Well that's that

[onefewernow]

Name changed for this, but big hint given. (Had to, I have seen MN on his search history).

Well, that's that, a row last night, and he's gone.

I am stunned, relieved, shocked.

But it has been coming, and then some.

Hi there. As I said in my pm, I had a feeling something had shifted in you recently.

It's been a long road to get to this point. he knew what he had to do, but it wasn't enough. It never was. His original misdemeanours showed too much disrespect for women, end of. How he could have ever conjured it up from nowhere was always very doubtful.

I hope this doesn't come across as "told you so" but now you can't keep telling yourself it can work, because it isn't.

Please don't worry about money. It will work out, it always does, perhaps not how you want it ideally.

A very wise person on another thread recently said "if you don't want him irrespective of kids, finances and other situational stuff, he isn't worth having" (or words to that effect)

You sound very, very tired, love. Take very good care of yourself, and let your kids look after you.

"Do you feel like he has 'sucked the life out of you'? When did you last feel unbridled joy and utter contentment?"

I damn well do. Although I have also sucked it out of myself, as well, trying to get deal with him, given my new boundaries since last year.

And joy? I cannot remember. I think actually when we first sorted our differences last year, but it was an illusion. I thought I had finally got the relationship I wanted. In reality, though, it was just like when we first met- he was infatuated and attentive, but it was never going to last. I would have preferred less, but for longer.

I am so tired I am beyond caring. And our youngest is about to be diagnosed with SN (possibly mild AS or Dyspraxia), and I have a horrible feeling it could have been better for him than this, thus far.

I am so sorry, take care x

A wise friend once told me that there's no point in wondering if you made the right choice/said the right thing/etc, etc - because you can't know how THAT option would have worked out either; you can only do your best with what seems right at the time

I also realise who you are, and have always been very touched at your kindness in advising others, me included. I'm also trying to move on from OH's online betrayals, and I'm truly sorry it's come to this for you, knowing you're not the type to chuck it all in at the first hurdle

Can our men ever change that much? I don't know, it's a work in progress for us, but I DO know they don't like facing up to the damage caused, it's easier to say nothing and hope we'll get over it. Not my place to say, but it does sound like this is what yours has done, and it's just not enough, the whole thing keeps going round and round in your head until you despair

I know only too well how draining this is, so as others have said please get some rest if you can and above all be kind to yourself. I'm absolutely certain all those people you've helped, and many more besides, will all be thinking of you and hoping to hear how things are going

Sustained change isn't the holy grail that you might think OFN (feels strange calling you a different name!)

The truth is that if someone is committed to change for their own sake and not just the relationship's sake, it is possible to challenge and reject a lifetime of unhelpful attitudes and behaviours and develop a very different mindset.

As you know, my impression was that at one stage you were the one launching yourself on a self-development programme to understand his behaviour and your own responses to it. Whereas he didn't appear to do much at all apart from 'shop window' cosmetic changes. This wasn't hugely surprising, because it was always my belief that he was still nursing huge secrets from you. I recall you then started focusing more on you and what you wanted and that's when your real learning began, because as you know the only person you can change is yourself and the only behaviour you can control is your own.

He on the other hand, remained stuck at that very superficial level of self-awareness and I think you've quite simply outgrown and outlearnt him.

The reason for that I think is that it was never his mission to change for his own sake. His mission was to convince you he'd changed, which was an entirely different objective. The difference now is that you've trained yourself to know the difference.

I hope you'll go on posting what ever the outcome might be. You might not yet be quite ready to throw in the towel if he relents and promises the earth again and so you could benefit from ongoing unjudgemental support if that happens. Thinking of you and metaphorically squeezing your hand through this dark weekend.

The reason for that I think is that it was never his mission to change for his own sake. His mission was to convince you he'd changed, which was an entirely different objective.

Agree with this - if he really was committed to changing, he would have told you the whole truth about his infidelities.

I've always got the impression that he treated the whole situation as a massive mind game, so no wonder you sound exhausted

Yes I could never get to the bottom of it. He just kept insisting that was it. He did recently say that he would never out himself through cheating in me again, that he would prefer to split if it came up and he wanted to . He certain end seemed believable. My instinct is that he isn't cheating, but less sure about the porn use .

He said the lack of sex issue recently was to do with lack of intimacy, because we were rowing probably weekly or fortnightly.

I do think made a few changes for himself. But not all for himself, certainly. I think he still lies sometimes, and he started using verbal manipulation in arguments again.eg answering a different question to the one I asked.

I have had a massive headache since yesterday, and threw up at 6am, but did get back to sleep.

Hurt himself, not out!

Its just words though - his actions are speaking louder than whatever is coming out of his mouth. He sounds like hard work - all that headfuckery

I really would start detaching from him and stop trying to work out what's going on in his mind.

