Should I let my children see my paedophile FIL?

[FiremanSamsFireEngine]

I hope you can help me with this awful situation. Over 3 years ago, when I was pregnant with our first child, my husband and I discovered that my FIL had been arrested for downloading thousands of the most serious levels of child pornography, systematically for over a year. He plead guilty and was convicted. My DH was shocked and devastated as you can imagine, and I didn't ever want to see him again, and certainly not let our children (we have now had 2 kids) ever have any contact. At the time my husband said that our children would never have to have any contact with him.

Our children have never met my FIL, and my husband has limited contact with his family. 3 years on and my husband now wants our children to attend gatherings of his extended family where his father will be present. He no longer wants his father airbrushed out of our lives.

I am freaking out. I don't see what good it will do to introduce our children this man. It goes against every single one of my instincts to protect them - physically and emotionally. As they get older (they are 3 and 2) they will start to ask more and more questions. I don't know how I will be able to answer why they don't see their grandfather often, why he doesn't touch them (over my dead body) when they see him. What if they go to embrace him? etc etc... It's just going to get more and more complicated and horrible.

A paedophile is someone with a sexual interest in children, not just someone who assaults children. He has demonstrated a seriously dishonest nature (he managed to keep his obsession a secret, even from his wife, for over a year). I do not want our children to have contact with someone like this. It will just get more and more emotionally complicated for everyone.

Me and my husband have been at loggerheads over this for some time. I have finally agreed that we'll attend a family gathering next week and the kids will be introduced to the FIL, but with strict ground rules. Just an introduction: "this is Daddy's daddy", no physical contact, and that this is not the start of some sort of reconcillation. I feel sick about it, and am very worried I am doing the wrong thing in an attempt to make my husband happy (he has acknowledged he is only doing this for himself, not for the kids).

What would you do? Could you imagine yourself ever agreeing to this?

I won't be able to check this forum until tomorrow night, but hope I can get some sense from other people (due to the shameful nature of this I have been unable to talk to friends about it) and will be able to reply then. Thanks in advance

What are you going to do if your children act affectionately towards him simply because they know that he's their grandfather?

I honestly think your husband should understand if you do not want your children to meet your FIL & to be honest if I were you I would'nt want to go either!!!....Could'nt stand to be in the same breathing space as someone like him!!! What your dh decides to do as it is his family is his choice but I would be very cross if he did'nt support you on you & dc's staying away!!

Hell no.

No way. I can't believe a few of the posters on here think that it would be a good idea.
I mean seriously, are we giving him the chance to have two kids handed to him on a plate? some people are cool with that? fuck me society stands no chance.
I presume SS would get involved if they knew and would have to assess the risk? and how would your 'D'H forgive himself if anything happened to the DC's? has he given any thought to that at all or is it all about his feelings because now he thinks you should all be a big happy family.

Sorry, have not read whole thread. You poor woman, what an awful situation for you to find yourself in. May I just wade in with my two pennorth as I have been in a similar situation.

My father is not exactly a kiddy-fiddler but over the years was very inappropriate with us kids at times. He was an abusive alcoholic and has now been through rehab and does not drink (though is still a total arsehole). My siblings allow their kids to visit him freely and stay at his house regularly. My mum (who is, unbelievably, still married to the bastard) has begged me to let his have 'access' to my little boy, but I have refused. I will, however, take my son to large family gatherings, and watch him like a hawk at all times so that he doesn't get up on his grandfather's knee or anything like that. I would never allow him to be alone with his grandfather.

I know my son will ask me questions about his grandfather when he is older (he's nearly two) and ask why we don't see him or speak to him or stay at his house like his cousins do. I will try to answer them as honestly as I can without upsetting him or volunteering too much information, and then he can make up his own mind about whether or not he wants any contact.

In your situation, OP, I would go to the gathering, but keep an eye on the kids and don't feel that you have to introduce them to this man as their grandfather. He sacrificed his right to a loving relationship with children the day he downloaded images of child abuse. Don't feel that you owe him anything, and don't apologise for your decisions. Do what you believe to be best for your children and stick by that.

Good luck and lots of love to you xx

Thank you so so much all of you for replying and offering advice, especially those of you with your own painful situations / memories that you have shared. I am most definitely not a troll, and this is a very real situation.

There was so much to read, and I'm not going to be able to reply to every point raised. Just to clarify though that my DH has kept up contact with his family and has seen his father since all this. I have never prevented my weird MIL from coming down and seeing the kids (which she obviously gets so much enjoyment from) and taking huge numbers of photos which I know will go straight back to my FIL.

