New baby, DH being a prick

[Bigwoop]

Hi there, I'm just wondering if the wise mumsnetters can give me some perspective..

I have a 3 week old baby. She is our first. The birth was tough going and ended with an emergency c.

I had a bad time in hospital what with the tears and baby not feeding/sleeping. My mum, who flew down to London from scotland, stayed with us for a week. I found the emotional support very valuable.

But my (D)H has been awful about her. When she was here he would come into the bedroom, Losing his rag and shouting 'when is your fucking mother going home?'

My mum can be a bit of a fusspot and in his opinion she was lifting the baby without asking him, and he felt she was critical of his parenting. I asked him to put up with it as I needed her. I had post op and baby blues and was/is very vulnerable.

He's all consumed by our child. He would love to grow some tits and feed her too. I think he is resentful that she wants me more than him at the moment.

He doesn't like anyone else holding her.

One night when she was crying and wouldn't settle, he had such a go at me. He told me how much my 'fucking mother' got on his nerves and how she wouldn't be back. He stomped around and made me sob while I tried to latch an angry baby at 3am.

I have made it clear that he cannot interfere with mine or DD's relationship with her grandmother.

But I'm so upset that for that one fucking week, when I was postnatal and sobbing for most of the time, he couldn't put his needs last.

I appreciate that it's a massive upheaval for him too.

I feel so utterly sad and depressed. I love my baby but I feel I never really knew DH and now I'm trapped. I still love him and he can be incredibly loving and affectionate but feel he let me down when I was most in need.

I love my DM. She is all the family I have and I just can't get past how horrible he was and a significant part of my love for him has gone.

What should I do?

That sounds bossy and controlling to me, and also points to what I mentioned above - that you and your mother are creating a sort of inner circle with him on the outside. If your home is really like this no wonder he is reacting badly.

I'm afraid that if my DH had behaved like that I don't think I would ever have been able to get over it.

Imagine behaving around anyone like that, for any reason! But to have behaved in this way just after you've had a baby and major surgery is appalling.

I think if he shows no remorse, and continues to stomp around laying down the law and picking fights about your fucking mother I'd be headed home to her as soon as I was fit and able. You really can't put up with that. How on earth will you ever be able to have your mother, or anyone else, stay again?

I'm not surprised you feel that your love for your him has been affected. His controlling, bullying and abusive behaviour at a time when you and your baby are so vulnerable is just unforgivable.

QuintessentialShadows He has behaved really badly, aggressive and abusive and controlling. He does not even have post partum hormones as an excuse. Did you have any idea he was capable of such nastiness?

Wow overreaction!

JeffTracy Bit surprised MIL is required for "emotional support" OP. Is that not your DH's role? Inviting her down for a week during/around the birth would drive most new fathers to distraction. Seems like a mistake especially as your DH wants to be a hands-on father

I agree.

samhaircin
"He's all consumed by our child. He would love to grow some tits and feed her too. I think he is resentful that she wants me more than him at the moment."
I think that is a mean and spiteful comment. Of course maybe he is behaving badly but I think he might just be reacting to the vibe you (and maybe your mother) are giving out that he is less important than everyone else, and only has a minor "bit-part" role to play in rearing your daughter.

I thought that too. The way he has reacted has been pretty awful but you have to wonder at the provocation. Seeing as that comment sounds so nasty there may well be plenty of it.

I have made it clear that he cannot interfere with mine or DD's relationship with her grandmother.
That sounds bossy and controlling to me, and also points to what I mentioned above - that you and your mother are creating a sort of inner circle with him on the outside. If your home is really like this no wonder he is reacting badly.

And that.

Oh op :( I am so sorry he is being so ignorant of what is really needed -

As an example or more normal behavour my exh may have been many things but he embraced my family helping when we had our 2 - my sisters stayed with us ~one each time ~ because then he could take a step back and enjoy his newborns, do the things he really needed too and fitted in a few hours work etc with the knowledge everything was Okay. Throwing strops because your mum was there isnt helpful! I would hazard a guess he has other issues and is taking it out on her.

If he wants to feed her so much express and get him to cup feed, this is better than bottle as it doesnt interfere with the learning to breast feed. It IS hard work though and I suspect he would either soon tire of it. We did this with my DD its incredibly liberating the 2nd time around but then I went back to work after a few weeks so we had no choice.

Overreaction?
Saying that a man who stomps about picking fights saying "Your Fucking Mother" at 3 am during a breast feeding attempt is nasty and abusive is an ^overreaction"?

Some of you seem to be desensitized to really bad behaviour. That is sad.

QS

Yes it is. Everyone has a freak out sometimes. Have you never lost your temper? And not that surprisingly it often happens during stressful situations like the op describes.

The husband may well be an abusive arsehole or he may be an ordinarily calm bloke who had a bad day or few days.

Some posters on mn are way too used to reading about abusive controlling men, so when a man behaves in any way which is less then perfect he gets lumped with the same labels.

