Very tearful, DH aggressive attitude

[Rennie12]

In a nutshell. I told my DH of 21 years today I've had enough of him being a bully.
He's taken it badly and now I'm wondering if his behaviour isn't too bad and I've been harsh with him.
We have 4 DC's all teenagers and they're not bad kids at all. DC1 suffers from anxiety and I'm not sure of DH has been the trigger.
It is not what he says to the kids ie tidy your room, turn you lights off, stop pestering the dog etc. I agree with him It's the way he says it. He really shouts at the kids and speaks to my oldest like he hates him. He doesn't like him I know. I am constantly on edge about the way he treats DC1 as I just want him to get better.
He criticises me all the time from the moment I get up. ie why are you loading the dishwasher like that? etc And never says thank you.
I make him a cup of tea every morning and that really gets on my nerves,( I've told him I'd like a cup of tea sometimes)Hhe won't get out of bed and make me one and just lies there while I get everyone off to school.
He really shouted at my 19yr old last night for being silly with the dog and his best friend was here! I was in bed asleep and he woke me up with the shouting.
He shouts a lot and he knows I don't like him doing it to the kids. He is grumpy and has fallen out with most people.
I'm so tearful now, as I wish I'd told him his behaviour was unacceptable and not that he was a bully.
Don't know what to do. Don't know what I want anyone to say. I'm just shaking. He's gone out.

Yes, it will escalate...but the alternative is to let the DC1 take the rap and try to rebuild him after...it doesn't really work does it?

Rennie...worried that this has all been a bit too much for you to take. Hope youa are ok

Excellent advice on here for you op, your household sounds very very similar to the one I grew up in, I was the scapegoat child my sibling Was the favoured child, I grew up full of anxiety around my father waiting for him to verbally lash out he could change in a heartbeat if I did something that he considered stupid or silly, he was critical, bullish and loved the sound of his own voice, he particularly enjoyed belittling and reprimanding me or my mother when we had company and seemed to have no sense of embarrassment as to whether this was appropriate, my self esteem was so low that I ended up marrying pretty much the first man who showed any interest in me, and that didn't end well(whole other story)

The sad thing is I am 42 and my father is no different he and my mother have retired now and he picks on her all day long often reducing her to tears, she is slowly losing her spark, comfort eating, lost her confidence with driving and is so fed up she doesn't know what to do with herself at times,
I am at a loss as to what to do to help her, this may well be you op if you don't try to sort a better life out for yourself and your dc! You have six people in your house and five of you are altering your behaviour to suit the other one.

no,fool, it doesn't work. I know what it's like trying to "distract" H from a potential rant at one of the kids, or trying to diffuse it, but NEVER having the courage to confront it...for fear of making it worse and making the dc's suffer more...iyswim. It's hard to believe I was so stupid. I wish so much that I knew then what I know now.

Pathetic but years ago, I didn't know what was happening. I didn't know how to handle it, I thought if I could just "handle" it/him a little better.....

Nowadays, now that I've learnt about EA, I stand up to him a lot more. But I don't think it makes much difference. The only thing that will really get through to him is when I leave.

Rennie, read the book by Lundy Bancroft...there's another good one called "the Emotionally Abusive Relationship (by Patricia someone).

Yes it's a good idea to write stuff down...think I'll try that.

I'm OK today thanks foolonthehill as he was OK all day yesterday and he'll be fine for a while now. I'm just quiet with him. I do feel a bit numb though as it has been a lot to take in.
Didi, it's taken me even longer to realise what's happening - 21 years!
I feel so stupid. I just thought he was an irritable and shout y person.
When he criticises eg my driving, my shopping, I always thought he did it because he genuinely believes he could do it better, I'm still not sure he's doing it to be nasty.
Also like you, if I confront him straight away in front of the kids he does get even more cross and I hate that for them.
The other day he went in to the bathroom and stepped in a tiny puddle of water and got his sock wet. DC1 had just had a shower. He swore and really shouted, that's not normal is it? So DC1 feels awful, I'm saying, 'That's not right, Dad is really stressed. Don't worry.' Not a nice atmosphere.
I will read the books.
If your DC1 thinks it would be fine to leave, does that make it a bit easier for you didi? How would the other DC's react?. Leaving is just not easy I know.