My DH's and in-laws attitude is that my FIL has completed the Sex Offenders Programme (the intensive counselling) and also undertook another course on top. He was on the Sex Offenders Register for 3 years, but is now off it (you do get removed after a while, if that is what thhe court ordered at sentencing. You aren't on it forever unless you are a serial paedophile as I understand it). DH's brother and wife have allowed their son (born after our kids) to have a normal grandfather / gc relationship with my FIL.

They think that he is now 'rehabilitated' (altho I think they never really ever engaged with how horrific it all is) and should be given a chance. They have never understood my attitude and think that I am the one causing all the pain. As he is only surrounded by his family putting pressure on him to accept his dad back into the fold, it is perhaps unsurprising that my DH is wanting to toe the family line. I think I am going to have to show him this thread, painful tho that will be, so he can see how ordinary women feel about this, and that I am not being unreasonable.

I agree completely that it is going to be very confusing for my dc's when they learn later that FIL is a convicted paedophile, and that mummy and daddy let them go near them. I can imagine how I would have felt. I would have been horrified that my parents put their feelings and family convention above my safety and wellbeing.

I'll be able to check messages again tonight hopefully. Thanks once again all of you.

"They have never understood my attitude and think that I am the one causing all the pain."

That is such rubbish I don't even know what to say. I think that for them it's easier to blame you for not going along with what they want rather than think about the fact that he is a paedophile and the terrible things that may result from that. Making out you are the one responsible for the upset is a defense mechanism by them. They can collectively pin it on you and be a little unit tutting at your attitude... rather than think about the hard questions.

A worried parent being blamed for rocking the boat rather than there being focus on the man who looks at images of children being abused and raped is absolutely disgusting.

^^Sorry that was poorly written, but I'm fuming on your behalf.

NO, NO, NO. I'd stick to your guns. No contact with this guy, ever. I'd tell your H to go get knotted. He's free to see this scumbag whever he likes, just not take my kids. These scumbags are never rehabilitated and shouldn't be given a second chance or any chance. I wish people who do this would be locked up for life with no access to computer again.

Jesus christ.

So are you seriously going to let him have contact? I really hope not.

I have to say that in my experience as a former criminal barrister there is no way fil would have not gone to prison for thousands of images of child rape bestiality and sadomasochism. Because that dear OP is what levels 4 and 5 are.

He would have been subject to register for at least five years if he did not go to prison. If he did go to prison, as would normally be the case for such offences, he would be subject for 7 years, 10 years or life depending on lengthof sentence. There is no minimum 3. It is not the case that life is for serial pedophiles.

You must have been misinformed. Keep away.

OP, I cannot see how, in any circumstance, your FIL can have any sort of contact with your DC's. Even contemplating it is, for me, unthinkable.

I can tell you that you're not alone, though, in trying to come to an arrangement after a family member has been convicted of such a heinous crime. DH's best mans' FIL was convicted, in 2003, of importing and downloading child pornography - he was sentenced to 18mth (served 9mth) and was put on the sex offenders register for 10yrs. DH's best man and his wife now have children and they allow him contact with the DC's - so much so that the FIL babysits for them (with his wife, the DC's grandma) and they've even taken the children on holiday or had them for weeks at a time whilst the parents go on holiday. DH's relationship with his best man, who has been his closest friend for over 20yrs, is now strained and they've all but grown apart. We cannot understand their choices and feel they're putting their DC's at risk for the sake of their social life (his FIL and MIL babysit for them every weekend so they can go out and will also have them for days at a time so they can go on holiday without the kids).

I cannot even begin to understand why they have put their DC's at such risk, it makes me really sad. I don't even know whether the DC's are on any CP register as.the FIL was convicted before his GC were born/conceived. As others have said, your duty is to protect your children and your DH has to understand that.

No - imagine if, god forbid, anything happened to your DC and they found out that you knowingly put them in his reach.

Absolutely what Pag said but please keep your DC away from this sick animal who frankly should be put down.

Bunny How could they?

it depends what you mean by rehabilitiated emin - there is a programme in place - Circles of Support and Accountability which has an extremely high success rate with preventing reoffending - which at the end of the day is about protecting children from harm. It was started in Canada, was a success there, then piloted in this country by Quakers (with Home office backing) and has proven so successful it has been rolled out in other places (the whole programme now run independently of Quakers but supported by them).

