I'm concerned that I'm a "controlling" "redflag" husband HTF do I change? (long sorry)

[bongopants]

Preamble & Context Ok! short of everyone going she should leave you, you bastard... What do I have to do to change? I did go to see a therapist but he dobbed me in to social services and cause a load of grief at home cos I mentioned that I'd smacked my daughter once, left a bruise and I was freaked at what I done. We had three months of interviews, enquiries etc before they found there was no case to be found.

I've got anger issues, I'm quick tempered and can be quite obnoxious when I put my mind to it. I like things to be orderly and disciplined and I'm marginally obsessive compulsive. I had a really really shit upbringing crappy broken home, alky stepfather, cold violent mother, distant everything. To top all of that I have a sex compulsion too.

I'm pissed off with myself cos I feel that I'm fucking up my wife's life and my kids lives and I don't want to. I recently got some self help books but they seemed overly "Christian" and I'm a Jewish atheist.

The therapist I saw appeared to talk a lot of shit about "comming to terms", "understanding" and other such stuff. I don't want to come to terms I want a bloody fix for myself. I have considered drugs (prescription one of course but I won't rule out other sorts).

Even I annoy and irritate myself. Some of the things I've read on here about controlling, red-flag and paranoid make me think of myself. I have a deep inner worry that DW cheats on me, there's no evidence for it, we get jiggy together three or four times a week. I do mither about it but as she points out we do it more than most couple with two children under the age of 8.

I do get very narky when she doesn't answer the phone, which is stupid and its getting worse - I'm becoming way too needy at times.

Some other bits and pieces, three years ago I had a nervous breakdown and tried to top myself after psych services cleared me as no danger I've been feeling deeply fucked up inside and dunno what the hell to do.

Any helpful pointers on how to stop being a controlling knobhead, being needy, and/or a fucking dick whose gonna ruin his marriage and children would be greatly appreciated.

Bongo

Believe me when I say I am not trying to jump on particular words to villify you...rather it's that some disturbing/deluded things positively leap out in your last post:

I have noted that there have been some implications that there may be violence, nope sorry boys don't hit girls (except once which thoroughly disgusted me).

This doesn't mean you haven't been violence. It means you have been violent. Do you get that rather massive difference between the two? I'm not even going to ask what the incident was because you will, in some way, minimise it. You will be 'sorrowful' and 'disgusted' with yourself (the key thing being 'with yourself' because your sorrow is All About You and your feelings).

I don't go in for Emotional Abuse, but the tantrums (mine) and the stressors and the constant feeling of being angry drive me to cutting and burning myself. Which is I guess second hand abuse.

I really, really think you need to read up on Emotional Abuse. Being frequently subjected to someone's angry outbursts, criticism and tantrums is emotional abuse.

DW would have to take the girls out of school to afford childcare while she's at work. I don't have anywhere to go all of my mates evaporated after the breakdown and its over 30 years since I've been anywhere near my family.

This suggests to me you have absolutely no intention whatsoever about leaving for your family's peace and safety. And the onus is all on her isn't it? Of course marriages end when one partner works and the other doesn't! There is all manner of options. Friends can 'evaporate', yes, but I suspect that it's not because of your breakdown but because you fell out with them - am I right?

You really have taken very little responsibility in this latest post.

The anger and sarcasm seeps out with the general gist being 'OK yes I'm sorry...what do you want me to do turn back time?'.

You had a rough childhood, you are depressed and angry and prone to self harm. I am actually truly sorry you feel like that - a lot of us have and do. But if you allow your issues to screw up your dds then shame on you.

You are not a single man. You have a wife and children.

Your children are more important than you.

Do you really understand that?

You see, here's the thing. Practicalities can be worked out.
When people run from DV they go with the clothes on their back and whatever paperwork and stuff they can carry. It's horrible. But it has to be done. Do you want your wife and child to have to one day be in the position of having to run to a refuge because your temper has got so out of control, or your emotional abuse to much to bear?

But ok, you want someone to tell you how to do it?
You move out. You stay at a friends, you rent a room, you stay in a hostel, you rent a bedsit, you stay in a b&b
You come back in the morning to take your DCs to school if that is such a massive issue that your wife cannot do due to work.
You claim benefits if you are unable to work.
You tell your DCs that you love them but you need to work out your own issues in order to have a happy family life and you will see them every day.

And then you do a shit load of work on yourself. You take every bit of help offered. You go to your GP and get a referral. You seek private therapy if you need to and can afford it.
You accept that right now you cannot change by yourself and you need help. You embrace that help. And take responsibility for your behaviour and how it affects others.

