dh is being a twunt about this and i dont know how to change it....

[crikeybill]

Basically I work full time and dh stays home. He has m.e so works freelance from home fixing computers and installing software. He hates getting up in the morning and I mean hates it. He is always really grumpy, takes ages to get going, has to exercise his legs, take tablets etc. Once he has been up a while, its all fine. He acknowledges what he is like if I talk to him about it in the evening, but it doesn't change. He just tells me to ignore his snapping , sarcastic remarks etc but it makes for such a shit start to the day.
My problem now is we have an 8 month old. We also have two older dc aged 9 and 10.
The 8 month old was an unplanned delight and he is great with him, we all enjoy him so much. Life has been great while I was on maternity leave and dh could rest but now he is looking after dc 3 days a week and oh the early morning issue has raised its head.
I have just left for work leaving dc3 in his bouncy chair next to dh. Dh lay on the sofa with his dressing gown over his head and refused to even open his eyes !! He snapped at me when I told him what dc3 needed today and just lay there groaning and moaning saying yes yes just go. I feel like shit, I'm so tired, my legs hurt blah blah.
I hate hate hate walking out and leavivg him like this. I know he will get up and care for him just fine but why does the day have to start so nasty ! Dc1 and 2 know what hes like and tend to stay out of his way till he's woke up a bit.
Hes not a bad person or dad, he's planning on making cakes for me with the older two today, he's just such a wanker in the morning.
He knows it upsets me , I left in tears today but he still does it. I know he's ill ffs but that doesn't mean his feelings always come first does it ?

I have lots of sympathy for both of you. Im guessing he is reacting to pain? or just feeling sorry for himself?

I would change your routine? Tell him to take his tablets and drinks to bed the night before and take them when he first wakes up and not to come downstairs until he can be polite. Its not fair on anyone. Does he know how bad he is? Is he depressed because of his illness.

I think I would be tellinghim - sort it out, wake up earlier if you need to, go to Doctors and get your medication changed - do something or Im off.

The fact that he knows it upsets you, yet he still persists with his rude aggressive behaviour, tells you that he thinks he is entitled to behave like he does.
Well, he isn't.
No-one is.

You really need to put your foot down over being spoken to like crap in the mornings.
He may well feel like crap when he gets up (I have had two friends with ME, I understand a little of how it works), but it is not of your doing, nor that of the dc, so he needs to bite his tongue and control his temper just as he would have to, if it were anyone else. Why on earth does he think his family are there to absorb his negativity and frustration?

Time for your dh to grow up I think.

I'd just avoid talking to him in the morning If you need to tell him important stuff then could you write it down, like a handover sheet? Then you can just leave it with and give him a kiss as you go out of the door without saying anything.

Could you afford childcare in the mornings even just for the baby?

I don't think it's fantastic that he's like this, obviously. But he is ill and presumably in pain. I am not ill and can still be a bit like this in the mornings.

If I were you, I would avoid speaking to him in the morning. Leave a note with anything important. Then I would ring when I knew he would be in better form. You have to find strategies that work for both of you when he is dealing with a long term illness like this.

Yes he does need to grow up. He does seem to think that no one has ever been more ill then him and he suffers such a lot etc. I pretty much do everything at home.
He is very insecure. I know a lot of it has to do with me going out to work and him at home. He is so paranoid its sad and makes me very uncomfy.
I just phoned to check everyone is ok. He is up but was very short with me. It became apparent why that was at the end of the phone call. He said bye in a sarcastic way and then kissed the phone very loudly before hanging up. That means I forgot to kiss him goodbye, which I did, so its just another reason for him to have the arse. I'm fuming at his nastiness.

Oh you poor things. Sounds tricky! It sounds like he's genuinely struggling with the mornings, but it's not fair to take it out on you. I don't know much about m.e., but I do have an occasionally grumpy partner & I've found that telling him what DS needs tends to make him grumpier. I think he feels that as he's DS's father, he doesn't need my instruction, whereas I'm a worrier who needs to make sure everything's been said or I panic. I now make sure that I sort out DS's lunch, bottles & communication book for nursery the night before so that it's all ready in a bag by the door regardless of who's taking him the next morning. Could you adopt a similar approach even though DS is at home? Leave a note out saying what needs doing? Or agree that you'll just trust him with DS while you're not there?

I have ME.
I dont think you understand how utterly terrible he feels in a morning .
It goes way beyond exhaustion and feels like having severe flu .
It is difficult to care for YOURSELF never mind children.
I'm sorry you are irritated by it, but really when you feel like he does and your left with children to care for- you would absolutely despair too.

