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Mumsnet has not checked the qualifications of anyone posting here. If you need help urgently or expert advice, please see our domestic violence webguide and/or relationships webguide. Many Mumsnetters experiencing domestic abuse have found this thread helpful: Listen up, everybody

Original poster

Sensitive question about H

709 replies

ThreeLittlePandas · 14/03/2012 11:52

I've been putting off asking this because I'm scared of what your answers might be. I'm really evaluating my relationship with h atm and wondering wether to leave him and I think the answer to my question might heavily influence my decision.

Blush in advance.

Dh and I rarely have sex. When we do it is rather boring but he is considerate.

The other evening I went to bed early as I was desperately tired. I was woken a few hours later my dh who had his fingers in me. I was heavily asleep and by the time I realised what was happening he was having sex with me. He finished quickly and that was it. I really hadn't wanted to have sex and feel like I wasn't given an option. The next day I felt a bit angry and almost violated to be honest.

I'm not looking for anything other than an opportunity to talk this through because it's been bothering me. This is about the third time in the last couple of years that something like this has happened.

OP posts:
CailinDana · 15/03/2012 11:39

Curious, if you're ok with your DH doing that to you, that's fine. Rape is rape, there is no ambiguity about it. The OP is not fine with being raped.

Anniegetyourgun · 15/03/2012 11:40

You know, there are worse things than accusing someone of rape. Being raped, for example. We are talking here about a man who deliberately avoids sex when his wife is awake and willing, but takes it when she is heavily asleep and un willing. It's possible to argue that in a way that is worse than a stranger who doesn't know her as a person or owe her any special consideration. He may not have caused damage (so far?) but that only means he has not compounded the offence with the additional offence of violence. Well bully for him. I have yet to hear of a pickpocket who was acquitted on the grounds that he hadn't robbed a bank.

CailinDana · 15/03/2012 11:42

I feel quite ill that this happens to a lot of women. But again if they're ok with it, then there's no problem. If my DH did this to me, I would divorce him, same way as I split up with the ex that did it to me. I want to sleep in my bed without someone using my body.

camaleon · 15/03/2012 11:42

curious,
So you and your friends have partners who have sex with you while you are sleeping and you are happy with it. We have read about your intimacy with your husband. We know you have a 'great' sexual life. Can you see this is not relevant here?
I do not think you are reading what the OP is saying at all.

fabwoman · 15/03/2012 11:42

Curious - seriously, please go away. It isn't getting through to you that the OP DOES NOT LIKE WHAT HER HUSBAND IS DOING TO HER AND DOES NOT WANT HIM TO DO IT. If you like what your husband does, fine. No one gives a fuck but if you are posting like this because actually you have had a realisation that your husband has assaulted you then get help, stop disrespecting the OP by implyig she is wrong to feel the way she does.

curiousgeorgie · 15/03/2012 11:42

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LizaTarbucksAuntie · 15/03/2012 11:44

and there you have it, reading some parts aloud.

perhaps direct your friends to the thread to read the whole thing for themselves.

I hope you never need them though because to be fair I'd hate to be on the receiving end of that kind of support and sympathy.

I love my husband, very, very much, but honestly, if he stuck his fingers in any part of me while I was asleep having been told I didn't like it he would be sleeping on the sofa until he found somewhere else to live.

curiousgeorgie · 15/03/2012 11:44

fabwoman - I was waiting for the 'your husband has assulted you' rubbish.

No he has not, I just think this guy deserves the benefit of the doubt. We do not know exactly how the other conversations went.

But there is no point. You lot are ready to lock him up and throw away the key.

crunchbag · 15/03/2012 11:45

Well everyone to their own curious. Luckily I have a dh who respects me and would not go against my wishes and visa versa.
Maybe next time explain to your dh how you really feel and then see if stops or not.
However a decent person would stop at the word NO with no further explanation needed.

CailinDana · 15/03/2012 11:46

Yes it is worse than a stranger. If a stranger did this to me, I would have the support of a loving husband and I would be able to rationalise it by thinking that it was just some random evil bastard. If my husband did it I would have to come to terms with the fact that the man I love is a rapist and that I am heading for divorce. That is much much worse in my book.

ShirleyKnot · 15/03/2012 11:47

Earlier in the thread I urged posters to report some posts which are unsupportive and include rape myths.

I'm just going to repeat myself.

Please report.

camaleon · 15/03/2012 11:47

Please curious,
If you are in so much need of attention open your own thread about your alternative sex practices. If you are just 'waiting' for us to tell you what is hapening with you and your husband I think your own thread makes more sense

LucyManga · 15/03/2012 11:48

I am 'ready' to believe and support a poster who feels she has been violated, curious. The locking up and throwing away of keys is nothing to do with me and I have no power to enforce that.