Hope you get some rest today and feel better. I've always had the sense that what motivates your husband is control and power, hence the lying and the mind-games. Is he like this with men? Or is it only women?

I haven't seen him do it elsewhere. I think he will lie if its politic.

Have had texts saying missing me and that "one way or another You will get what you want and I should not have allowed the situation to deteriorate".

I have thrown up loads and slept half the day in between.

I'm feeling shit, and weak.

Don't feel shit. Please. Why should you feel shit ?

You've got me worried.

You've got me worried.

I'm worried about you too

OFN, your name change could be BetterOffNow. Your own strength and love for your kids comes through loud and clear - he is not your extra SN child tho he sounds like he wants to be!

You have done nothing wrong and the peaceful time now after the transition stage and financial disentangling will be a boon to you.

Please get legal/accounting advice tomorrow and change the locks - it may not be irrevocable but for goodness' sake protect yourself straight away xx Best of luck.

Tell us you are ok, OFN

Right. I'm up. I don't know whether it was a bug or stress, but I was very sick three times. Then, even though I slept we'll last night, I went back to bed for three hours and feel a LOT better. If it was stress, it's odd, as I had to break off a phone call to vomit the last time, which is odd.

I don't think I need to change locks etc- it isn't his style. He wouldn't do anything to upset the kids in a planned way like that. I suspect his text means " I will give you what you want, whatever it is".

He does have slot of positive qualities, and really did work hard to change himself, but didn't do therapy. But I think it would help him, and others.

I am in confusion. The kids regret the move here, and don't entirely see that our personal finances which are improving but up and down as we are self employed and subject to the exigencies of clients) are unrelated to the move. If this is it, and it might well be, then they are going to have to cope with a further layer of poverty again, and they will find that very hard. There are few local jobs, and anyway my skills are quite specialised.

So tempting to let him back, and work more on other aspects of my life, and see what happens with the marriage. I really would personally miss him if it is over, I would actually, there are things about him which are positive, and even my sister says he is a very generous and kind man. But he comes with fundamental issues, which cause me a lot of misery. Even though I do accept that I am quite demanding ( I am).

I am so glad I asked for time and space today. I need it.

I have had the headache from hell too, so that may have affected me. That IS stress.

I don't consider expecting a decent level of respect from your spouse as "demanding" tbh

Glad you haven't disappeared off the face of the earth

I remember you saying this move was going to give you more options whether your marriage worked out or not. What has changed ?

It doesn't work like that though does it? You're either in a marriage and committed to working on it, or you're not. If you're not, it really is best to part.

I think that's a common delusion that just delays the inevitable - this idea that you can stay in a marriage, suit yourself and 'wait and see' whether he steps up to the plate. In reality you'll find yourself either working furiously to maintain the marriage while he does nothing or you'll both start to suit yourselves and drift apart. Both scenarios might be options (if pointless and time-wasting) if it wasn't for the fact that your children are watching and learning from you both. From what I remember, your children have already been over-involved in these power struggles. He once tried to blame your daughter for his internet porn didn't he? And you say that this latest row involved one of the other children?

When I asked that question about whether he tried to exert power and control over men or just women, it was with the full understanding that you aren't the only woman he has tried to control in the past. Didn't he say that the attraction for him in all his online relationships was the power and control he could have over lots of young women? So if you say that he only does this with you, that's not quite right is it? But it does suggest it's women he's got a problem with and that he wouldn't even try to get away with this with men, or has no need to control them in the first place.

I left home at 16 as I didn't get on with family, and now only siblings left. It hasn't worked out that well, the return. Also generally speaking they have been better at looking to me for support than providing it. i barely see them.

There are limited things to do here. The kids don't love it and find it dull.

Either I don't have enough work and am a bit lonely, or too much. I think some of my issues are probably my own.

In terms of social life, people are either retired or narrow minded, to a certain extent. The town is quite isolated, even geographically, which doesn't help with work. He was right about that, in advance, at least. But at the time, back then, he was cheating and detached and wouldn't admit it, and I couldn't quite see what the issues were.

What has changed? I think we have both let things deteriorate, but that I would need to expect less and notice when the glass is half full, and he would need to be less defensive, more considerate. We would both need to be less opinionated than we seem to manage to be.

it's classic to take blame when the other partner refuses to

you have been doing this all along...he only pays lip service to accepting any at all

what he wants, and always wanted, is for you to be less "opinionated" about how shit he has been as a husband and as a father

As for taking the blame - remember that the cheater is supposed to take on the role of healer after an affair but in your case, it was you who was doing this work (e.g counselling him, reading books etc).

No wonder it wasn't working out.