Very tearful, DH aggressive attitude

[Rennie12]

In a nutshell. I told my DH of 21 years today I've had enough of him being a bully.
He's taken it badly and now I'm wondering if his behaviour isn't too bad and I've been harsh with him.
We have 4 DC's all teenagers and they're not bad kids at all. DC1 suffers from anxiety and I'm not sure of DH has been the trigger.
It is not what he says to the kids ie tidy your room, turn you lights off, stop pestering the dog etc. I agree with him It's the way he says it. He really shouts at the kids and speaks to my oldest like he hates him. He doesn't like him I know. I am constantly on edge about the way he treats DC1 as I just want him to get better.
He criticises me all the time from the moment I get up. ie why are you loading the dishwasher like that? etc And never says thank you.
I make him a cup of tea every morning and that really gets on my nerves,( I've told him I'd like a cup of tea sometimes)Hhe won't get out of bed and make me one and just lies there while I get everyone off to school.
He really shouted at my 19yr old last night for being silly with the dog and his best friend was here! I was in bed asleep and he woke me up with the shouting.
He shouts a lot and he knows I don't like him doing it to the kids. He is grumpy and has fallen out with most people.
I'm so tearful now, as I wish I'd told him his behaviour was unacceptable and not that he was a bully.
Don't know what to do. Don't know what I want anyone to say. I'm just shaking. He's gone out.

I read it that Rennie just wants some advice about what to do right now while she has a think about things and girds herself to maybe leave

^^ didi - that looks good. It's a bit of broken record, a bit how you deal with a toddler who is attempting to argue the toss.

except that a toddler usually wants to make you happy!

yes. true. Although sometimes they just want their own way, and to feel powerful. I agree it's a temporary solution. To respond in a way that leaves you feeling some sense of control and hopefully not result in escalation

I see what you mean Jamie, and yes the idea is not to escalate things.

Hope Rennie will get those books asap.

Thanks, will ignore criticisms and read book.
I'm not sure I'm ready for a solicitor. Feeling a bit low again.
Can't believe I've let it go on for so long. Feel so sorry for my DC1.
Don't know what other DC's will make of it all if I go. Hope they won't blame DC1.
Desperately need to get 19yr old DC1 a job while home from Uni if only to get him away from DH. It's not easy.
DH would make me move out, there is no way he'd spend money on another flat/house.

Can i tell you about my DC? I agonised over leaving. Like yours mine husband appeared only to pick on one child (DS2). The others were "happy"...apparently.

Only now do I really see how much they were affected by the behaviour...now they are truly happy...even their faces have changed, no underlying tension. their relationships with one-another are freer and better our house is happy, loving, calm and normal!

Don't stay in an abusive relationship for the children. it is not kind to sacrifice yourself and to fail to show them what is right in a relationship.

One day they will be husbands/wives/parents.......they need to know how to behave

PS you are brave and wonderful even looking at all this...your new reality is a scary place to be.l I am thinking of you.

PM me if you ever want to

Rennie Couldn't read and run. Have just come across your thread. Can I just say I think you are very brave in just facing up to everything in such a short space of time. If you are feeling low then just read back your first few posts and see how much your attitude has changed.

I wish you luck in whatever you decide.

DH would make me move out Oh really? Given that you have dc, unless provision was made for you to set up in a new home of your own, it's highly unlikely that any Court would require you to move out of the marital home.

If you're not ready for a solicitor, post on the Legal board for answers to questions such as how will joint assets such as the marital home, his pension pot, etc, be divided and what can I expect in terms of child support, spousal maintenance etc in the event of divorce.

Knowledge is power, honey, and you are in dire need of the empowerment that will come from knowing your legal rights and entitlements after 21 years of marriage and 4 dc.

The stark truth is that, without legal sanction, no one can make you do anything you don't want to do - and that includes your twunt of a h.

Twenty one years of being ground down by verbal and emotional abuse, eh? Twenty one years of him ruling the roost. Do you fancy another 21 years of it because if you don't take steps to kick this twunt into orbit bring about positive change in your life, that's what's you're going to get.

Rennie your husband can't automatically make you move out with the children, that's where a solicitor would beable to help and advise you, when you feel ready to go, I also wouldn't mention to the other dc that part of the reason you would end the marriage is because of dc1 that is something they will understand when they are much older IMO

yes...it's never the children's fault that we leave...though they may be our motivation (quite why I couldn't do it for myself alone is a whole other story I suspect)....our choice. We owe it to them to get them out of the situation our abusive partners put us and them in.