But most importantly. You leave the house before something happens that can't be undone and we are advising your DW to grab the kids and go to a refuge. Because whether you believe it or not, it is only going to end up like that. No good will come of ignoring your problems.

Sorry ive just re read your last post about childcare.
How old are your DCs?
If they are at school, why would your wife need to take them out of school to afford childcare?
It's just, if they are at school, surely the only childcare you will need is after school? It certainley doesn't cost the earth for an ASC.
Plenty of parents manage to work, and pay for childcare, plenty of lone parents hold down a full time job.

You can't use that as an excuse not to leave.

There are courses you can take as a man in this situation. You could contact any of the abuse lines I'm sure they would be able to offer help. I have been in abusive relationships and I suggest keep working on yourself the first step is to admit it, the next is to seek help. Also you do attract partners who have similar issues 'your life is a mirror' it relflects to you what you need to learn. SAFE and the freedom programme may have local groups or they would be able to point you in the right drection. There is a brilliant book by Suze Casey Belief re patterning its great for working through rigid beliefs set in childhood. Best of luck

You could go to a&e and ask to be sectioned/admitted.

Yes, I do think it is that bad.

The reasons your family are not safe with you are; a. You believe you are sorry because you are affecting contrition but being sorry in this situation requires genuine repentance and taking responsibility which you absolutely don't do and never have in any of your posts.

B. there is ongoing abuse; emotional, verbal, physical (as proud says there is no such thing as one time being no violence) to both your wife and your children and towards yourself.

C. You are likely mentally ill and your issues are very complex and are not properly diagnosed or being treated.

D. With the "mea culpa" stuff and the being angry at the therapist reporting you and at us for implying there was violence/abuse you are actively avoidant of responsibility and further to that you are angry and blaming at others (it seems to be a trigger for your anger) when opportunities for you to take responsibility present themselves. This is very dangerous when you come forth with "mea culpa" as responsibility is a reasonable expectation within this and it makes me wonder if a lot of this current behaviour has an undertone of goading people into "pressing your buttons".

Is the man abusing.his.wife?

I'm not convinced, and i don't think any of us can be either.

Op, callRESPECT and just talk this stuff through, let them guide you.

Let them advise him of the need to leave or not.

He is emotionally abusing his wife.

And has been physically abusive too, 'once', by his own admission.

And I am concerned that what you learned from the therapist reporting your abuse is that if you make someone else (someone who is helping you) the focus it helps you to avoid taking responsibility, that it presents an opportunity to unite with your wife against the outside world and I think coming here to MN is a manipulative tactic to do that again "the harpies, they are attacking me" and then your wife is isolated from a place where she may get the support she may need to leave.

"They just don't understand you and I. We have something special. They'll overreact to everything you say."

"Look how they were when I asked for support and was genuinely sorry"

I have noted that there have been some implications that there may be violence, nope sorry

Did you think that some of us wanted there to be violence and are disappointed to hear it was 'just the once'?

Do you see how controlling you are trying to be?

Aggression is different to anger - aggression is violent. Threatening behaviour, towards yourself or others, is violent. So you have been and are still being violent in your relationship.

I understand that you are trying to help us see the picture exactly as it is, but please do not try to minimise your behaviour. Just look at the facts.

Regarding leaving, are you seriously telling us that the practicalities of leaving are so difficult that you would rather risk damaging your dds?

He admitted from the OP that he had been violent once to his daughter. I dont think the latest post is an admission of another occasion.

Personally, if my DP (lets say hes abusive) told me one day that he was moving out while he Got Help and sorted himself out, I dont think I would see it as him safeguarding me and DD. I would see it as him making it All About Him yet again and leaving me with all the responsibilities of our life.

You need therapy. You need to accept and acknowledge that whatever the reasons, it is only you to blame for your actions. Because as an adult you have free choice.

I think you are getting a hard time on here because a lot of us have experienced first hand what you are putting your wife through. We have also read threads from distressed women who have been utterly destroyed by the behaviour of the man who claims to love them.

Dont for one second think you arent emotionally abusing your wife. You are. And agression is as bad as physically striking out because it creates the same fear.

You need to work out, with your wife, what the best solution is for your family. She gets a say in that. A large say. We can only advise.

offred your post was an eye opener.
I never thought that the op could use mumsnet to isolate his wife from help but thinking about it, it makes sense.
A lot of abusive, controlling husbands hate mumsnet for that reason, it gives their wives access to a support network and practical advice.

