Advice for intimate loving sex please...

[Spuddybean]

DP and i have quite a kinky sex life. Role play, BDSM, fantasies etc. But we never have really intimate, loving sex. We hardly kiss and he doesn't touch me much. I really want to bring this dimension to sex but as it's not really natural to us, I am unsure where to begin.

i want to have sex as ourselves for a change, with lots of romance, kissing, touching etc. So i would appreciate some advice with how to do this without making us feel silly or DP thinking i am being critical of his normal style.

I thought about maybe a shower together first and some massage oil, perhaps some nice music. But am worried it will feel stupid, like i am trying to recreate some r&b type nonsense!

I am 34 wks pregnant and want us to feel really close - if that makes sense. I said i had saucy plans for us for Sunday, and he has immediately gone down the role play route and started fantasising. I said no, i wanted something intimate with us as us and he seemed disappointed. So now i feel a bit unsure.

Try this... Agree beforehand not to have sex at all. Focus solely on the senses, especially touch, and set the scene accordingly. It's no more 'stupid' than BDSM fantasies. If your DP can't get aroused by something as natural as touching, I'd be a little worried.

Have you never made 'love'? Has it always been more experimental? How does he show you love outside of the bedroom?

I have no problem with being experimental, as long as it isn't a replacement for loving sex now and again.

Eye contact - lots of it. That can be incredibly intimate, so much so that it can be quite uncomfortable and vulnerable to do at first. But it's worth persevering!

Sorry i should have said - We rarely have PIV anyway, so actually i do want to end on 'sex' but want a sensual lead up to it IYKWIM.

And yes DP is wired differently than a lot of men, but i feel a desire for more connecting intimate needs to be met and perhaps teach him to enjoy it too. Maybe it's because I am pregnant and i feel i need 'reassurance'.

thisis well neither of us is particularly into 'making lurve'. We started just hardcore shagging, which progressed into 'experimental' sex and fantasies. We have twice had quite deep sex where we have looked into each others eyes and said we loved each other, but that was 2 years ago. But i want/need that connection again.

There was a programme a while back, I think it was Sex inspectors, a couple had exactly the same issue, lots of kinky sex but zero intimacy, they never had sex facing one another, looking into each other's eyes etc.
Google sensate focus, does he never cuddle or kiss you?

Yes we cuddle and kiss all the time but not during sex. We have a very 'sweet' way with each other referring to pet names and lots of physical contact. But it just doesn't transfer to sex.

Kissing is a particular issue, as his technique is awful. I know that sounds terrible and i love him so much but he is the worst kisser ever! I have tried to change this by demonstrating how i like to be kissed but nothing sticks. He seems to think what i show him is exactly what he is already doing - but it really isn't. If i try to suggest different techniques he gets defensive and says 'everything he does is wrong' and that's the way he kisses so like it or lump it.

I was thinking using Sunday as a 'oh let's both do/learn something different' might work.

I get what you are saying about kissing, but there are other ways of being intimate and loving.

Instead of a proper snog, you can just have lips and kiss all around the face, go for gentle touch, or he lets you kiss him.

Maybe he avoids kissing as he doesn't think he's very good at it?

Spuddy are you me? My sex life is just as you describe and DH has always looked hurt when I suggest something more vanilla, as if I am being critical of what we usually do. Its not that, its just that a change is good sometimes!

I'm not sure how you would do something different, perhaps if it didn't feel right you could put it on a more bdsm front and dictate what he is to do? Or does that entirely defeat the point?

I think Eclectic has a point there.

If someone told me I wasn't a great kisser, I would just avoid kissing.

He doesn't really like using his mouth for anything intimate and doesn't like things close to his face. But i really miss deep mouth kissing and the sensation of being kissed, licked, gently bitten over my body. I do it to him and he likes it but just doesn't do it back :(

He also doesn't caress, or touch me softly. I find it very frustrating. It is always directly to the fanjo. He also likes using toys - which is fine. But we never have sex without them. We even take them on holiday as we have become so dependent on them for sex.

I am starting to feel this is all really shallow. I know hollywood sex is a myth, but there is a happy medium i think. I have had it before. However, I love and fancy my DP more than anyone else i have ever met, and i only want him forever more.

I think maybe he relies on toys etc as he thinks that's what you like. Maybe you need to take it back to emotions and psychological attraction. Ban sex, only kissing and touching non genitals. Praise him, make sure he knows you love him dearly, use eye contact.

He sounds like he has detached sex from emotional intimacy and cab't put the two together. Sex has got to have an element of emotional intimicy at least sometimes or it becomes soulless. If he doesn't like using his mouth can you ask him to use his hands? A massage is a great idea.