We owe it to ourselves too...but if you don't believe you're worth it (and after 21 years of being told you are not you may find it hard to believe) finding a reason to go outside of ourselves can be a very powerful motivator.

Going to a solicitor can be free...search for a family lawyer on the Resolution website and check if they do a free first consult. It does not commit you to anything but it does give you knowledge of the options and the impossible gradually becomes possible.

How are you today rennie hope you are ok x

Absolutely fool. It's DC1 that's my motivation and the others would NEVER get to hear that off me. Although I'm sure DH would make it quite clear to DC1 that he's ruined our relationship. Thanks for being so kind everyone I still feel strong, but my head is spinning. I am still wondering if it's bad enough to have the EA label.
Just that yesterday morning DH asked (this is very typical) 'why is the marmalade in the fridge?' That in itself seems an OK question to most people. But I know he means, why have you put the marmalade in the fridge, it doesn't need to go in there. I've told you before. Anyway I replied 'because someone put it there' and left it at that.
I just got to thinking this must go on in a lot of households?
Not everyone has a great marriage.
The shouting is more directed at DC1 but is done so I can hear. When I jump in to stop it. He always replies that I should be backing him up and he's disappointed that we aren't in agreement. He's sulking at the moment.
Thanks for the advice about the house and solicitor. I don't think I can PM, fool, as I set up this account in a hurry and I can't remember my new email password, I didn't write it down.
I know you are talking sense when you say I need to show them what is right in a relationship, but I'm really not sure what a good husband/wife relationship is.

The marmalade questions isn't a question it's an accusation, he is telling you off in his own way because you/someone in the house hadn't adhered to his way, yes it is very common in alot of households and that on its own isn't enough to break up a marriage IMO, but it's just one part of the bigger picture of criticism and belittling as is the telling off/shouting at dc1 but loud enough for everyone else to hear so he gets his message across to you all and unsettles the entire household.

EA doesn't always have a eureka moment when it is so blinding obvious that you have to leave the relationship immediately, it is more often than not a gradual insidious creeping pattern of behaviour and responses from people involved, The analogy of the frog in hot water is an excellent way to describe it, give yourself time to mull things over and gain knowledge from all sources around you, unfortunately i doubt anyone will come in and say yes this is disgraceful rennie you must leave him, not even the solicitor will say that unless someone's life is in danger, it has to come from within you when you feel ready. My mother is still putting up with EA and I have been where you are now and it took me several years to finally find the strength to break free so don't be too hard on yourself

Rennie A good relationship is where you feel like you are an equal, you're never walking on egg shells and are happy with each other most of the time. You all deserve better than this.

Good luck Rennie and stay strong.

you can read your messages on mumsnet.....just click on "message poster" right of any post. If someone messages you it will show as a red dot on the envelope at the top of the screen next to inbox. the messages don't leave mumsnet and so are as safe as all your other posts.

Rennie - yes, the marmalade thing is a veiled criticism and it goes on in my house when people are in a bad mood with each other, but it's not a regular occurrence, and it's negated by lots of expressions of praise, gratitude, helping each other and having fun. An underlying feeling that we like, respect and even admire each other.

I think you are very brave. I can only imagine you have become used to really high levels of internal tension and wariness about when a criticism witll happen or a negative event. The only time in my life I can liken it to (that feeling of walking on eggshells) was when my children were toddlers and they couldn't help how they were behaving. I remember how that made me feel.

... actually, the only time apart from when I was in my early 20's and my dad was starting to irritable with his illness.

Rennie, I've only read your posts here, not other peoples advice so forgive me if I reiterate what others have said. I have also been on a learning journey regarding emotional abuse. I have read some of the books and what I learned is that much of what is happening is not deliberate. His behaviour is abusive and actively works against your best interests, but he may be doing it subconsciously. I'm saying that because it is also likely that you have put up with this behaviour and allowed it for reasons that are beyond your control too. When the two of you met, your personalities matched somehow.