Why are you here, again?

Ephiny · 15/03/2012 11:48

I'm shocked to hear that this happens so much too, and that some women consider it normal and acceptable! It would absolutely be a deal-breaker for me, the relationship would be over, same as if he hit me.

But yes if you're truly genuinely happy with it (and you could make it stop if you wanted to), then fine, I guess it's not a problem for you.

OP however is not happy with it, she's clearly very upset by it when it happens - which doesn't stop her husband doing it again and again, taking advantage of the side-effects of her medication to do so. So no, I don't feel inclined to give him the benefit of the doubt.

Charbon · 15/03/2012 11:49

Posters are not considering he didn't know it was rape because:

a) All men know that consent must be given before they penetrate a woman with any part of their bodies or something else. It is utterly ludicrous to pretend that some men don't know this and would be shocked if they knew. Rape and sexual assault in marriage has been on the statute books since 1991, but that is often a red-herring on these threads. No decent man needed a change in the law to understand that he was not entitled to have sex on his wife without her permission, just as no decent man had to wait until the 2003 Sexual Offences legislation to realise that the emphasis was on the word 'yes' before proceeding further in any sexual interaction. Men do not live in a moral vacuum, immune to the socialisation that the vast majority of other men experience. If a man's actions are aberrant to the law and the sexual behaviour of the majority of men, it is a deliberate action conducted in the full knowledge that it is wrong.

b) This man knew it was wrong because his wife has told him before that she hates it and wants him to stop doing it. He doesn't like sex any other way with her now and her only sexual experiences are now forced and against her will.

I think it must be frightening and bewildering if you are a woman in a relationship with a man who does that, to see these explanations. It chips away at your defences and forces you to confront the bargains you've been making about your own partners' behaviour. The kindest thing to do if you are troubled by this is to keep away from another woman's thread and seek help to process your own relationship dynamics in a space that's safe for you. It is very unkind to try to persuade a woman who has been raped to make the bargains that help you get through the day and stay with a rapist.

fabwoman · 15/03/2012 11:49

CG - really? Really?

Of course it is worse than a stranger!! You having had a stranger declare love and protection to you, etc etc etc.

CG - I am actually torn between wishing you would fick off and worrying about you.

LizaTarbucksAuntie · 15/03/2012 11:49

am going to report and ask that this be moved, I would really hate to think anyone can stumble on this easily and let it become more of a bunfight

Pandas I'm glad you said you're listening to the stuff YOU are finding helpful, because it is about what YOU need, and what works for YOU.

CailinDana · 15/03/2012 11:49

Curious, every woman has the right to dictate absolutely what happens to her body. No one, absolutely no one has the right to do what they like with it. If you've decided that it's ok for your DH to do things to your body while you're not conscious, that's fine, you've made that decision, and you're happy with it. The OP has made the decision that she doesn't want her DH to do anything to her body while she's not conscious, she wants to be conscious and participating during sex. I don't think that's too much to ask.

By the way I don't understand your "throw away the key" comment. No one suggested she report him.

curiousgeorgie · 15/03/2012 11:50

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antlerqueen · 15/03/2012 11:50

Curious, what you are doing right now on this thread is the equivalent of somebody telling a woman who's just found out her husband is cheating on her and you telling her it's not that bad because you are in an open relationship and your husband is allowed to sleep with other people. IRRELEVANT.

curiousgeorgie · 15/03/2012 11:51

Cailin - And why not? If you are all so sure he is a rapist then why not report him?

antlerqueen · 15/03/2012 11:51

Why do you think he was being so aggressive though?

Ephiny · 15/03/2012 11:51

Whether it's worse or not than if it was a stranger - depends what you mean by worse, I suppose, you could look at it either way, and I hope few of us have been in the awful situation of having experienced both types of assault to be able to compare :(

Even if it is not as bad as if it was a stranger, that doesn't mean it's OK. Hitting your partner is maybe not as bad as stabbing them, that doesn't mean it isn't wrong, and illegal, and reasonable grounds for ending a relationship.

curiousgeorgie · 15/03/2012 11:52

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ShirleyKnot · 15/03/2012 11:52

I think curiousgeorge that you are not helping and I have to wonder what is pushing you towards being so very unhelpful towards another person.

The OP has made it clear how she feels, why on earth you feel entitled to belittle that or "put another point of view" across is beyond me - You are NOT actualy ENTITLED to do that - not here where it is clearly unwelcome.