OP,I was wondering why you chose to post this topic on mumsnet, especially since you have since told us your wife is a mumsnetter.
I find it quite sad to think that it could be used in such a way.

God your posts make my blood run cold. You are textbook OP.

You really are.

The sneery tone, the sarcasm, the references to your outburst followed by stories of self-harming to garner sympathy. ALL emotional abuse which, apparently, you don't believe in?!

I suggest the posters defending this man take a proper look at his posts and at the threads about EA and DV.

Posting here when his wife MNs is just another cog in that wheel.

I just think, and am prepared to be wrong, that the op has come here knowing his wife is here, wanting her to be lurking and he says he is sorry and worried and wanting to get help.

That's where it ends though. He says sorry is enough, he says he is not violent just hit once, he back tracks on any admittance of responsibility straight away, he defines contrition to support his assertion that sorry is enough, his posts absolutely filled to the brim with a feeling of pent up rage, he's also jumping on things people say such as he gets a sense people think there is violence "well that hitting wasn't violence nah" and I think across the whole thread that was a real minority point if made at all and it is like he wants to be in control of this thread and what is talked about on it. It is not giving me a feeling that he is coming for support, but that he is coming because he has some other purpose or thing to gain from it.

If you genuinely want support op, MN will give it but not at the expense of your wife and children but if the op is genuine then I think you are a very long way from being able to accept help because you are not able to see and accept your faults.

Still not listening OP

It's just a barrage of excuses and justifications to minimise your behaviour.

This isn't a drama series you are in and you are the tragic hero who'll 'just' become good in the end and everyone will realise what a great guy you are.....you are right now fucking up your children's lives. Real life children. Who will one day need to go out into the world on their own....and with what values, self-beliefs, anger?

Tragic.

But you are not in any way taking any responsibility for what you do. Your kids won't be 'alright', I'll assure you of that.

Saying sorry, even feeling sorry is irrelevant and pointless. What matters is taking responsibility and genuine repentance which require action for change.

All abusers say sorry for the abuse and they all think that should be enough and get angry if people think they are wrong and say what is important is actually getting help because fundamentally they don't believe they ARE wrong, they are saying sorry in an "I'm sorry you feel that way" way. The therapist caused the investigation, my childhood made me bad, MN accused me of violence...

I agree Walter and offred.

We all know why people become abusers, that's not the issue.

The issue is WtF the abuser is going to do about it? As usual, it seems, it is wallow in self pity, and entitlement, and pure unbridled selfishness while they continue fucking up people's lives.

• excuses

• sarcasm

• no real taking of responsibility

• no intention of leaving the family home or of getting help.

Yup, you're textbook OP. I really hope you get off of MN soon.

Maybe I'm just wearing my cynical hat this morning, but I think motives here are ridiculously transparent.

Out of hundreds of forums on the internet, out of all the other places you could have gone to, to share your story, you have to knowingly enter a space used by your wife and invade somewhere she may have previously considered a safe space. Depending on the type of response you'll get, you can either use other posters responses to say, "See, they're saying I'm doing x, y, z to get better, I'm not a monster," etc or, "Bunch of crazy harpies who say you should leave me," leaving more room to put her down.

What a nasty, underhand and manipulative tactic.

I didn't even want to respond to this thread to give it the time of day as I'd rather support people who are subject to behaviour like yours. I only wanted to say you can try and pull the wool over some people's eyes, but not others.

I do find it a bit that the op came here to talk about his marriage, when 1. He is not a regular poster

1. He knows his wife lurks/is a poster here
2. He could have phoned/emailed respect

I hope you can manage to take on the good advise you have received here, Bongo.
I think you should ask yourself honestly, are you posting here for manipulative reasons?

I sincerely hope he goes now. Because I think this is an exercise in control and manipulation.

I have seen this exact thing play out on another forum. Anyone who was on the Irish one that's crapper than similar to MN will know the one I mean.

It was scary and upsetting for the DW who had been posting there for years. There are no depths some people won't sink to.

Also, in your op you said you had a sex compulsion.

I presume that 'compulsion' is something you are unable to control outside of your marriage? What wiv it all not being your fault n all

My textbook is just being really smug right now

Hopefully your Dw is a long time mner and has some level of trust in the authenticity of the responses here.

Have you looked at Cognitive Behavioural therapy? It focuses more on the here and now and modifying your thoughts and behaviour and not delving into your childhood so much.