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Original poster

Welcome to The Dating Thread. Number 40.

999 replies

JulietteMontague · 08/02/2013 17:39

The next chapter...

OP posts:
OhWesternWind · 10/02/2013 19:53

Oh dear I just can't be doing with more complicated stuff in my life at the moment. Not dealing with anything well. Keep crying. No idea where I stand with LM, the time when I asked him was a disaster, that was when he said we were at the crossroads but then didnt say which road he wanted to take. Don't want to spend/waste more time either getting deeper or consciously holding myself back when I don't know where it's going. No idea what he feels about me. I don't actually want anything to change ie I don't want to move in with him or anything but I want to know where I am with him. Loads of mixed messages but probably I am as bad. Upset tonight that he doesn't like me yet he has phoned (and was a bit abrupt with him) and is cooking for me tomorrow. I am a bloody nightmare, honestly. Poor bloke. Reading this doesn't make sense even to me. I am just a total messed up bollix.

KirstyWirsty · 10/02/2013 19:55

Yes watch or round your life ... The example the author used was you meet someone and start cancelling hair appointments etc if they are free .. She said best not to do that .. Keep your appointment and see them when you are free .. All common sense stuff really

Scrazy · 10/02/2013 19:56

The book isn't really about game playing it's about changing your mindset. I know the approach doesn't always work but the ones who don't want you anyway will disappear before they get to you, so to speak.

I don't play games, it is the way I am, after making lots of mistakes with men in the past. I would have like to read it 25 years ago when I went out on the scene, after years of coupledom, but I was quite naive.

Of course, OD wasn't around then but I do think it's harder now because of it.

mercury7 · 10/02/2013 19:56

I've found that over time I learn to spot the red flags, it can be a painful process..then again I was only ever really in it for sex.
For me the best solution is to have 2 or three men that I can call on when I'm in need..I have one arriving in half an hour, I texted him 20 minutes ago.
The other is working away right now, tomorrows coffee date may turn out to be the third man but I'm not getting my hopes up this early on.

I realise this is not a set up that many women seem to want Confused

SweetSeraphim · 10/02/2013 19:58

Alright watch, blimey. Don't start getting all defensive with people on here Hmm If you don't want opinions, don't post on here. Sorry and all that.

watchoutforthatsnail · 10/02/2013 19:58

western, without wanting to upset you further, you need to think about what you want, what your needs are, and if they are being met by him, or will be met by him. Its not at all fair to have this amount of upset.

Velv, yep. cant abide it. The ex did it awfully, he would say the world was flat, if i produced evidence to the contrary, i was a cow for doubting him. Lied about money, where he was, women, the list goes on.... Im not high maintance, i would have been happy to have something casual. But he lied, and i fell for it. and thats the bit that hurts.

watchoutforthatsnail · 10/02/2013 20:01

sweet, no, im just not going to be blamed for something that isnt my fault. i dont sleep with lots of men on second dates. I rarely get second dates anyway :)

the fact he looked scruffy is also not the reason he behaved like that.

kirsty - wouldnt dream of doing that anyway... :)

Scrazy · 10/02/2013 20:03

Not sure it's in the same book or something else that I've read.

It said that men put women into categories, just as we do too to them.

The categories are:-

Not interested

Friends

Just for fun

Worth the effort

It's hard to go from just for fun to worth the effort so if you think they are treating you as a booty call, just for sex etc it's probably best to get out asap, providing you want more that is. Fine if you don't.

Bant · 10/02/2013 20:05

Women on this thread really do seem to think that men are one dimensional simple animals. We're not, we're just different. Sex for us is more of an emotionless act, so there are many men who will try and get women into bed, possibly more than once, then run. That may be on one date or six. However the better the connection with the woman, the more they connect with us, then the less we want to run

I've seen so many comments about FWB who are falling in love, and men who are just too full on after a couple of months dating, it's not really fair to just dismiss us as purely after a quick fuck. Especially as quite a few people on here have said that would be fine for them, they don't want attachment.

ike1 · 10/02/2013 20:07

Bant gonna ask you to pop a 'some' at the beginning of your first sentence. Thanking you kindly.

Scrazy · 10/02/2013 20:09

Bant, I don't think that all men are just after a fuck, not at all and I don't even think that the ones that are are all fuckmuppets, wankers and arseholes either.

Mercury that's fine if it suits you. I've had similar arrangements in the past and it worked well. No upsets etc. Don't want it now though.

VoiceofUnreason · 10/02/2013 20:12

ike is beginning to sound like me. Must be our late night chatting while one of us is totally pissed...

I think a 'some of' might apply at the early part of bant's second sentence, too, but as he follows it with a 'many' shortly afterwards, I'll let it pass. Smile

MsCellophane · 10/02/2013 20:13

Bant - prob due to your letting us keep on makeing the same mistakes comment

It's the lack of honesty I don't understand. Why not say what they want? Why not be honest?

