The kids winge and cry

[BurntToastSmell]

I have two very demanding young children. A toddler (2 years) and a baby (9 months). They winge all day long (I really mean: all. day. long). Aside from look after the kids on my own all day (7am till 6pm) I have to keep the house clean, make their food, make sure all the dishes are washed, make sure all the clothes are clean, take them to baby & toddler groups, AND run an online business. I'm at the end of my tether because of the constant winging all day long. My friend has suggested using an ipod and turning the volume up full so I can't hear their winging. Is this reasonable? I don't know how I would get all my chores done otherwise, but I feel terrible. I read that if you leave young children to winge/cry, you can lower their self esteem and make them more anxious (due to elevated levels of cortisol). I really hate leaving them to cry but I don't know what else I can do? I don't want to put them into daycare/nursery until they are 3.

[BurntToastSmell]

Mainly - he won't leave. I asked him last night to leave and he said no, he had nowhere to go apparently. (Even though his dad lives locally and he has his mate).

Ivana - very useful link. Thank you. I really don't know if getting the police involved is going to do anything positive? It could be the final nail in our marriage coffin.

[BurntToastSmell]

Ivana - he wouldn't recognise that he is being abusive. I think perhaps he truly believes himself when he says that I'm being unreasonable.

Re: the relationships forum, do they have trained counsellors over there? What makes it better than over here?

[MainlyMaynie]

I think getting the police involved might help persuade him to move out. It might also make him realise the seriousness of his actions. I'd only be wary if it would create any risk to his income (i.e. does he need an enhanced disclosure). But there are people on the relationships forum who know a lot more about this sort of thing than me. I've also reported the thread and asked for it to be moved there.

[DowagersHump]

There are a lot of people on the Relationships forum who have been where you are and can advise you really well on what works/what doesn't work.

He has already put the nail in the coffin of your marriage by continuing to abuse you and is now upping the ante and physically assaulting you. He will do it again, I'm fairly sure

[FamiliesShareGerms]

MrsKeith I completely agree. That's why they are "men I know" (mostly colleagues, a couple of partners of friends) rather than "my friends"

[BurntToastSmell]

I don't know any men who lie about where they are. Perhaps I'm naive? It it really that common?

[MainlyMaynie]

No, it's not common. Decent men are honest and want to support their wives. They don't lie about where they are, withhold money and commit violence against their wives. Have WA called back? Would you be prepared to move out to a refuge?

[StuntGirl]

Just to reiterate what others have said above counseling is not appropriate with abusive people. So I wouldn't bother with Relate toast, it will not help you right now.

On a practical side (even though it probably feels like the last thing you want to do right now) you must collect any documents that you can in case of a split. Banks statements (what happened to that one you found?), bills, etc. Gather up passports and any other docunents relating to you and the kids.

I would strongly advise getting away from him; either he leaves or you do. He is abusive, he assaulted you, and you deserve so much better.

[FamiliesShareGerms]

I don't know if it's that common (I guess it's perhaps half a dozen men out of the 100s I know). I would guess it's more common where the husband works in London and the wife is at home - it is really easy to "be stuck at work" or "have trouble with the trains home" when work is not predictable and commuting does often throw up travel chaos.

I don't think you're naive, and doing things because other people do it too (which would probably be the defense used if any of these men were called on their behaviour) is surely something we should have grown out of before we have children

[BurntToastSmell]

I'm on my knees. I don't know what to do.

I cannot (and will not) take the children to a refuge.

I can't go on like this. Once the children are in bed I will resort to getting drunk, like I did last night.

[BoffinMum]

I am so sorry it has come to this, Burnt. I hope you're OK.

Thinking it through, I think there are a number of issues here. It's actually not the worst thing in the world to do, to put off coming home for an hour in order to get a bit of personal space. I don't like the fact that he has been lying about where he is, but he certainly wouldn't be the first to do this, and he won't be the last, and I see it as more minor than the other things you are telling us.

For me, the fact he shook you until you were bruised would be enough to go to the police and get some sort of restraining order. This is utterly and completely unacceptable. I would be inclined to act on this if I were you. I sincerely hope your children haven't seen any of this happening.

Secondary to this is the fact that he sounds very manipulative and emotionally abusive and controlling with regard to money and so on, and this is linked to the physical abuse, in the way that these things generally are.

Finally reading between the lines you are both struggling with getting on anyway, so you may have to rehearse some sort of permanent separation in your mind from this point on, as from where I am sitting, if I am totally honest, I am not sure your two really have a marriage to save. I've come to this conclusion from the sheer number of warning bells ringing.

We will help you in any way we can.

[MrsKeithRichards]

I don't know any men that do that either, totally unacceptable.

[BoffinMum]

Burnt, realistically you can't afford to get drunk because you have to have a clear head at the moment. I would avoid that course of action. You need to get things sorted so you do the best by your children.

[FamiliesShareGerms]

No! Hitting the bottle is not the answer!

is it as nice with you as it is here? Why not stick the children in the buggy and go for a walk to clear your head a little in the fresh air?

[MainlyMaynie]

Have you got access to any money? You cannot stay with a man who has turned violent, it is very likely to escalate. You could call the police and see if that helps persuade him to go. Or you could find a way to leave yourself, which will be a lot easier if you have money for a deposit. What area of ST are you in?

[BoffinMum]

Burnt, you could call the police now, ask for help and have the locks changed before 6, tbh.

[BoffinMum]

I think most people would advise you to stay in the family home if at all possible, with the children, and for your DH to find alternative accommodation. This is generally considered to be best for the children.

[MainlyMaynie]

Isn't it illegal for her to change the locks?

[BoffinMum]

I don't see how it could be, especially if the police were involved. It would only be a civil matter anyway.

[BoffinMum]

topicid=48690&section=00010001000800210001 Changing locks I think you might be confusing it with landlords (who can only change locks in certain circumstances).

[BoffinMum]

Here

[MainlyMaynie]

No, I've just frequently seen the advice on the relationships and legal boards that it is illegal to change the locks. Don't know anything more than that. That link is just to a forum though.

Burnt, maybe you could call a solicitor for advice?

[ChocHobNob]

If his name is on the mortgage or lease agreement, she can't change the locks. it is still his house.

[FamiliesShareGerms]

agree you should call a solicitor (or Citizens Advice, or the police) for advice before changing the locks. The advice a close family member was recently given by the police was that as long as they were both joint owners, both partners have the right to access the property and one party cannot legally refuse entry by changing the locks.

[NewKateMumsnet]

Hey everyone,

We will shortly be moving this thread to Relationships, at the OP's request