My DH is conducting a flirty private message chat on Facebook - not with me!

[JoySchtick]

I saw on my DH's Facebook messages that he has been flirting with a woman - 'ooh you're so sexy', 'you're very cute', she putting kisses on messages.

It is definitely in no way innocent and just friends but I really don't think they have DTD. It all seems like the beginning of something rather than that they have gone the whole way.

I had an inkling there was something not right and so I snooped.

I do not have any DCs - he does, not with me, from a previous relationship.

I feel weirdly calm and shaky at the same time but what do I do?

Do I confront him? But that could just mean that he is more careful to hide it in future. I don't want to bust in all guns blazing - I want to do what is right for me! I just don't know what my options are.

I hate lies and I can't cope with them at all.

Advice anyone?

Dear OP,

I haven't read the whole thread, but about 5 pages in, I thought this man could get difficult and nasty.

And somewhere along the line of the story unfolding, I think he did (no?)

The clues for me were early on when you said he first described his first wife as OK. Then changed it to be more attacking once you were married. This sounds a little clever/manipulative to me, i.e. presenting himself as someone who respected women, and then once re-married, could vent alot more.

The second massive red flag is telling you he needed to know your password.

Third - something about calling the police as you'd borrowed his car. Big red flag this. Threatening.

Sorry I haven't read the rest. But I really think you need to reflect on protecting yourself, including getting a solicitor. I think he could get rather mean if he decided. Sorry if I missed alot in latest pages ...

Just read through this epic thread

I'm so appalled at them both. He's so bloody entitled isn't he?

I hope you don't fall for his shit and just get out but only you know what will bring you most happiness. I couldn't cope with a small percentage of this.

You sound very measured which is good. And of course MN is a great help. Best of luck.

Hi Joy, hope you're having a bit of respite while away. In your conversation with H, did you manage to tell him that you would be only too glad to have an adult conversation about it, but that that would entail him not contradicting, blaming and turning things round on to you, i.e. actually behaving like an adult? Or do you think it is too late?

It does seem as though he has trawled through his past resentments and come up with these 'reasons' for the recent events. Even if his reasons are valid, surely the internet stuff with OW is not justified.

I am sorry he won't take responsibility for what he has done. This does make it difficult to continue with your marriage. It is such a shame he won't see that.

Hope you are getting some RL comfort.

What a total load of bollocks. Has he ever started a sentence with "Sorry..." ?!

The recent events MAY be the symptoms of a deeper malaise but he still needs to freaking APOLOGISE for his shitty behaviour whatever set him on the path of "exchanging virtual love juices" (sorry for nicking that bit from upthread, but it did make me snigger. Amongst all the cussing)

He certainly seems to believe that attack is the best form of defence

I'd be tempted to point out that I have xx (however many you have) declarations by him in writing to another woman, any of which on their own would be grounds for divorce, and am therefore incredulous that he can think that you not changing your name somehow is an equivalent. Tell it to the judge, mate, and good luck with that!

What a load of bollocks. How long did it take him or him and OW to compile that list of you are to blame and it is all your fault.

If he had a problem with you not taking his name or not moving in as agreed for 4 months he should have brought them up several years ago when they occurred not suddenly brought them up as an excuse to try and meet up and bone OW. Is just another attack to make it your fault.

He is the one who grabbed at you. He is the one who shouted, ranted and raved at you.

He is the one who threatened you with the police and contacting your work.

He is the one who completely prevented an adult rational discussion.

He had still accepted no responsibility for any of this in the slightest.

There is no way you can move on together with such a massive pile of BS which he continues to shovel more onto in an attempt to bury you in blame.

It's no use. This is not a man who will ever concede that he could be in any way to blame for any of the issues in your marriage. Him blithely saying "We are both to blame for months of pain and unhappiness" doesn't actually count. It's too bland.
Bail out honey, really. There is nothing to be salvaged here.

Oh, please... As if moving in 4 months later, and not taking his name have got anything to do with this at all. Talk about scrabbling round, trying to find some - anything! - to pin on you, to make his emotional affair your fault.

