DH can't and won't cook and won't do housework. AIBU?

[cantcookandwont]

Sorry this may be long.....

DH and me been married 25 years and DCs just left home. For all of our marriage my career has taken 2nd place because no matter how far I got with it, I'd never have earned what DH did- so I always worked p/t and did 90% housework & 100% cooking. I did find this hard because up to when I married at 30, I'd been a professional independent woman.

Now though I have launched a new freelance career which is notoriously competitive. It's still part time and I work from home. I DO have work that pays (I am earning around £1200 a month for us) but in addition I am generating contacts and trying to get work, so I can do as much or as little of that as I want. On an average week I probably work 3 full days spread over 5 days, but sometimes it's more than that. DH works longer hours- 8-7pm, travels both UK and overseas.

I still expect to do most of the domestic stuff BUT now that we are on our own I anticipated him doing more. He does nothing. He does no housework and no cooking or planning of meals. I feel as if I am his servant. I am not fanatical about housework- I maybe do 1-2 hrs a day which is a quick hoover downstairs, doing the dishwasher, loading the washer and pegging out, mopping the kitchen floor 2-3 times weekly, and the bathrooms 1-2 times a week -plus cooking a meal from scratch. I have now stopped ironing his shirts.

My biggest bugbear is how I have to plan, shop and cook everything. I have asked him until I am blue in the face to cook one meal at a weekend ( it could even be a semi-ready meal) but he never does- it's always "Next week I'll do it". He doesn't offer to take me out for a meal- I have dresses that are unworn because we rarely go out and if we do I have to suggest it.

Apart from wheeling out the bin, and any necessary DIY, he does nothing. A couple of weeks ago I suggested we had a list of household chores - 75% mine and the rest his. He just laughed and said it was ridiculous.

I don't know if I am being unreasonable. I don't see cleaning up muck as "my role" any more- we both make it and should both clear it up. But given his hours of work I wonder if IABU? And I can't afford, or want, a cleaner.

Any ideas?

[nje3006]

My DP is oblivious to stuff that needs doing in the house. To say we have different standards would be a gross understatement. I am s/e, I work from home, he has a well paid job which sometimes involves long hours. I HATE h/w.

So I have a cleaner who also does the ironing. I work in a profession which means I have a lot of confidential info about. So the only room the cleaner doesn't touch is my office, it's a no go area. Which means my office never gets cleaned I have to clean it myself.

I accept that DP doesn't see what needs doing and what's more he couldn't care less. When I go away the place goes to rack and ruin. I now have an arrangement where the cleaner comes in immediately before I get back - it literally saves our relationship. It means that an area which would be highly contentious for us, is a stress free zone. It feels as though you're expecting DH to change his standards (doesn't see, doesn't care) to your standards of seeing and caring. I'm not sure that is reasonable.

As others have said, it's not about the cleaning. It's about you feeling that he is not emotionally invested in your marriage despite what he says. His actions do not translate into love for you. He may feel he has supported you financially for many years and done his bit with the kids - he may feel equally unappreciated.

Talk about this with him.

[worldgonecrazy]

If I were to leave I'd be poor, at least until I got half his pension. So I don't know if I want to put up with that.

I could be cruel and point out there's a word for women who are in relationships for financial purposes.

However, I accept that you are used to your lifestyle and the thought of leaving and starting afresh after 25 years is probably terrifying. But seriously, do you love this man or not? It sounds to me like you and he are only together because you're both too scared or too lazy to find someone who inspires you.

I really don't think that he will ever change, so you have three choices: put up with it; get a cleaner; leave. Only you know which of those choices you should make.

[Lueji]

It is your domain and it has been for ages.

Any change will have to be slow. Do keep reminding him.
If he does it without complaining, it's a good start.

Do book the meals away or tell him to book a specific one.
Tell him he should cook Saturday or take you out.

Ask him to set the table or put the dishes away.

[Hardgoing]

I think it's totally unrealistic to expect him to be planning what meal to cook on Sunday and be chatting about it, as well as utterly tedious. You need to say to him 'I'm not cooking on Sunday lunch from now on, I'll leave it to you to sort out' and then let him sort it out. If nothing happens, fix yourself a sandwich the first week, he'll either then spring into action or book a pub lunch the next weekend. If he still does nothing, you have to decide whether his inability or lack of interest in Sunday dinner is something you can tolerate (this would not be a big deal in our house, we might have a cooked breakfast in a cafe or eat out and it just wouldn't be an issue if one person didn't want to cook).

I think if he is supportive of your new career, happy to do household tasks when asked, and provides you with a wage/future pension you say you can't live without, it's not that bad a deal, tbh. However, it's not a good deal if you find him boring and wish you lived elsewhere, and only you know if that is true (and i'm guessing not otherwise you wouldn't have gone back to him).

[cantcookandwont]

If I were to leave I'd be poor, at least until I got half his pension. So I don't know if I want to put up with that.

