn't realise what it would be like to be in the wife's shoes.

Which is why I'm writing on this thread.

I've learnt from my own mistakes.

And despite being with this man, you are still not going on holiday because you are partnerless.

Also suppose you do meet a nice single man... you're not "single" yourself at the moment are you? So hardly fair to the new man.

REally agreeing with blackbird here.

Like BB, I'm not unhappy single because I've been single so often it is just part of me now really. Would like tomeet somebody but I have to laugh at the optimism of others sometimes, thinking (hoping on my behalf)that I will meet "somebody nice" when I'm 42 with two children. I also agree that there is an ignorant assumption that you must be doing something wrong, not going to enough salsa classes, scaring men off being too fussy... blah blah blah. It couldn't just be that there really is a shortage of decent men for decent women?

btw I don't think the OP's mm is a decent man obviously!

If married couples included single people in their circle when they socialised (both men and women) maybe maybe maybe it might be possible to meet somebody!!!

I really agree that if you ever express a desire to meet somebody you're ripped apart nearly. barriers up around you? too fussy? not going out enough? I turned down one invitation recently and was made to feel it was no wonder I was single.

Oh and I have met plenty of men, problem is, they are all complete nobs

...and this married man, by cheating on his wife, isn't?

I'd rather be single for another five years the rest of my life

It is lonely sometimes, I do sympathise. But .......... what can you do? maybe I should try internet dating again. I wish there was a filter though, I am not fussy about 'tall' or 'successful' or any of that bullshit but I am extremely fussy about a man being a decent man and good company.

impossibleornot I understand where you're coming from.

I've been seeing someone who has a girlfriend on & off for over 6 months. Of course I didn't know he had a girlfriend at first, but carried on seeing him anyway as I persuaded myself that I was ok with it.

I wasn't though. Apart from the fact that his girlfriend would have been very hurt if she ever found out what was going on, he couldn't fulfill my needs. The longer it carried on the more my feelings for him grew & I resented the fact that he wasn't around when I needed him & that was simply because he was with her. I put up with it for months though as I couldn't bear weekend evenings on my own & thought maybe it was better than nothing. I have only just come round to the idea that maybe nothing is better than to be treated in a way I don't want to be.

Like you I have been on countless dates with 'nobs' found on online dating sites & joined groups, but haven't found anyone.

I'm only now coming round to the idea that maybe it'll do me good to be on my own for a while, especially as I have never been on my own having been with the same man for 19 years!! Though I agree it is hard. I think also you think you 'need' kisses, cuddles, etc because you're not used to not having them, like me.

I'm hoping by getting out of this toxic relationship, I'll find who I am more & then I'll meet someone when I'm in a better place

Good luck

" there will be men horrified you were the OW "

Yes, those who are reeacting life in Victorian Britain. Well rid of such judgemental tossrs.

Is that right?

If the people on here are to believed and there really is a shortage of decent single men, then what you are arguing is that in ratio terms, there are far more decent single women to the amount of decent single men.

That being the case, why would a decent single man pick a woman with form for dishonesty, who's got mental health problems and who is selfish enough to deny her children a holiday because she doesn't like being by the pool on her own, when there are allegedly lots of single women who have none of those problems?

Or are some of you suggesting now that there are hoards of decent, non-judgemental men around who won't mind in the least that a woman has these issues?

You can't have it both ways.

That is someone's husband and someone's dad. Nothing else to say. You both need to sort yourself out and stop being so bloody selfish. How do you sleep at night

eh? well, first, I've not had an affair with a married man, so not defending my actions here, but usually what brings people together is chemistry, they find each other good company, I doubt that most men will have an entirely clean rap sheet themselves. I think a man is not going to reject a woman he is attracted to for admitting to an ill-judged affair in the past. I think it's a bit scarlet letter to suggest that decent men would do this. Decent men wouldn't judge surely? decent men would have empathy? decent men would forgive! Decent men wouldn't pin a red letter on you and say, oh, sorry, thought we could have had something you and I but no, you're aren't worthy of me.

Whaaaat?

The truth is that there just aren't enough decent men to go round . Lots of women (married and otherwise) settle for knobbers out of loneliness, fear, low self-esteem and this applies whether they are married to them or single.

IME, there are more men than women who prefer to stay single.

It makes me quite irritated actually -- newspapers etc always talk about women leaving it "too late" for babies blah,blah,blah. No-one ever points the finger at the Peter Pan men who don't want to "settle down".

That being the case, why would a decent single man pick a woman with form for dishonesty, who's got mental health problems and who is selfish enough to deny her children a holiday because she doesn't like being by the pool on her own, when there are allegedly lots of single women who have none of those problems?

What a nasty wicked thing to say.

And thank you for filling in your own version of events for me.

I am not denying the children a holiday, they are holidaying with their Dad, I am 'denying' them of a second holiday, because last year I ruined it for them, because despite trying my absolute hardest, I struggled last year and I am scared to do it again. But please do carry on assuming that I am being 'selfish'

Thanks to the others for their understanding.