But sadly this kind of relationship is not one that can continue with any happiness, but you wouldn't have known that then. You are still here because you are probably very strong - you can fight back (you said you always point out his bad behaviour). Many women wouldn't be able to do that, many women would just cry and run. You are with him not because you are a weak victim, but because you are feisty enough to survive. He is extremely 'lucky' to have found you. What will happen now is that he will do anything to keep you on side. His need for you is much greater than your need for him. Bear that in mind when he makes you that next cup of tea.

Tread carefully now, try to continue as you were before, while you sort your head out. These men, when they lose control, can become dangerous. Speak to your Dad, and even his close friends to get an honest view of what they see. It may be that they are dying to give you advice. Make your decision about DH before you talk to him as the moment he knows you're onto him he will try and manipulate you. Accept that he won't change.

Remember that your strength is what has seen you through so far, and whatever happens, you will be able to call on that strength.

Also, write as much down as you can and keep it.

I am just so overwhelmed at the kindness people have shown me on this thread. Thank you. You have all really helped. I promise I'll help someone else one day.
I am a fighter and won't feel sorry for myself and I will carry on protecting my DC's.
I wish I could live in your house Jamie.
Susie, what you said in your last post has helped me so much to understand what it is that's happening. I can't believe I didn't even know what EA was, this time last week!
I'll post back, when I've read the book. Hope Didi is OK too.

rennie I'm fine and am watching and listening, just sometimes a bit short of time to post. Thanks for asking.

I won't be leaving this thread - even if you don't see me I'm here and thinking about you.

I've had the marmalade comment too. Still get it sometimes. Since understanding about EA I've realised so many things about that kind of comment. I think your answer was excellent.

Those comments are soooo controlling. I used to explain why I put the marmalade in the fridge. "Well you see, it keeps better there" - always trying to keep the peace, and enabling him too.

Now I understand that, not only can I put it there if I want to, I do not have to justify, explain, my decision to do so! H speaks to me as if I am an employee sometimes. He thinks he's "in charge" of all of us and is therefore entitled to do, say, shout, whatever if he feels it's necessary.

I used to be (still am) an educated, independent, efficient person. What Nanny said earlier today is so right. They feed off us, because we are strong and we put up with it for longer than others would. You sound like a tough and brave gal, you're not stupid for putting up with this,

I remember so clearly one day years ago, when I suddenly realised I didn't care in the slightest what he thought of me, how he criticised me. I suddenly for some reason saw that his opinion had no value. I remember looking down at the kitchen worktop as he was spouting some rubbish at me and how a lightbulb went off in my head! So liberating.

I think (and hope) that my kids have learnt some of that kind of thinking. Sad though it is that I want my kids to grow up with no respect for their father!

Concentrate now, on you and on your eldest.

One last thing. A quote I read the other day...

Good luck rennie, MN is a wealth of advice and knowledge, I am still learning alot from other posters on here, deep down you sound strong as do you didi, keep popping back there will be advice on here when you are ready to make a move towards separation, alot of us have been there got the tshirt and came out the other side, I wish I could convey to you the sense of inner peace and calmness I now have after divorcing my EA exH, the migraines, indigestion, anxiety, tearfulness and constant worry have all but disappeared

It's been the end of 3 very long sad weeks, where I have refused to let my DH think he can get away with shouting at my DCs.
I've got the Lundy book and am avidly reading it. I can identify with what he says in so many ways but I don't find my DH trying to control me as such but being angry at my DCs, which I find worse.
DH realised yesterday I'd had enough and asked me in the morning if what I wanted was to separate. To my surprise, and even more to his I said it might be the best thing. He went so quiet. I couldn't bring myself to say yes, let's separate now. Aaaaagh!
He went out for the day on his own and I had a lovely day laughing and enjoying being with our teenagers. The mood was so nice and relaxed and I decided I couldn't care less if he never came back. But of course he did. My heart sunk.
He told me, he had made up his mind, not to get angry again and was really going to try, as he hadn't realised how much it upset me and I was the most important person in his life. Well the kids are more important to me (I didn't actually say that to him).
So yes, I can hear you shouting, read the book, and I know this is the typical pattern of EAs. But I am watching now and waiting for the next time. And I'll be more prepared emotionally and practically. I'm just not ready to go / make him leave yet.
I'm going to ask him to apologise to the DCs and then see what happens.
I feel better now as I know I don't have to put up with being miserable for the rest of my life and I can go if I want and I know the DCs will understand.
I'm writing everything down and it's not nice reading.
Thanks for recommending the book. I do feel stronger than ever and DH senses that.