Bonkey sorry if i was unclear - I have never told him he is a bad kisser. I have broached the subject gently by saying 'oh lets try this new technique' etc. I always give good feedback, eye contact.

TBH i think he relies on toys because it is easier and he is more interested in his fetishes/kink than vanilla sex.

We have had numerous conversations and i have written 2 letters to him (as i know the subject is sensitive) saying that while i love him and our kinky fun i would like to expand into more intimacy. He just seems irritated by it and promises to try but nothing has ever changed.

When we have our 'vanilla' sex he keeps his eyes closed mainly and likes to fantasise about our kinky sex. He doesn't move much and i have to ask him to sit up or turn over or whatever. I just feel that i'm not enough and he see's vanilla sex as a necessary act he must do to have all the other stuff he likes (not just sex btw).

I don't know - i just feel there is a part of me missing and unfulfilled.

How about a sex counsellor? He might be lacking in confidence to try something new that he hasn't experienced?

I assume you have a good relationship otherwise?

I'd be very offended if my DH was lying with eyes closed fantasising about kinky stuff and not engaging with me whilst having sex, that suggests he sees you only as a prop to his fetishes and can't connect with you as a person, sexually - is he interested in your pleasure at all? It doesn't sound like it tbh.

How's he going to be when you have a newborn and haven't got the time or the inclination to indulge his fetishes?

Sex toys are no substitute for genuine intimacy, I'm puzzled as to why he can be tactile and affectionate in every day life but not regarding sex.

Malificence, it's not always a conscious and deliberate decision.

My DH is a bit like this when having sex (we aren't into any kinky stuff).

He tends to avoid eye contact, rarely kisses me, doesn't like to talk and mainly loves penetration and direct genital stimulation.

I feel sad a lot of the time about it because I love him so much and want him to be tender with me.

And it would make him an excellent lover in my eyes, whereas right now, he is just ok.

I don't know how to change it spuddybean, sounds like you have been a lot more direct than me so far!

He just seems irritated by it and promises to try but nothing has ever changed

That's not good, is it? Who initiates the fantasies/role play? Him? If so, you are trying what he likes to please him, so he should reciprocate.

We are all different, but your sex life sounds awful to me and your DP sounds like a horrendous lover - well, not a 'lover' at all really.

Really sorry for you :( Like Malificence I too find it strange that he can be affectionate out of bed but not in it. And the reliance on toys, eyes closed, etc. Do you think he has to have it this way to keep an erection? Is he a heavy porn user?

An episode of the Sex Inspectors that I watched addressed this with a couple. Tracey Cox's advice was to do what CES suggested; no sex, just touching, massaging and talking and sort of going back to basics: www.channel4.com/programmes/the-sex-inspectors/episode-guide/series-1/episode-6

I think you have to have a serious chat. I enjoy a bit of fantasy and kinky stuff, but when I want a bit more romance, then I make it clear. It really sounds really unsatisfactory to be doing role play all the time. You really have to make it very clear that it's not what you want. If he's disappointed, then so be it - your needs are equally important.

If he can only get turned on by role play and fantasy, then that's a worry. It seems to be a way for him to avoid a real connection. What kind of upbringing or introduction to sex did he have? Can he only let go if it's naughty or part of a game?

As an aside: Jeez - you're 34 weeks pregnant - he should be glad he's getting any IMHO.

Well, I do have sympathy for him. He is hardwired for a fetish and sadly finds other stuff not much of a turn on. Sadly it's not a case of asking him to just do sex another way. If he can't get aroused by it no matter how much he tries then it is frustrating for him too.

As for Porn - absolutely not. His fetishes are very different. If he masturbates it would be over something very different. ie texture or an inanimate object. He doesn't really look at that kind of 'women' at all.

And yes, he see's that side as an escape. He has a very stressful job and the role play/kinky games are a way to not be him for a while. Like a lot of people with fetishes, he is stuck in a closed loop as it were, and now seems unable to get out of it. He was single for 10 years before we met so has had plenty of time on his own to really hone it down!

He is very affectionate out of bed and just cannot link it to sex because, as i say, he just doesn't appear to be wired like that. He does care about whether i orgasm tho, which is why the toys are used. But it is very much a turn taking thing. He lays down and fantasises while i sort him out, then i lay down and he makes me come while fantasising with me. But it has become really limited and tbh feels no real difference to me just masturbating on my own.

Sorry, can't sleep, so this may be a bit incoherent :)

Even of he doesn't get turned on by (ok I'm going to say it although I may puke at the term) 'making love' he could enjoy the intimacy and the fact that he's pleasuring you. I would feel entirely unsatisfied if the only way my man touched me was via a plastic toy. If he can't get into touching and stroking you because it doesn't make him horny- that's a bit selfish really.