If we do not have the resources to lock every sex offender up, and if locking them up doesn't change their behaviour, then we need to find other ways of tackling the problem to protect children.

OP I really hope you manage to find a way through this, my main worry is that you say the family is pretty disfunctional anyway - and it sounds like they are trying to forget it rather than deal with it. If it was being talked about and dealt with in an open and upfront way then it might have been possible to join in family events - where everyone is looking out for the children in a very explicit way (explicit in that the children grow up knowing they are being cared for and that gp is not to be trusted). It sounds like you really need to put your foot down here and say they cannot meet gp - and you need to find age appropriate ways of talking about this to them as they grow up.

Even if nothing happens to them- when they're older they will find out what he was convicted of. Someone will tell them or they will discover it by themselves. They won't thank you for letting him near them, and it will probably make them lose respect for their parents or even damage your relationship.

Have only read the title of the thread:
answer:
NO.

I will go back to read the dabate...

Whilst I sympathise with your predicament, I'm fairly sure that in a public situation and introduction, your DH's father will be able to refrain from sudden innapropriate behaviour. Given the nature of his crime, and the fact that he has been let back into the system with therapy, you must at least give him the benefit of the doubt in that he is rehabilitated.

Having said that, if you are uncomfortable in any way with it, then do not attend the gathering. Your DH is welcome to attend whatever he choses but at the moment, you are obviously unsure and therefore allowed to stick to your guns if you don't want your children to be there.

Absolutely HELL NO. This is one very good reason for cutting contact with blood relatives.

Also you know abuse in families gets hushed up a lot? To "tow the family line". To keep it all together. This is so common. A big risk here.

Would I consider letting my kids near a pervert of the most extreme nature, "to tow teh family line" and all become one happy family again.

Hell no, that kind of "family attitude, all together" bollocks is the kind of thing that makes families breeding grounds for abuse.

Your dh is a father now, he should be wanting to protect his children first, the fact he is even considering putting his kids at risk would make me question him as a person and what his thought process was.

It's also worth noting this kind of "illness" runs in families, hence why a lot of families try to normalise it and sweep it under the carpet. Your husbands reaction would concern me deeply.

The only way to know if he has been rehabilitated is if he is never caught with any images ever again, even then he has to be CAUGHT first.

I would never trust a convicted paedophile around my children, even if he is deemed safe by the authorities, his family or even God.

'you must at least give him the benefit of the doubt in that he is rehabilitated.'

She doesn't have to give him shit. Nothing at all. She owes him nothing.

IMO, every single paedo should be hanged that way there's no doubt they'll ever harm children again, but of course, that won't happen.

But this OP doesn't have to give him the benefit of FA.

Be firm, NO means NO.

Hi op I'm so sorry your diddy of a hubby is putting you and your children into this situation, you'll never be able to leave your children in his care? And your hubby's attitude is very selfish as to me sounds like he's willing to forgive n forget? Or in denial for sure! Why would any man want to put his children in a room with a pedophile? wether it's family or not is mental..

If it was me I'd seek professional advice and help were visits ‘if you do go ahead with it' is monitored, if it was me I'd be making my hubby choose between his farther or his family, there is nothing stopping him still seeing him put he should not be pushing you to do something you are not comfortable with, especially with the nature of your post good luck and stand up to him

I am shocked at your DH even considering letting his dcs have contact with him - does he any have paternal instinct at all?!

My father is a convicted paedophile, he was found guilty of abusing 2 children and did not serve time in prison. He will not come anywhere near my child, or my sibling's dcs and it is not something any rational parent would consider.

Also from another point of experience. I was told when I was older that my maternal grandfather had inappropriately touched my mum, but she allowed him contact with us including unsupervised contact, I am still shocked to think about this and cannot imagine for a second why she thought this was a decision that was worth the risk.

You allow MIL contact, and your husband still has contact with his dad - on these points you have been more than reasonable (particularly the taking pictures part IMO, given what he was arrested for). Your husband needs to wake up and grasp the reality of the situation.

It's not you that has caused any pain or trouble it's him.

As for benefit of the doubt, no you owe him fuck all. It's the kids you owe something to and that is keeping him away.

bubblechristmaspop - I agree with your post completely

Your husband's stance would make me question him completely. I wouldn't want to leave my dcs with him (despite the distance to the IL's), and I would be questioning his motives deeply.

You said in your OP in 2008 that his family is extremely dysfunctional, add in the convicted paedophile and I'd be running as far as I could in the opposite direction.