We see it all the time. I had two profiles on POF for a while. One as intimate encounter and one as dating. IE had no photo's and slight detail changes - brown/hazel eyes, slightly different area. Main details were both true

I was receiving messages from men who said they were looking for a relationship on the IE one. Stating they weren't looking for anything serious. I messaged a few of them from the dating profile - totally ignored by all

I have had a profile which stated I wanted a FWB - I had success as in I had coffee dates, followed by Coffee date. Never to be heard from again. I'm ok with that - if they say actually, I only wanted a ONS. I'm not happy if they pretend they want a regular thing and then piss off

So, we may treat the male as one entity but there are lots of us here, all having the same experiences - very different women, looking for very different things but our experiences are all the same

ike1 · 10/02/2013 20:17

Voice I think you will find it should actually be 'Some of THE'(Ike purses lips pedantically)

watchoutforthatsnail · 10/02/2013 20:19

mrs c, that has been my experience too. with the two profiles, and then the fwb profile. exactly the same thing.

its the lack of honesty that fucks me off more than anything. Had goat said, look, im really not wanting to date seriously but maybe every few weeks or something... then, great, fab, im happy with that. What he did do was say ' nothing heavy, yeah', and then chased me like a mother fucker, begging to see me and planning dates...

somewhere along the line i was taken in by the actions speaking louder than words thing... and thought i could trust him. esp since i thought he trusted me by giving me his keys and stuff. WRONG.

its that that is annoying.

VelvetSpoon · 10/02/2013 20:20

It's not as simple as women being just for fun or worth the effort. That's a pretty patronising view to take of men, and I think rather diminishing of women.

In the example I gave I very clearly wasn't -using those categories - just for fun. Prior to and during that date it was very clear I was considered worth the effort.

I didn't have sex with him. He said he wasn't just after sex.

I then went from being worth the effort to apparently nothing at all...Hmm

Original poster
JulietteMontague · 10/02/2013 20:20

There are two perspectives here.

One is the idea that holding back sex may get men more interested. This could be for the challenge, Madonna/whore complex whatever. I couldn't give a toss because sex is not a commodity and if someone did that to me I would dump from a great height for being manipulative.

The other is red flag man, all about me man, player, narc man whatever. Russell Brand basically. Goat Man was one of these so it wouldn't have made any difference, sex or no sex.

There is also the suggestion that giving too much of yourself in any way is not the way to have someone recognise your own worth as it may imply you don't value yourself.

OP posts:
ike1 · 10/02/2013 20:21

Fast coming to the conclusion that we are possible all nuts......to even be bothering with it all, men, women, the lot of us........

Bant · 10/02/2013 20:21

If I said 'some' women, then 'some' women on here would take it as a personal attack, which it's not at all.

Personally I don't do IE, but some men will have both profiles, or will go for both IE and relationship seekers on POF. That site really isn't for me though. I can see why men will do both? They're looking for long term if it happens but they'd be quite happy with a quick shag if it offers itself. Many younger women will not be so bold though, so it's a less socially acceptable alternative to be so honest.

And men will lie to get what they want, as will women. If women weren't willing to lie to get what they were looking for there would be no cosmetics industry.

VoiceofUnreason · 10/02/2013 20:22

ike - no, I still maintain it should have been "Sex for some of us..." However, I will pedantically accept I was referring to the third sentence and not the second one.

Bant · 10/02/2013 20:22
KinNora · 10/02/2013 20:23

I thought you were more of a 'free spirits' wild child type than a pedant, Ike...

(I've hidden the nhs thread, my blood pressure was soaring)

VoiceofUnreason · 10/02/2013 20:24

Kin the spirts were certainly flowing freely last night I think....although it may have just been wine...

lubeybooby · 10/02/2013 20:24

Watch, hang on - you've got me wrong here. I'm not saying in any way that it's your fault it went wrong.

I only said about sleeping with people quickly because though you might not do it all that often, you are the biggest champion of doing it if you want to - meaning you will defend the right to do so if you wish, etc. Not that you always do it, or anything like that.

ok, scratch previous message, that wasn't getting across what I meant at all

Let me try and put it another way

We all told you he was a knob. You KNEW yourself he was a knob, your instinct was spot on, but you ignored it and carried on regardless and told yourself it was for the thrill and was just banter etc etc

I don't think he did lie to you, (well apart from right at the beginning maybe on first date) but then he told you he didn't want anything heavy - doesn't matter how they act when they have said that, and acted so knobbishly, and you have rightly picked up on them being an idiot.

I just think that really, deep down, you want more, no matter how much you tell yourself you don't, and put on the bravado. And that will lead to you getting hurt by behaviour like this

I just don't want to see you hurt - so if I can say something that will aid your thought process about it so you can avoid it in future then I'll say it

I mean, if you want more deep down, then don't look for or accept nothing heavy, or anything just for the thrill, and really really listen to your instincts because they have always initially been spot on

And if I'm wrong and you really aren't bothered and don't want more then no problem

Hope that makes more sense.

Not saying you did anything wrong at all.

SweetSeraphim · 10/02/2013 20:25

Ahhh Juliette

Grin You do make me laugh.

Whereas Bant on the other hand... < If women weren't willing to lie to get what they were looking for there would be no cosmetics industry.> Really? Really?

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