We have everything but the fun - smothered by life with kids

[Naetha]

So the last few weeks has been a total rollercoaster - we've just emigrated with our two DCs, age nearly 2 and nearly 4 to Australia after six weeks of my husband working over here by himself. The whole thing has been massively stressful, which is kinda what we expected, but it has also exposed cracks within our relationship.

DH has made some good friends, one of whom is female. He is her "best" friend over here, and after some major arguments, major fucking up on both our parts and other messing about, I'm absolutely sure that he isn't going to run off with her. He has no "designs" on her, has been very open from the start, never being secretive or hiding anything. The only time we've really had a problem was last week when he didn't come home when he said he would, but that's because he panicked and thought I was really angry with him when actually I was just desperate to see him. We worked that all out in the end, although it took a lot of talking, and is still a bit of a raw nerve for me.

Anyway, she rung him last night (with good reason, she had said she'd ring to find an answer to a question) and he picked up the phone, eyes alight, bellowing with laughter, animated and just in a way that I haven't seen for years. That's when I realised what was missing from our marriage, and it broke my heart to see him like that with someone else when we don't have it any more. I talked to him about it after the phone call, and after talking for about 4 hours we were able to talk it through - he admits he has something with her that he doesn't have with me any more. He can't help it - it's just something he feels one way and not the other, but it breaks my heart. It's the emotional equivalent of him getting an erection every time he sees her when he can't get one with me.

We love eachother - after a LOT of talking, we are sure about that. We have a good sex life - it's been poor in the past, but it's about 4 times a week at the moment. We share values, interests, taste in music etc.

What we're missing is that spark - our life has become routine - we talk about the negative in our days so we score "points" against the other in the hope of having an easier ride of it in the evenings with the bedtime routine. We never have fun together. If we do, the kids spoil it - whether it's shopping, eating out etc, so we just end up doing things for the kids, which is OK to some extent, but we don't get anything out of it for ourselves.

However, we're in a foreign country, 12,000 miles from friends and family that could babysit/give us a break. Where on earth do we start to get that sense of fun / spark back? I'm finding it absolutely smothering looking after two very demanding pre-schoolers who are as stressed out by the move as we are, and when DH comes home from a long hard day at work it's very difficult for either of us to be anything other than grumpy and exhausted, and by the time the kids are in bed by 8pm, we're both exhausted.

I know it will get better with time, but I need something to work on now or I won't be able to get through the next few weeks.

Wow, Naetha, lots of people worried about the 'OW' and not many listening to you. FWIW, if your gut instinct is that your relationship is fundamentally sound, then I would go with that.

My marriage has recently struggled and although we are in a different situation to you with moving stress etc, we have also had outside stressors that are not really under our control. We are also many miles away from family & friends, so have had to both focus really hard on spending quality time together without any childcare. It's been hard.

The one thing that has worked best for us was to buy a pack of cards and a couple of cheap-ish two person board games, and have a night or two a week where we are 'off-duty' once the the kids go to bed and have a wine and games evening! I struggle as it feels like the jobs list is never-ending, but at the same time it got to the stage where actually the jobs list was never-ending, so not doing a few of them didn't seem to make much difference!

I suspect that the house hunting etc will be one of those things that will (for example) take three weeks if you don't take a break and 25 days if you do. The extra time might be made up for by the extra sanity?

Embracing life with the children as being fun is hugely important for you, I think. Why do you think they are acting up when you go out? If you can try to make your life easier, and more fun with them, whilst also exploring your new city, would that help?

So take a picnic to the park rather than dinner at home that you then have to clear up, get your dh to meet you there after work? Go to some family restaurants, or have takeout on the waterfront, or arrange bikes with a bike seat for the little one so you can go exploring. Get out and about with the children, so they are finding the new life fun and exciting too. Take them to a different park each day then get them to decide which is their favourite, join the library, have barbeques. Can you all go camping at the weekends with your dh too? Sit down in the evening with maps and guidebooks and some wine and nibbles and plan some fun trips where you'd like to explore, even if it's not this year or next you can enjoy the research. Keep your date night too!

You have to make your life more fun, so that you have positive, upbeat topics of conversation, so that you feel positive and upbeat, so think about what you'd like. Is it theatre, sport, yoga, meeting friends for wine? Make time to help those things happen, chat to mums in the park, look for classes where you might meet people. Could you think about getting a job, or volunteering somewhere?

All these things will add to your relationship, try to get in your life the 'spark' that your dh has in his life right now. Hope I've given you some ideas and not just depressed you - I'm going to try to take my own advice too now!

Right, if I were you I think the priority is to try to find babysitters / nannies. I think you should do two things.

Firstly, find someone who can babysit so that you and your dh can go out together in the evening and just spend a relaxing time together uncluttered by domesticity and distractions. Frankly, I don't think it matters what you do - going to the pub, cinema, restaurant, playing tennis. Anything that is stress free and you both stand a good chance of enjoying.

Secondly, I think you should find someone who can come and look after the kids for 2 or 3 hours during the week so that you have an opportunity to have some time to yourself. You sound frazzled, not surprisingly, having moved half way across the world. It might be helpful to give yourself the chance to recharge but also to rediscover what you find fun. Looking after kids can be great, but frankly, it's all about them, not you. It's easy to get lost in it all and forget what you like doing for yourself. If you and your dh are going to have fun together, it might be helpful to allow yourself a bit of time and space to recharge and identify what it is that you love doing in your new life.

Good luck!

I'm going to ignore the OW part and agree with the poster above that you have to get your DH to prioritise you. You say that babysitters are expensive but cheaper than a divorce!!