And that is just as you know. That a man has to be perfect at every moment otherwise he's given a horrific label. Perhaps you have read so much of this stuff that you know longer recognise a situation which could just be normal.

Anyone who described my lovely mom as "your fucking mother" would be getting short shrift from me in any circumstances :(

You also have to wonder why he lost his temper about the mum at 3 in the morning. Why then exactly? Was she in the habit of coming into the bedroom when the baby woke in the night to help? I suspect its something like that.

If so that's really intrusive for the man in his own home. Otherwise i can't imagine why he would have suddenly got angry then.

"in his own home"? What about "In the OP's home" - it's her home too.

I'll say it again, nobody calls my mom "your fucking mother" under any circumstances and doesn't get called on it. It would make me seethe

Congratulations on your LO OP

Stress and sleep deprivation do terrible things to people. Please try to take a calm moment to talk about how this all made you feel and ask for an apology. Also try to take a minute to empathise with your DH. If this was out of character then what caused it? I'm not excusing his behaviour but trying to understand it will help you both heal and get beyond this. You have a DH who is desperate to bond and care for his dd - this is a good thing!

My DH and I have said some terrible things to each other in the dead of night out of sheer desperation - having a newborn is one of the hardest challenges there is. We are both good people who love each other and we got through it. Wishing you lots of strength and hoping you and your DH work this out.

What your mother should be doing, if anything at all, is cooking, cleaning and ironing. Not coming between the baby and its mother and father.

From the OP its all about you (the mother) and your mother. Your husband does not get a look in.

Personally, when me and DW had our first baby we made sure no one visited for a week at least. We just did not want anyone there.

I suspect the 3 am episode was a final straw and much regretted afterwards by your husband - sometimes anger clears the air because things are said that would otherwise be simmering. Take note - don't let your mother dominate proceedings from here on in.

PooPoo - exactly - why would someone lose their temper randomly at 3am?

Either the OP's mum is being genuinely annoying/intrusive, or the OP's husband is being a prick. Judging by the title and the complete lack of any behaviour described from the mum which could be annoying, I'm going with the second one.

Curryspice - MN is full of people ranting about their "fucking MIL"! Clearly a lot of them also say similar to their partners, or have arguments. No one seems to worry too much about that so why are you treating this as any different? Even her daughter says she can fuss a bit, and that is looking at her through the rose tinted filter of love!

Also... When my DM stayed after the birth of our 3 DSs she took instructions from both DH and I on how she could support us both. She still annoyed my DH! It's hard to help without getting in the way with the best of intentions. If your dm is a 'fusspot' then that could be enough to push the best of us over the edge in a stressful situation.

Until OP comes back and clarifies some stuff it's mostly speculation now.

morebeta - i'm guessing you didn't need any help breastfeeding then.

there are some things a mother can do much better - if you have a good relationship with them, and if that help is wanted - than a spouse.

post-natal support with a first baby is one of them. and really the OP absolutely is in the position where what help she chooses is her decision, and he should support her in it.
He hasn't had major surgery, and he should control himself accordingly.

my DH was a prick in a similar fashion after DD1 and has deeply regretted it since. he recognised he had no right to make things harder for me then, and shouldn't have been such a selfish twat. I hope the OPs husband comes to recognise the same thing.

I wouldn't have been able to breastfeed in the middle of an argument. No way. You just can't relax enough, particularly when the baby is so little.

My mum and my DH are very fond of each other.

When DD1 was born and she came to help when DH went back to work she drove him absolutely bananas.

I really did need her there (I too had an EMCS) but there was a bit of having to keep him onside. And TBH, in those fraught early days, he wasn't always very nice about her.

But there were two important differences

1. we had the first week or two at home by ourselves before she came and by that stage DH was back at work
2. she was very much in a support role, and didn't pick up the baby if DH was there to do it

Having her there straight after you came home may not have been the best idea, particularly if she was being very hands on with the baby instead of hanging back and letting the new parents figure it out.

What your husband said was awful, but I wouldn't like to be judged by the things I said and did in the first week of being a mother. It was the most fraught and stressful time of my life.

Your baby is 3 weeks old - this is not the time for big decisions. Just try to get through the next few weeks as well as you can. And give your husband a chance to make things right.

We had a very difficult time after the birth of our second, sleep deprivation of the previous year (first child) drove us all bonkers, and many harsh things were said, both in the middle of the night and the middle of the day. The trauma of an emergency C section is also great, for everyone.

I don't think this is the time to be coming to conclusions about the future of your relationship with a three week old baby. There's some very odd dynamics going on here, with the mum and mother as the unit, and the father being described as wanting to breastfeed himself, this creates a picture of everybody being overtired and overcritical and the father being excluded. I don't think I've ever heard of it being expressed in this way before, usually the issue is with lack of father involvement, something people are quick to condemn (whereas I also think people can warm up to fatherhood, I certainly had to warm up to motherhood, that's for sure).

