"But We Took You To Stately Homes!" - Survivors of Dysfunctional Families.

[singingprincess]

There is a word document with all the relevant links which I will try and find, but in the meantime...Post away.

Lemonylemon, I got the quote from oiwheresthecoffee and she, I think, got it from a book. Which one, coffee?

The last time she did this to me I was in the hospital, with two 3 day old babies, one of whom was wearing a horrible harness and mask for light therapy. She wanted to discuss why I resented her cleaning (disinfecting) my house while I was there and making my partner and friend feeling unwelcome. It ended with me asking her to be strong in this difficult time, because although it was hard for her it was surely harder for me and partner. She took it as me saying she is strong and can cope with anything (sigh). And on the advice of my partner, I wrote her an over the top 'dear dear mum, didn't mean to upset you, i love you, love mei' note that any sane person would have seen it for what it was, but actually delighted her a lot (and made her f** off the day after I came out of hospital :o). I felt quite fake doing that but also very surprised at the effect. A bit like setting boundaries that my therapist is teaching me. It feels like I'm acting, but I'm so charmed by the magical effect.

everythingpasses, you're mum sounds like how mine would be if we lived closer. And I agree with your partner that she is very controlling and manipulative. Being jealous of you, her daughter, because she misses the attention you get from being a mummy... Making you feel guilty because you don't 'present' your baby to her more than what works for you, while she can't even be bothered to drive down herself... Expecting you to hand over your baby as if you aren't even there... You have the right to be respected as your son's mother (and as yourself, of course), but for mums like ours it's difficult to even acknowledge that we exist as separate human beings with our own rights and feelings.

On forgiving family - I did time and time again and nothing changed. My mother is completely unable to comprehend that she could ever do anything wrong, and the family have been taken in by how lovely she seems and how awful I must therefore be. I have tried so many things that I am now certain that I must just cut them off completely but I think that decision was made easy by how awful my mother's behaviour was when I fled DV - she refused to believe me, refused to listen to me and sided with AP. That for me was the final straw. If she is willing to go to those extremes to justify what she has done (by which I mean that believing me would mean accepting that I dont have a mental illness which leads me to lie and that I therefore didn't lie any of the times that I tried to report her to the school for neglect and emotional abuse. She can't allow herself to accept that it was her fault and needs to believe that I am mentally unwell). Nothing I say will ever persuade her so what is the point? Its hard, SO hard just walking away. But im taking each day as it comes and focussing on my DD.

I think the time I realised exactly how twisted she really is was when I had got in touch with family on my Dad's side who I had never known. My mum left my Dad when I was 5months old and cut off his family. she always maintained that he died when I was 2.5years old although the other facts about him changed constantly growing up, she is incapable of telling the truth about things like this. She told me he died of heart disease. 4 members of his family confirmed that he had commited suicide. I knew I had to talk to her - she either had lied or had convinced herself it was heart disease. I rang her and very gently told her what I had been told. And then spent 45 mins dealing with "why are you attacking me, don't use that tone with me, how could you accuse me of lying, why are you crying, why do you care about him more than me, why didn't you ask me if you could talk to his family, why are you being sarcastic. You selfish ungrateful child, how could you chose these strangers over me, your own mother etc etc" ARGH! I got off the phone in a daze. EVERYTHING becomes about her and she always bandied that phrase about "me, your own mother". Its like she has to remind herself all the time that she is a mother, and has some kind of rights over me. and the "selfish ungrateful child" was her most used phrase as a child! Its incredible when you look at it from a distance how much we put up with and how no-one else can see it. I pity my brother. He is 7 and if my life is any kind of indication in 3 years he'll begin to see a different side to her.

Hi. I just wanted to check if my dad was/is toxic. I haven't spoken to him for 11 months as I have cut him out of my life because he used to upset and hurt me too much. I have 2 brother and 2 sisters (all younger) and they are all still in contact with him, they can?t understand my problem and don?t support my not speaking to him.

Last April, we fell out because something we?d given them to look after had been loaned to one of his DP?s children without our consent. It was just a quarrel, but because I spoke to his DP about it (and she really couldn?t have given a shit) he rang and verbally abused me. A flavour of what he said was ?how could you speak to [DP] like that, she?s the lovliest person you could ever meet, but you?re not, are you??

At the time I was working for him and I went into work as normal, but we had a row again as his DP was saying that I said things to her that I hadn?t, so I was standing up for myself. Then he sacked me and I had to get all my stuff and go home, without saying goodbye to any of my colleagues. We haven?t spoken since, nor has he seen DCs.