No it's not normal to have such a strong unpleasant reaction to a puddle of water on the floor, annoying as it is to get your socks wet, your Dh has spent such a long time being this way it is second nature to him, he sees no reason to change as everyone else in the house has modified their behaviour to fit around his, being with someone like this as an adult is bad enough but to be raised by someone like this as a child and have anxiety every time you are around them is quite another, you will find alot of posters on here op that years later in adulthood are still trying to accommodate, understand, cope with toxic parents it has a devastating lasting effect, please please please try to find the strength to change things for the sake of your dc if not yourself, and I say this with concern for you all not judgement.

no-one should judge someone ion an EA relationship. Unless you've been there doing the work to try to make it right you just don't realise how difficult it is to see the abuse....it's the frog in the water thing...if the frog were put into hot water it would jump out if the water is gradually warmed it will stay in and poach.

You all deserve more but so often we cannot make changes for ourselves, particularly as we love them and we have invested so much of ourselves in them and in the relationship. However, often it is the thought of this cycle perpetuating through the DCs that gives us the strength to get out and show them what normal looks like.

A normal,calm loving home is a wonderful thing.

i am still not used to it...7 months on.

You are right fool for me it was watching my dc being treated badly by my exH that was the final straw for me to end my 18 year marriage and with counselling and time away from the constant bullish selfish horrible behaviour I have been able to see that I tolerated it for so long because I was used to it from my father, I just knew in my heart I couldn't let my kids grow up in a very similar environment, but it took me five years to find that strength to end it, relationships are a very complex thing indeed, op you don't have to make changes overnight but read the books people have suggested and overtime find your voice in your relationship and go from there, anything is better than havin the horrible sense of despair that things will never change for you or your dc.

This is not my thread, but all your posts could be written for me. I'm a little further down the line than rennie, but still unable to make that final move.

Yes Rennie, I don't suppose my eldest would care if I left, (though he's away at uni so can already see things from a distance). The others are 17 & 15. How do I move their whole lives out of here? When they were little all they needed was a cuddly toy and me. We would need to physically transport everything that's important to them and you know what that's like with teens!

Would I really be able to provide something better for them? This is one of the things that's keeping me procrastinating. Should I take them far away...but what about their friends? Friends are so important at this age.

Suzy - it's cheering that it took you 5 years to get out...it's been about that since I discovered EA and what was happening to me.

The thought of a "calm, normal " household is so nice.

I will buy the book tomorrow Susie and try and make sense of it all. I still don't know whether everything is bad enough to give it the label EA. Hopefully the book will tell me.
You are right fool, I've invested so much in trying to give my kids a loving stable home. I'm still not sure the alternative would be better as the other DCs obviously like us being together and I will be destroying our family mainly to protect DC1 and myself. But you are very brave and have obviously done the right thing.
Our kids are the same age Didi and it is the practicality of it all and whether they'll all be happy at home just with mum.
DH back to his normal self today - I greased the Yorkshire pudding tin the wrong way and the fairy liquid I buy is no good!!! Sounds pathetic and if I told anyone I was leaving for these little snipes, they'd think I was stupid.
DC1 asked me this morning ,if he had to give him a Father's day card. I said no. However DH was in a mood and was purposely quiet when my lovely Dad came round for lunch today. Mum knows something's up but didn't say anything.
All the kids are out on Wednesday so I'm going to talk to DH about his behaviour then. I just feel so indifferent towards him. He doesn't give me the respect I deserve, but can't understand why I'm have lost respect for him.

Do your other children "obviously like you being together" or is it more passive than that? It's all they have ever known. Would you want any of them to have relationships with their partners that are a relentless series of snipes, grumpiness and anxiety? That may be what they settle for. Worse, they may lose, or have already lost respect for you and your oldest son because the fact you have been beaten down by his disrespect, and somehow deserve it.