As for telling you to 'just ignore it' - tell him not to be so childish. You can't ignore someone behaving badly on a regular basis. If you do, it's giving him the green light to carry on regardless...which no doubt would suit him, but won't work out well for the rest of you.

He needs to take responsibility for his behaviour.

Well here we have a guy with a seriously debilitating disease helping to take care of 3 children and managing part time work. And what is the downside...he is snappy for an hour or so in the morning. And we have already had two posters (Pictish and Cant) saying give him an ultimatum to shape up or leave him. Some are just desperate to split couples up.

OP, can you not just ignore his snapiness for an hour or so and realise it is caused by him waking up and feeling yet again under a cloud of pain and fatigue? I realise that is horrible for you but if you can see that it is not "him" but his pain and illness speaking, then maybe it is tolerable. As an alternative, maybe you should just agree not to speak in the morning? Also, can he not cope without your instructions? You say you told him what DC3 needed; can he not work that out himself?

I am not without sympathy for him, of course....but as his wife I couldn't be sympathetic to the point of being his emotional punchbag. I wouldn't do that for anyone.

Who said anything about leaving him?
Don't put words into my mouth thank you.

This sounds like a petty squabble to me. "Fuming at his nastiness" is a huge overreaction to being sarcastically reminded you did not kiss him goodbye. He is being childish, yes, but not nasty. You both need to take a step back from this and try to put some rules in place to stop it getting worse.

OP, your husband needs to try to improve his morning behaviour but you need to try to avoid triggering it. Maybe giving him instructions first thing is not ideal. You both need to remember that, as a couple, you have some real problems and are basically doing a great job as a team coping with them. Think of all the upsides to how he has dealt with his ME and try to have a positive discussion with him; highlighting why you value him but also telling him how he upsets you.

Is he a tally well enough to be caring for your 8 month old? Will he be we'll enough when the child is a toddler?

I think the comment about how he may forget that other people get ill is quite unfair.
As ME is a chronic illness it is a disability.
He is entitled to apply for DLA.
How about looking for his strengths?
The fact that he is still doing work of any sort with this condition speaks volumes and shows that he is trying hard .
Have you asked for a social care assessment from the Adult Social Services team ? He may be entitled to Self Directed Support - a personal budget that you could both use to buy services within your home that could ease the pressure for both of you.
OP you really don't know what's around the corner for you either. Is this how you would like to be spoken about by your DH ?
It doesn't sound like he's using you an emotional punchbag - it sounds like he's despairing and having trouble coping .

He sounds like he wants a moan and some sympathy in the morning, and you want to get out quickly on your way to work. You have incompatible needs,that's all.

My husband doesn't have ME but we have never got on well in the mornings, we are all grumpy and tired. Also, if he's in charge, why are you standing over him delegating stuff to do and organizing his day with the baby. I would just get the stuff ready the night before, leave a note with any urgent information (not what to feed him at lunch, he can work that out himself). Then in the morning, get yourself and the other two up and out to your destinations without interacting with him at all.

If he starts saying anything, say 'I'm too busy now, sorry you feel like that' and walk away.

If you expect a fun, interactive, jolly conversation about the day first thing, you may be expecting more than most people manage. Everyone I know finds the morning a rush and not the best part of parenting, and that's without factoring in his illness.

It might be worth considering using a local, nearby childminder for a couple of hours in the morning till hubby comes round a bit. He could then go and collect?

I don't think he's entitled to be rude and unpleasant to you in the mornings - no way. However, perhaps he does need less pressure first thing so he can iron himself out and gather some momentum for the day ahead.

I'm sure there's a compromise to be reached somewhere, and it's something you guys should discuss...along with his attitude towards his family in the mornings.

I have M.E. (CFS), other health issues, inc. long-term deep anal fissures which bleed most of the day and am in constant severe pain from those and nerve damage sustained during labour and I would not behave like this. I offer this not for sympathy, but to show I know what it must be like for the OP's DH. However, I might feel exactly like that and might often feel like acting and speaking horribly, but I don't. For a start, I have to look after my DS and he can't suffer because I do. People saying that him behaving so nastily could be viewed as the pay-off as him otherwise being a great guy the rest of the time are forgetting one thing: his children don't have the sophistication of mind to understand that Daddy is being so nasty because of suffering, they will just see him being horrible and blame themselves, because children always think things like that are their fault.