What an odious little toad he not. Not one single admission of fault or wrong-doing on his side at all...

Just when you think shit can't sink any lower!!

He is just amazing at twisting stuff! Why let a little thing like facts get in the way of a good story eh?

not excusing OW but it's not hard to see the sort of poor me bollocks he would have been feeding her!!

He has a twisted abusive mind.

I think read Lundy Bancroft; he is there.

As things stand Joy, there is nowhere to go with him.

I forgave online infidelity by the way, but not on these terms. Also, my h tried your h's line, ie but taking blame, until we got to Rekate . Then he caved absolutely, but in front if a man.

Basically Joy:
(1) It is all your fault
(2) TADA -- the goalposts have been moved/history has been rewritten, and now you are going to have to grovel forever for the dreadful things you did a long time ago
(3) Whatever it is that is all your fault this time round is not the real problem. The real problem has been you all along and the horrible person you are/things you did to Diddums. The current problem does not exist.

Sweetheart, staying and hoping for sense, honesty, and a real effort to sort this out will result in you going crazy.

You have already been to counselling and the relationship is only four years old and you had already bought a Lundy Bancroft book before all of this efll into your lap -- not because counselling is pathetic or getting a really good book either, but because this was not a very good relationship to start with obviously, and not because of you or any of the things you did ( to see you already engaging with the madness by explaining yourself there in your post)

Are you making plans to move out and start your new life without him?
Don't waste any more of your precious time or invest any more of your emotion here. He is fundamentally incapable of being in a real relationship.

[I have no idea how angry I make people. I seem self-indulgent and selfish in my analysis at times.] The couples counselling we attended made things worse, H heard things which were so hurtful that he felt more desolate about our future than he had before the sessions. [We are both to blame for months of pain and unhappiness].

The parts of this that are not pure projection (marked []) are utter self centered bollocks. The projection is bollocks too of course.

Don't hold your breath waiting for an apology.

He believes every word he says. He is living in a parallel universe.

Joy don't feel the need to explain yourself. To us, him - or anyone.

He is an utter ... can't actually think of a worthy expletive. Toss Pot? Shit Head? Shit for brains? Gob Shite? Take your pick [bugrin]

Look at it this way - he has made it so much easier for you to stick two fingers up, smile and turn tail. Walk away with your head held high - and do not let his words sink in. He is trying to place blame, his only thought is self-preservation - all the better that it puts you in your place at the same time God forbid he would focus on the small matter of virtually fucking another woman, oh no, let's talk about when we got married. Dick head.

He is a pond-dwelling piece of scum - actually he is the bacteria that lives on the festered mould that grows on the lowest form of pond-dwelling scum. You are worth so much more. He is showing his true colours and true estimation of you (zero) - use it to your advantage to motivate you to get the hell away - to your bright future without him.

Just at his audacity. What an arse. Hope you are OK today Joy.

Well, if he believes all that, Joy, where is there to go? Time for you to escape...

I hope you are OK.

If the worst he can say is that you didn't change your name (nor did he - perfectly reasonable decision for anyone to make) and that you didn't move in immediately for very sensible reasons, then you haven't given him any more legit grounds for complaint.

He appears to be angry when he can't control you. Even more disturbingly, he appears to think that is "you making him angry".

The fact he's wanting to brush under the carpet explicit sexual messages exchanged with another woman behind your back, which they knew must be kept secret from their spouses, in favour of dwelling on your signs of independence... not good, is it?

Counselling will upset him. They won't validate his worldview.

I'm so sorry you're dealing with this idiocy. Though the idea of a restraining order cracked me up. You contacted the woman once, and contacting her husband wouldn't be contacting her. And it's sometimes hard to get a restraining order with criminal legal sanctions when someone really IS stalking a person! The idea the courts would be interested is hilarious. As is the idea that your catching him out on Facebook is anything your professional body would give a stuff about. It's breathtaking that he's willing to threaten his own wife instead of apologising, though, when he's so in the wrong.