I could be cruel and point out there's a word for women who are in relationships for financial purposes.

So what word is that world??

I think it is a cruel and also an unhelpful and unrealistic comment to make.

It is hardly "financial purposes" to acknowledge that being a p/t worker all my married life in order to bring up 2 DCs one of whom has SN, AND support DH totally in his career, that my earning power has diminished, is it?

Or that my DH earns 4-5 x what I do, so he would be fine thank you and I would take a huge drop in living standards.

At my age, and with the job market being how it is, this matters.

[cantcookandwont]

This is very difficult!

Half of you say I am expecting the impossible and am being unreasonable, other people say he ought to do more and that by not doing more, he doesn't care.

In my ideal world, this is what I'd like- at a weekend I'd like him to spring into action and ask what chores need doing, suggest we split them down the middle or even 60/40, and then we do something fun.

What happens is that I see what needs doing, he buggers off to the gym or cycling, and I am resentful.

The "deal" we had when the children were younger was that he brought in most of the money and I looked after the home and the kids. They have now gone and I want to re-negogiate our lives. He doesn't seem able to change and I am just fed up and feel like a housekeeper.

Thanks for all the advice- I think another chat is needed with him.

[olgaga]

But OP your contribution to the marriage, the fact that you earn a fraction of what he earns and have unequal mortgage capacity would all be taken into account in a divorce settlement.

But it is a lot of trouble to go to when you could deal with this just by concentrating on building your business, as he has concentrated on his career, and just forget about doing housework and making meals from scratch every day!

[fedupwithdeployment]

I can see how you would be annoyed, but it will take him time to change. Fwiw we are in our 40s and now earn roughly the same ...potentially I will overtake DH soon. We are having the odd disagreement about me coming home late as my responsibility at work increases...this hasn't been an issue for him even though he is the the Navy and spends A LOT of time away (9 months last year hence my name!)

I digress - to housework. DH is pretty good, but there are things he doesn't see. I don't think he would ever change the duvet cover if I didn't action it (once a fortnight for the record). Other than that we split things...I do some ironing, he does some shirts....I do most of the cooking (not all), he does some shopping and the bins and a lot of DIY. I think we have a good split. But we do have a cleaner (3 hours) and we couldn't live without that now.

I think you need to be direct...work to rule. Don't make his lunch, don't iron his clothes. You seem to be enabling his selfishness by not putting your foot down a bit more firmly, and all the time the resentment builds.

[yellowraincoat]

You are earning £1200, so if you left him, you wouldn't be poor, just to point that out to you. No you wouldn't have the lifestyle you have now, but let's face it, is your lifestyle THAT good? You don't go out and you spend your life cleaning.

1 - 2 hours a day is way too much cleaning for 2 adults. There are two adults in my house too, no kids. We don't have a dishwasher. I spend, max, 30 minutes a day cleaning. I know you said you don't want a cleaner, but you're both earning, ok you are helping your kids out, but £40 a week is not much to pay to stop feeling like a slave.

Alternatively, as others have suggested, stop doing his stuff for him. If he wants tea, he can get his own. If he wants a clean house, he can clean it.

I only work 3 hours a day where my partner works at least 8. So the bulk of the cleaning obviously falls to me. I do NOT, however, pick up his stuff, find stuff for him, or iron his shirts unless I am feeling really generous.

[worldgonecrazy]

cant the word would depend on whether you're having sex with someone you resent or not.

Yes it's cruel and blunt, but staying in a marriage purely because you don't want to take a drop in living standards is what it is. And going through your posts it seems that there is a lot of resentment going on. Your husband is not going to change, no matter what you do, so you have the choice to stay and keep your lifestyle, or leave and find out just how much better life can be when you are living it on your own terms. You obviously missed where I said how scary it is to start anew - I know because I've done it, not only with the drop in living standards, but also everything and everyone who was part of that marriage, my entire social life.

I don't think any of your marital problems are just about who does what housework. A lot of posters have also pointed that out.

If by some miracle, tomorrow your husband spent two hours cleaning the house with you rather than going into town, would you suddenly fall back in love with him? If he surprised you with a romantic meal out in a nice restaurant, or Sunday lunch at a gorgeous country pub, would you be sparkling on the return journey?

[BranchingOut]

I do feel for you, because you certainly don't sound very happy. I think there have been a couple of quite unfair posts on this thread. While he has been in this pattern for 25 years, change is still possible. I know of one man who suddenly began cooking from scratch in his late seventies!However, he will need to be motivativated to do it.

On the housework front, would it help to become a 'shoes off' household? You keep mentioning floors and I find it really does help if we keep all the outside dirt in the hallway.

I second the suggestions of menu planning and making one meal a week his responsibility.

How about if you both book onto a one-day cooking course? I am thinking of doing a course at Leith's in London -started a thread on this recently if you search. They teach you how to cook a particular menu, the choices are very appealing and approachable. You then get to take the meal home or eat it there. He will then know how to cook something and may be inspired to take it further.