OP, you need to sit down with him and have a serious chat. Explain that you would give anything for his pain and fatigue to disappear, but it can't, so you both need to find a way to make mornings easier for him BECAUSE the moaning, groaning and nastiness have to stop. Right now. Explain how it really upsets and worries you to go to work with him with his dressing gown over his head whilst his baby son lies ignored besides him. Explain how it's unfair to and upsetting for the children for him to behave like that. And ask him what can be done to make things better. Don't let him leave his answers at 'nothing can help', because this condition does make things feel hopeless, but 'nothing' is not a solution. If he continues like that, get harsh; tell him if nothing can help then it's time to accept it and stop ruining the start of the day for everyone else. Feeling ill, even as severely ill as he is, isn't a free pass to behave badly. I have to occasionally battle the urge to whinge or act out, ie 'if I feel bad, everyone else should do too', but it stays at an urge, because I know it's immature and unfair. It is a horrible condition but making the rest of your family unhappy too doesn't make it better. Good luck finding a compromise that works for you all as a family, OP.

Good post Scorpette!

Thank you all for your responses.
nannyplum I am not irritated by his illness. I am irritated by his ability to be an absolute spiteful arse in the morning. He is ill all the time but manages to kurb his tongue and talk nicely the rest of the day ! he has never liked mornings and of course this illness has escalated that. I am absolutely aware how ill and terrible he feels. it isnt unusual for him to return to bed in the middle of the day at the weekend or on a day when I am working from home. Yesterday for example we had arranged to take the dc's bowling in the afternoon for an easter treat but this had to be cancelled as he felt ill and stayed in bed all day till 2pm. I looked after all 3 dc, the house and everything else alone, as I often do while he sleeps. I am NOT unsympathetic. I just dont feel that I deserve catty remarks or spiteful paranoid comments when I ask him to get up 3 days a week. Usually the older children are of course at school and the 8 month old is at present very easy. he naps twice a day for 2 hours each so this gives him a good break.
Sometimes he absolutely cant do it. he will vomit and have diareaough in the mornings, so these are the mornings that no he isnt fit and I have to make other arrangements phone in sick.

I have suggested getting childcare but Dh doesnt want us to do that. For financial reasons ( with only one wage we arent well off ) and also becuase DC3 is young and he doesnt feel comfy with it. This is doubly frustrating when he refuses to get up because I have suggested alternatives and had them thrown back !!

I dont stand over DH with instructions, the things I say are a quick " right he's had a bottle, he's had a bum change he just needs porridge and toast ". The times I havent said that he put DC3 down for a nap with no breakfast and wondered why he woke after 40 mins with the hump !

larrygrylls he was being nasty though. This is what he does. He hates me working. I have had the " its alrigght for you, you get to go out and talk to people " speech thrown at me many times. He is terribly insecure and me not kissing him will be thrown at me when I get home. It makes me so angry as he has no reason to be insecure. I have known him for 20 years. He used to be a workaholic and is now practically a hermit with chronic pain and a debilitating illness. I am still here supporting him despite our drastic life change yet he is still paranoid about me being out with no cause !!

scorpette I have tried so many times to have similar conversations with him and nothing sems to go in. In the evenings he seems to come alive and will nod and acknowledge and promise tommorow will be different, he will get up etc etc but nothing changes.

I have ME but I'm not a twat to my DH
imho he is ill and in pain, yes, but he is also using it as an excuse to justify his frankly horrid behaviour. I don't have any advice, really, but I really do sympathise with you OP

He just phoned. He has taken this long to feel ok-ish, which is usual. he can now speak to me in a civil way.
I have been informed that the older two are watching a film and dc3 is still napping. Ironically I am asked why I am snappy !! I try to explain and am told " you should know what im like in the morning. I had a really bad night last night and just want to collapse when you get home ".

I know I should be more sympathetic but im so tired of dreading mornings and spending till lunch time on tenterhooks. Im now getting irritated by the whole situation. Its as if the diagnosis has given him what he thinks is the right to be awful as clearly no-one has ever felt as bad as he does right now

My DH is a wanker in the mornings (no illness, just utterly shit in the mornings) and we tried him staying at home with DS for a while. In the end he got a new job and DS went into nursery, better all round. Where I am, 3 mornings of nursery would cost about £55 per week. You may get tax credits to help with that.

I don't think we would be entitled as both parents have to work more then 16 hours a week i think. I work 37 but DH is self employed and hasnt worked at all for weeks. I certainly couldnt say he works more then 16 hours a week

I have tried so many times to have similar conversations with him and nothing sems to go in. In the evenings he seems to come alive and will nod and acknowledge and promise tommorow will be different, he will get up etc etc but nothing changes.

How many more times are you willing to try these conversations, then?