Sadly I've seen a lot of affair threads over the years on MN. I've seen a lot of defensive, denying spouses. I have never, ever seen one so self righteous about it. Just incredible. He's a MN extreme, and what a disturbing and sad "accolade" that is.

By the way:

You not living in a house in his sole name angers him.
You not taking his name angers him.
You having control over your own internet account is unacceptable.
You staying away overnight (after learning of an affair) without his sayso is unacceptable.
You taking a family car without his consent is unacceptable.
You challenging him over an online affair is unacceptable.
You not accepting there's nothing wrong with his having this affair is unacceptable.

You are selfish and immature in challenging his affair.
You make him angry when you do not do exactly as he wants.
You do not appreciate how special, ethical and wonderful he is and appear to believe you even have the right to tell him otherwise.

His being physically aggressive with you when you do not respect his control is acceptable.
His locking you out when you do not respect his control is acceptable.
His threatening you professionally and criminally when you do not respect his control is acceptable.

Sorry but he seems pretty disturbing to me on several fronts.

Thank you all so much for taking the time to write such thoughtful and relevan replies.

I truly appreciate it. You have no idea how much of a help it is to read what you say.

I am still away but plan to head back home later.

I feel so wiped out just now. I don't want this to be my story and this to be my marriage. It is all such a waste.

Glad you're ok.

None of us want it but do you feel you could ever truly trust him? He really does sound bad and so controlling. Not that mature either.

If you do split you'll soon feel stronger. I actually felt like a weight had been lifted. What about a separation?

JOy, it will take the time it takes for the reality of what has happened to sink in.

You are likely to also make other connections to previous arguments and discussion, and revise what was happening in the light of how he has handled this debate.

Knowing you can prove something is untrue, can help you to make sense of any other times you may have argued and ended up confused, and like you had had your head messed with and cant work out how. That's what it was like for me, anyway.

I suppose my only caution to you (as someone who went though this loop myself, but with less proof), is that it is very easy to get worn down if a man is this insistent, move on, look ahead, get charmed by future efforts (however temporary) on his part, and just 'sweep it under the carpet'.

My experience of doing that is that your new knowledge has changed the landscape, and even if you can see that, he hasnt. So new struggles which come up will be tainted by this 'unfinished business', let alone your ongoing reactions to the initial issue.

ps I think he will find it very difficult to understand how this new knowledge about what he has done (and how he has reacted to your discovery) affects what you know about him, regardless of what he tells you.

It is likely to come as a terrible shock to him,and may not sink in at all, that he cannot (any longer) tell you that black is white and expect you to see the same colours. That is the reality for a controlling person; they half think they are magicians.

I don't have any advice - just to say still following, still amazed at how you're handling it, which is not to say you always need to be as funny and brave and sensible as you have till now. Wailing "it's not faaaaaaiiiiiiiirrrrrrr!!!!!" is ok too

It's not fair, it's not what you wanted. It's horrible and you can't make it not be. But anyone as strong as you (and with a mum who can laugh with you over very silly text messages) will get through this. won the war, as you said, and also remember Winston's phrase - "keep buggering on". This bit is not forever.

No experience goes to waste, Joy. Don't be tempted to salvage this on the basis that what went before requires that.

Please don't be tempted to sink more of your hopes and dreams into the bottomless pit you have here. Grieving the future you thought you had will not be as painful in the long run as trying to live in the house of mirrors your H is busy constructing.

This man has not shown one speck of remorse -- he hasn't taken any responsibility, has denied and accused and threatened. You are not the one who should feel wiped out right now and yet there you are feeling as if a train has hit you. He has turned you into Enemy Number One.

Still hoping to see a positive update Joy x

perfectstorm, you just summarised my relationship which ended yesterday. only i werent even allowed to mention my 3dc's dead daddy either. if he did something though id be in the wrong for confronting him.
he dangled the relationship under my nose like a carrot cos he thought i 'needed' him. he chucked insults at me then said 'bye' so then i said 'bye' and that was it. now hes sayin he loves me n wants t be with me.
but i just feel nothing. its hard to move on wen im preg by him though x