Some other things he has done over the years (brief highlights of just a few):

-When I tried to speak to my future step-mum about how difficult I was finding it (at 16) that she had moved in 6 months after my mum had left and they were getting married so quickly, she told my dad she couldn?t marry him anymore as I didn?t want her to. So my dad shouted at me that if he ever had to choose between her or me, he?d choose her.
-Whenever I try to stand up for myself, he belittles and mocks me. He has no respect for me nor shows me any loyalty. He always believes the worst in me and badmouths me to my brothers and sisters.
-He has a bad temper and verbally abuses me, saying cruel things to hurt me.
-He owes me and DH £54k from an investment we made in his company, but hasn?t repaid a penny. Instead he has bought new cars for 1 of my brothers and both my sisters and spends thousands of pounds on expensive holidays.
-Last summer he nearly died on a yachting holiday and according to the older brother & sister, he had an ?epiphany?. This evidently did not include trying to reconcile with his eldest daughter.
-He treats us all very differently which encourages competitiveness between the siblings. He likes to be in control of our lives, through money and giving attention. DH thinks this is why he is the way he is with me as I won?t be bought and refuse to shout the loudest for attention.

I?m not sure how this all looks now it?s in black & white. Maybe it doesn?t seem so bad after all. But DH fully supports me and thinks he is a horrible man. We have been together for 12 years so he has witnessed first hand how he has upset me.

I just wondered if the Toxic Parents book would help, or if I?m ok just carrying on as I am, enjoying not getting involved with any of the conflict. I am a bit hurt and more angry tbh. Thanks.

Alt {{hug}}

chicaguapa I'd also read Children of the Self-Absorbed by Nina Brown. It's helped me on my journey....

And speaking of journeys - I have at last been able to post on my own thread about something that happened to me a long, long time ago, but which was not believed by my family..... But now it's out there.

I'm too tired to post properly but just need to add my ex inlaws and children's grandparents to these toxic people. To quote the FIL 'if the only thing my son did was pin you against a wall and squeeze his hands round your throat I am proud of him'. I'm very scared for my children, but bed is calling. Hope everyone is doing ok

OK I am in need of a bit of back bone strengthening. I have had issues with my family since my teens, possibly earlier. In the last 5 years or so I have concluded that my F is a narcissist and that at different times different people in my family step into enabling roles. I am often the black sheep and as a teen maybe the golden child for my parents but therefore the black sheep with my sisters..tbh I dont really care v much about the details of this any more.
Anyway over christmas we went to visit for a month and had a family holiday (I shoudlnt have gone I was dreading it) at my Fs invitation. My H and I have had an awful year - our D is possibly SN - she has severe developmenatl delays and my H was disgnosed with MS. It has been hideous.

I dont want to go into lots of detail. Basically I have come to the conclusion that it is not worth the effort to try to get my family to be supportive of us as they are all so self involved that this is very difficult to achieve and instead of helping they tend to find ways of blaming me for their lack of support (or even just interest). I am sure I play a role in this drama but I am so overwhelmed with the difficulties in my life that I dont want to spend time on these people any more.

Now my dad has been emailing me lengthy essays on whats wrong with me and what I am doing wrong. rather than engage with these and refuting them point by point (whcih I could do) I have only written to say that I find it disingenuous and I really just want to focus on my issues with D and H and that I will get support from those relationships where its made avaiakble to me. he keeps exhorting me to work on my communication and the like so they can support me. But I dont want to. I dont want to spend my time going round in circles with him until I finally capitulate and do what he wants me to
Am I just being childish and petulant? Please just tell me its ok to stick to focusing on my H and D and not to engage with this...
I know its very leading but I cant cope with them any longer and need to feel its ok not to get into it anymore.
I would have liked to just cut off quietly without any drama as we dont have all that much contact anyway. Unfortunatelt it hasnt worked out that way so now they all arent speaking to me and it all feels very scary.

sorry to hijack this thread like this I just needed to say this and get it out. I feel very panicky

There's no need to apologise, firsttimer. This is what this thread is here for, and you are entitled to say what you feel any time, any place, really.

You don't have to read your dad's essays, you know. Bin them, hit delete, next time one graces your inbox.

You want to focus on your H and D: that's entirely your right. You don't need to defend yourself to anybody, even especially your family.

Cutting off toxic people doesn't happen without drama, since they HATE being cut off - seems too much like criticism, which they can't face, and can only react to with blame, denial, and rages. That doesn't mean you shouldn't do it, though. Shield yourself from the drama by 1. not communicating with them, and 2. interrupt any news-bringers (well-meaning or otherwise) with an "I do not want to hear about my parents, thank you."

It's OK. You're OK. You're doing great.

My mother is a lying bastard and i hate her for it, I hate the fact that I cannot just separate from her, I hate the fact that her boyfriends arsey cuntishness takes paramount over her sons security both emotional and physical over the years. I fucking hate my mother! I was going to write examples but I found this more helpful. I would rather she would just fuck off so atleast then i wouldnt have to deal with the guilt of not calling on her with my son. But there is no way i want him to feel the emotional headfucks as me and my sister have endured over the years... Who dont talk as we have spent the last twenty years being divided and ruled. shes a bitch.

My mother in law was right, that did help

I hate the fact that I cannot just separate from her

As a matter of fact, you can. Would you like to?

I cannot do it without the loads of guilt thats all. I work in mental health and know how people with personality issues can offload their insecurities onto other people. Its different however because she is my mother.