[Enoughshitalready]

cantcookandwont you sound lovely.

Your husband sounds lazy and boring.

He sounds like he has been lazy and boring his whole life.

If you left him you might be less well off for a bit, or you might be fantastically successful career-wise, find a wonderful man who appreciates you and know how to show it.

Or you might find yourself just content to be free of someone who expects so much from you with so little in return.

Leave him and don't go back unless he actually changes. I suspect he won't, and in fairness if he's always been like that why should he?

Put your energies to building a great life for yourself.

[cestlavielife]

why dont you go off to do a hobby on a weekend too? then meet at a pub for lunch? or you could also cycle or run? why dont you go cycle rides together? then stop at pub for lunch ?

[cantcookandwont]

yellow- so you think that £1200 a month before tax etc is a liveable wage? It's about £15K a year . It is also not guaranteed income- it varies.

There is no way I'd spend £40 a week or whatever on a cleaner. The only thing I'd consider is someone to iron his shirts but I think he'd rather save the money for other things.

I do go out! I have friends and go out with them, and so on.

I said that I spent 2 hrs a day in total cleaning and cooking. I have just done some housework now, to time it all- in an hour I cleaned our bathroom- but no floor wash just a hoover over the flooring- hoovered our bedroom and landing, hoovered downstairs hall, kitchen, lounge, study and utility room.

There is a pile of ironing including 4 shirts of his , plus bedding. There are pans etc that would not fit in the dishwasher. There is a laundry basket full of more shirts and undies that need washing as he was away for 3 days, and wears 2 shirts a day when away ( office wear then entertaining in evening).

IF I was to deal with that- and I have done no dusting anywhere!- it could go on most of this afternoon.

[yellowraincoat]

I earn far far less and live in London. So yes, I think you can and would survive on it. Maybe it would give you the push you need to really get your business off the ground.

OK, so you have all that stuff to do. Don't clean his shirts. Don't iron the bedding (why the hell would you, seriously? What a waste of time, it'll be creased within an hour).

you go out with friends, but not with your husband who is meant to be your best friend.

[cantcookandwont]

World
If by some miracle, tomorrow your husband spent two hours cleaning the house with you rather than going into town, would you suddenly fall back in love with him? If he surprised you with a romantic meal out in a nice restaurant, or Sunday lunch at a gorgeous country pub, would you be sparkling on the return journey?

It would go a long way to wards making me feel appreciated.

And I don't buy this "He won't ever change". People have free will and can change behaviour if not quite their personalities.

I don't resent him. I resent his lack of domesticity and feeling unappreciated. There is a big difference.

[cantcookandwont]

Well yellow I am amazed that you can live on less than £15K in London. My kids rent and they pay £800 a month for a room then have fares to pay, food, and all the rest. I don't know how it is possible for you to live on that sum.

[Enoughshitalready]

Yes you can live on this, and the extra time and energy you have might mean you get even more.

After 20 years of cooking and cleaning for this man you should be entitled to half the marital assets so use those to supplement your income.

Please please please don't iron another shirt of his again!

[cantcookandwont]

Branching Thank you. We are and always have been a shoes off household! But we have no porch so the minute you walk in, even on the door mat, the grit etc from outside comes in on shoes. The point is, he doesn't see it and won't clean it up- and as I am in most of the day, I can't keep walking over it.

I have suggested he might go on a basic cookery course like the ones done by Waitrose which he could get to. The bottom line is he is not interested. I also have a bookcase full of easy cookery books!

[yellowraincoat]

You can get rooms, nice ones, in perfectly acceptable areas for half that price. I lived in Battersea, big double room, bay window, and it cost me £365 a month.

I think you have got unrealistic expectations of how much stuff costs. Yes, I struggle, but I also don't have to answer to anyone because my money is my own.

[worldgonecrazy]

Yes, people can change if they want to. I really don't think your husband wants to change or he would have kept up the good habits when you returned to him after your previous split. He hasn't, and that speaks volumes.

Your last post made me want to cry. When I asked if being treated nicely would make you sparkle, you responded by saying it would make you feel 'appreciated'.

It's my boss's job to make me feel 'appreciated'. It's my husband's job to make me feel like I'm the most amazing woman in his world.

[didldidi]

but that is him isn't it?

[ShotgunNotDoingThePans]

No way does he need 2 shirts a day! DH chez moi travels and entertains clients in the evenings, and has never done this.
If he did feel the need it would be perfectly reasonable to outsource the business!

[yellowraincoat]

Think about it: if you're on minimum wage and work 40 hours a week in London, you'd be on less than £1000 a month before tax. What do you think people in London who work as bar staff or cleaners DO? Of course it's possible to survive on less money than you have now.

OP, I'm not having a go, your situation sounds horrible and it sounds like you feel stuck. But you're not. You're definitely definitely not.