I wish I could show you what your relationship should be like, and how children should feel towards their father.

sorry that should have read "... and somehow they may come to believe you deserve it"

You may find the children feel relief without the atmosphere and bullying And are too afraid to express how they really feel right now.

Can he move out when you're ready, not you? Less unsettling for the children.

Sorry number 2.

What I meant to say was "I wish I could show you how it feels to live in a house where this aggression, sniping and grumpiness is an exception, rather than the rule".

DH back to his normal self today - I greased the Yorkshire pudding tin the wrong way and the fairy liquid I buy is no good!!! Sounds pathetic and if I told anyone I was leaving for these little snipes, they'd think I was stupid.

It doesn't sound pathetic and I don't think you are stupid.

After 3 nights of waking at 2am and not get back to sleep, I'm running on adrenalin. After finally realising that I am living with an EA husband, my mind is working overtime.
I have now come to realise being criticised isn't normal- thank you!
So I was wondering (as I haven't got the book yet).
What should I have done with the Yorkshire pudding tin for instance. You see my normal reaction is to carry on the way I am doing something, not say anything and ignore him, that way the peace is kept.
So should I have
a) given him a look of 'what?' (he would then shout)
b) stop making the Yorkshires (children would suffer)
c) used the tin as a boomerang and flung it across the garden ?
As you can tell I'm in high spirits today. I was even dancing round the kitchen to 'I am what I am' on my own this morning. He isn't going to change me.
Anyway how are you meant to deal with criticism?

I don't think retaliating is a good idea sadly. As then your children and you will suffer with verbal attacks or more

You need to speak to womensaid for their advice imo and I'd course buy the book and build up your strength to leave imo

"Of course"

Your question I think means that you think you can "manage" his EA?

You can't. He chooses to act like an arse. There is nothing you can do to "make" him not be an arse.

There is no way to react to his behaviour whatever you do it will not be right and most of the time these sort of people like nothing more than a good spat, it will wear you out long before it does him, so ignoring it is your best bet, for now.

I agree with others. there's no right reaction to the cooking incident. Keep strong, read up on emtional abuse, quietly feel strong and make a plan to leave. Take up the free half hour with a solicitor to start ball rolling.

Was just meaning, how can I manage the criticism?
Absolutely don't want to make him cross.
Shop not got the book, will order it and carry on keeping the peace.

Rennie there isn't a way to 'manage' the criticism, there is no magic wand anyone can wave to make them immune to it, I doubt anyone on here will have any secrets as to how to smile and carry on when someone constantly criticises and belittles you and your dc over a long period of time, it is your Dh that needs to modify his behaviour not you love, he is verbally and emotionally abusing you and at least one of your dc, until you can really get to grips with that there's not alot you can do to change things, youve tried answering back, you've tried making light of it and being light and breezy and you've tried ignoring him, it's made no real difference over the years, that's why people have recommended the books and a solicitor. Hope you are feeling ok today.

rennie, in Patricia Evans' book www.amazon.co.uk/Verbally-Abusive-Relationship-Expanded-Edition/dp/1440504636 she categorises EA - amongst others...
blaming,
accusing,
withholding
judging,
criticising
undermining
ordering
name-calling
etc.

She devotes one chapter to the possibility that, in some cases, a partner can be made to recognise how they are abusive and then want to change. She describes each type of abusive comment and gives examples of how to respond. Basically you do not engage...you simply ask them to "stop....criticising/accusing/judging/undermining etc."

So with the cooking episode, you could simply respond calmly with "stop criticising me". And then walk away. If he then said something like (typically EA) "it's your fault..I criticise because you always do it wrong" you would then say "stop accusing me". You get the picture!?

And so on, basically you only engage with his comments to ask him to stop.

It's hard work and I'm not convinced it works, although it might at least make you feel less vulnerable and more in control.

It's a long journey you're starting now.