Can I just say I hate Mothers' Day? Even though my Mother is on the other side of the world and we don't celebrate it over there until May, and I haven't talked to her for over 2 years, I still feel sad and guilty and angry that I don't have a Mother to love.
Blah.

man why would it give you loads of guilt?
Why is it different because she is your mother?

Fifehourssleep ...how's about we rename that day survivors day ,and celebrate us instead ?

...for the stately homes visitors.

fivehours I have a friend whose mother sadly died young. On mother's day, she celebrates the many mothers she knows and loves. Is that an idea that would usefully give meaning to the day for you?

damn Just talked to my father.... Things seem a little better.
Thankyou for the hand of help, but shouting about how much i fucking hate that warped bitch helped enough! :)

Just wanted to moan about the fact it is mothers day tomorrow and the evil bitch that is my mother has crept into my mind again!! I've been a mother for 4 years and this year is my first as a mother of 2. My aim is to just enjoy the day without thinking about her at all. I guess it is all family occasions but for some reason mothers day just hits the hardest. 'Nobody loves you like your mother does' well mine didn't love me at all, so that's me fucked.
My children however, do love me and I adore them. She won't destroy that for me no matter how hard she tries.

NHAN, I'm with you on this one. I have a few poor friends who have lost their lovely mothers and find MD hard because they miss them terribly, but find I can't be honest about how I feel because having no mother around to spoil is considered 'my choice'.
Ho hum.

I haven't posted on these threads for ages....

I went to see her last Sunday and I've felt awful ever since. She started on my children and I did lose the plot a bit, I don't want them affected by her bizarre viewpoint but as usual it turned into smoke pile of self pity oh well I suppose we got everything wrong with you - this time I said, well the way you view. Y choices I guess you did.

I thought I had got over this feeling and moved on and for a couple of years with limited contact I've managed to be ok but it's all come back.

The icing on the cake was the rant about how by not teaching my children about god I've failed them. Yeah mum cos your god really made my life good.

Sorry to turn up and rant but I've been nursing this for a week and even typing helps. Thank you all x

I have never visited this thread before...but beginning to think this is where I belong. I assumed that toxic parents kinda knew what they were doing to their offspring was horrible and they enjoyed the mind games, but am realising my own DM is the catalyst in the unravelling of my family.
To be fair to my DM she had a very abusive childhood and it left her not being able to function as a loving mother. She cannot show love at all unless to one of her many pets. I think though things were held together by my late DF, since his death things have gone, in the family completely downhill.
My DM plays me and my brother off against each other and I can't cope anymore. I am the one visiting, taking her out helping her with paperwork but all I hear when I go round is how fantastic my brother is. No thanks to me all him and the paltry times he visits. My brother and I had a big falling out earlier this year and this seems to have egged my mum in talking about him more.
I have told her that I do not want anything more to do with him because he was violent to my DH and she knows this but it seems she can't help herself.
I've just visited her and heard about the lovely trip he took her on yesterday and he is taking her out for a meal now and I lost it...like a petulant child. I told her that this isn't a competition, she still carried on talking about her day and what vegetables she had with her meal while I was discreetly dabbing tears from my eyes.
I have been blaming my brother up to now for all this family crap but am now wondering if she is the cause of it. The thing is I'm not bothered my the fact I am estranged from my brother it's just my mum keeps going on about him it's like a knife to the heart. At the moment I don't want to go round there again and deal with her but know if I don't she will be alone and I will feel guilty.

Guilt and hurt two things I never want my dds to feel because of me.

My brother is my Mother's number one. There are four of us. I don't give a shit anymore. I ignore him, I ignore her. She's a nasty, viscious cow and if he's that dumb, let him get on with it. I'd like to say he'll soon find out, but he won't, he's got some fairly serious mental health problems of his own, so he can't unpick the threads of what she sews.

She's fucked now though, the rest of us have got together to compare notes, after 40 years of her playing divide and rule. Enlightening.

I can't understand why a mother will do that to her kids intentionally, i mean, I'm not perfect but you think you will try your hardest to love and treat your kids the same.

Sorry, no time to read others' posts (kids getting ready for bed), but I wanted to get out that I feel sick to my stomach. My parents came to visit for the kids' birthday and my mum asked (told me) she wanted to talk, following from my honest talk with dad last month. It started good. I felt in control. Picked the place, made sure there was no alcohol. Asked her what she thought my issues were. She named them surprisingly well. We talked about them a little. I cut her off when she went on tangents of 'woe me' and stuff about herself I am really not interested in hearing. Then she dropped a bomb of information about my brother (when he was little) that shocked me to the core. Even more because I knew that I used to know about this, as she was telling what happened to him. I showed my shock, but didn't really feel it until last night. This morning I told her that I don't want to be part of her revelations/confessions anymore. I have heard enough of them and don't know what to do with them. She got angry, and confirmed that I did used to know this stuff. I hate her. Now what do I do....