I would be angry at someone shouting in the middle of the night, but I have also shouted myself at such times, and I have also shouted 'tell your Fing mother to F off', these things are not that unusual although I don't make a habit of it (once in ten years!)

It's all about context: the fact you say he's not normally unsupportive and you hardly know him now, makes me think that actually, this is exhaustion, trauma and a bad dynamic all kicking in. It may well sort itself out in the coming months.

He was always aware that I wanted my mum for a week after the birth. It's not asking a lot!

Yes she can be a fusser and often went to pick up DD before him but I asked him early on just to keep a lid on things for a week as I was not coping at all. I had baby blues, operation pain was overwhelmed and at the same time had to try and smooth things over at home.

The 3am temper was following a bad night with DD when she wouldn't settle. He was really aggressive and I felt frightened.

I done my best to think of his needs but I did need the emotional support of my mum as well as him. I get different things from both of them.

When I say DM is only family, I mean I have no siblings and father is dead. Of course DD and DH are family but I meant wider.

Dh has lots of family close by and they all came around days after the birth when I REALLY wasn't up to it and was tearful. But you know something, I bit my tongue and smiled.

I love my DH do much and he is not normally like that. He has been fine since but I can't get that week out of my head.

It must have been (and still be) tough. I needed my mum too and DH just had to suck it up. but it didn't stop the friction even though they usually get on fine and my mum really did leave him to get on with the baby care.

You mentioned your ILs visiting and you putting a smile on your face - that's not easy to do for a whole week.

Have you tried having an honest and calm discussion about it? It sounds like you really have a lot to get off your chest.

bluegrass he didn't post on mn about "your fucking" mother. Or say it to his mates in the pub. He shouted it at the op more than once. And that's why it's different.

Besides, I said that I wouldn't tolerate it from anyone, if it were said anywhere so I'm not treating it differently. I would say the same to anyone here. It's not on

I don't condone his shouting at 3am or the lack of compassion and emotional support shown towards the OP by her partner.

When I had an emergency c-section it changed DH to this day. He was not allowed in the theatre as I had to have a GA and even though our baby was brought out to him he had a real fear that I was not going to make it. He felt powerless and that he had no control over his own life. He was stood crying in a corridor holding our newborn and nobody asked if he was ok whilst I was still in theatre. It still makes me well up thinking of it now.

He only told me this recently (our daughter is nearly 5 now) but he said he felt unimportant, had no say in anything and felt invisible. He internalised this and it affected our relationship until it came out in counselling a year or so ago. I was shocked at how deeply he was affected by feeling as if he was only required to get me pregnant and the rest of him and his input didn't matter. But he said he was so concerned for my welfare that he didn't want to burden me with things that would just add stress to my recovery, which took over two years. To this day DH has never raised his voice to me in any kind of way.

The point I am trying to make is that yes your partner may feel pushed out, undermined or under valued and is not very good at expressing his feelings but it is NEVER okay to verbally abuse you especially when you are vulnerable holding a baby.

I got a sense that maybe you are working up to thinking of leaving the relationship because you say you feel trapped and never knew him properly?.only you know how you feel deep down?.is that something you have been thinking?

People I know in my life who have children all regard their partners as their primary family/next of kin and they together with their children are the family unit. Everyone else including parents are extended family?.for some reason you don't hold your partner in the place where others normally would. Tie that in with your statement about feeling trapped and not really knowing him and I would suggest that you both have a lot of work to do to enrich your relationship so that you can both be happy as a couple and as a family with your baby.

Sometimes people let you down. My husband let me down after the birth of my second child and it took me about three years to forgive him. He felt his actions were entirely justifiable in the situation, I didn't (it was similar type of bad behaviour). Sometimes your partner just isnt' who you hope they will be at a certain time point. Even worse, it can be you stuffing up on an occasion, not stepping up to the mark, or being nasty, or unable to give what the other person wants, and this can be difficult for a relationship to take.

But, in my case I am extremely glad I did move past those difficult few weeks and am still in the relationship (of over ten years). I think those who have never had these crisis points, or the moment where someone shouts something unforgiveable, are very lucky. If it was a regular thing, I would be advising you to reconsider the relationship. But, you have said this is not characteristic of him and made you doubt that you knew him at all- this says to me that this is not typical behaviour and is more a product of extreme stress.

I also think you must realise that your mum must let him parent. it's NOT ok for her to be picking up the baby first. I get you needed her, I get you wanted her support, but her role should have been cleaning/cooking/doing practical things which enabled you two as the parents to take charge of looking after your child. YOu didn't do that, you let your mum take the father's role and your husband lashed out in a nasty way. I'm not actually surprised he felt displaced and very angry towards your mum, I really think this dynamic was wrong. It doesn't make it right, but it does make it understandable.

Perhaps part of moving forward would be for him to admit he was absolutely in the wrong to have got angry about your mum and said unforgivable things; and you could say sorry for not making your mum's role clearer and allowing her to take over from him.

People shout, people get upset, people feel let down, they can still go on (f they are kind nice people at heart) to have happy families and relationships. Good luck.