Also, you mention that you are househunting - so tricky I guess to find teenager neighbours to help but your DH may have colleagues with teenage children who could babysit and entertain your children (with the help of haribo and DVD's if necessary) so you can sort your house out during the day or at weekends (ref comment about date night being tricky due to house being a tip) or look after the children at the weekend so you can whizz round some house viewings sorting admin stuff out without the children in tow. He may also have colleagues who would be willing to help, have offered because them understand what it's like to land in a new place with no support. Take people up on their offers.

Find some money to get this move off on the right foot and spend it on having a little fun rather than lawyers fees later!! You say that the children were tired etc when you tried days out, they probably are tired and need to hang round the house a bit and start to feel at home. Do nice things together that you all enjoy and keep your family unit close and allow it to bond and find it's feet in this new environment.

Good luck!!

Agree with others that your DH's relationship with this OW is a big threat: "Not Just Friends" etc. You seem to feel like you have to be cheery, happy, sexy, perfect, more fun, pursue outside interests and friendships, settle in immediately, regain the "spark" with him etc. in order to maintain your relationship. What's HE doing in all this?

Given that you have tiny kids and have just emigrated it's bound to be a difficult time and it's unrealistic to think that you can have it all with respect to (i) family (ii) life as a couple and (iii) life as individuals. Too much pressure.

Sounds like he's behaving quite badly tbh and that he's swanning around up on his pedestal (with this OW) while requiring you to improve and try to win him back in various ways.

To admit that he would've got together with this woman were he single is a massive red flag.

If the woman were a true friend, she would try to befriend both of you.

Why is your DH helping someone else move house (ANYONE else, let alone the OW) when you have literally just arrived?

He needs to prioritise you and the family.

Have none of you ever had that 'coming alive' feeling when you've made a new friend of the same sex?

Well no not really to be honest, partly because it takes a long time to cultivate a close friend. There are many positive feelings around it but 'coming alive' isn't one of them... for me anyway. I only have that feeling when I meet someone I fancy tbh.

Yes it's possible for men and women to be friends but there's a balance there and the op's dh does not have that balance right now. There's lots of other stress going on in the op's life but I definitely see this particular 'friendship' as an issue, even if it's only down to how much of the guy's attention is focussed on the ow when that attention should really be focussed on his wife and children, given all the stress.
Can't believe how much slack people are cutting him on this thread tbh.

The thing is, you have to make fun and laughter a priority. I know you have so much on your plate right now, but it sounds like you are giving up a bit too easy -- such as giving up on date nites at home because the first one didn't pan out. Or babysitters, yes they sound extortionate but you can try to have a really cheap night out to make up for it. I mean, your DH could afford to go out drinking every other night, if he's not doing that anymore then surely you can afford to go out once a week?

Try to look for opportunities to have fun and not all the obstacles standing in the way.

The other woman is a symptom, not the problem.

by 'you' I mean both of you btw

Sounds like it's the DH who's the main problem.

If you have had these long talks with him (running into hours) why is he helping her move ? When she asked why didn't he say no when he knows how much you BOTH have to do with the move etc ? Doesn't sound like those talks have worked if he feels it is easier to upset you and not her .

Again it is not the OW, it is him not giving her the right signals and appropriate boundaries. Yes she is probably moving in on him but it is down to him to tell to back off. Does he struggle with boundaries in other ways ?

OP I was on the other thread too. You really want to sort out the 'no way of playing music' bit pronto!! In our house that would be a massive deal. I agree with decapitatedlegoman re having fun WITH the kids as much as possible. You are all going through some massive adjustments and I say you need give yourselves a break metaphorically.

Make larking about with the kids your goal for now. In time you will be settling in, finding friends and babysitters.

I'm going to come back, having read a bit more, and say that whatever the OW's role in all this is (whether she's even actually an OW, a potential OW or genuinely a friend) and say that absolutely he should not be helping her move house. That is atoo much IMO.

Your relationship has hit the buffers and weekdays are spent juggling children and work between you. He needs to make your family a priority in his free time, not some new friend. However innocent their relationship, I'd be asking my DH to reconsider his plans so that you, as a family and as a couple, can spend all the time you can together as you settle into your new life.

Absolutely not should the DH be helping her move house. Please put your foot down OP - it looks to me like he fancies her and there's a big flirtatious thing going on. NO WAY would I put up with this!!

I think what always amazes me about these threads is the absolute blindness to the reality. People post as though human beings are completely immune to flattery and feeling good about themselves - and as though affairs never happen as a result of a new friendship that's crossed the line.

I agree with whoever said that you and your H are both in denial, OP. I also have a feeling that the third party who's meant to be helping with the house move will mysteriously have some urgent business to attend to on the day.

Have you reversed this at all? You've said you're feeling frazzled and as though fun is in in short supply. What would you do if you met a single man who if circumstances were different, you would date? Who made you laugh like you hadn't laughed in ages and made you feel alive? Would you recognise the danger signs and back off? If your husband spoke about his discomfort with the friendship and there had been one occasion when your new male friend had treated him with disrespect, what would you do?

Would you take phone calls from this man at night and leave your husband with the kids and help the male friend move, perhaps pretending that someone else was going to be there as well?

If you would recognise the danger signs and you'd act accordingly, why do you think your husband isn't doing that then?

I think it would be ok if he hadn't said he would have got with her if he was single as this means he sees her as partner material not just mates

Exactly what Charbon said. And to add insult to injury, he's still getting laid 4 times a week at home.... sheesh talk about having your cake and eating it

Sunshine and books- The OP cannot possibly go round preventing her DH from having female friends because of a perceived threat to her marriage. That way madness lies. It's not up to the OP to police her DH's behaviour and friendships. It's up to him.

I completely agree.

BTW, I agree it's not on for him to be helping her to move (which wasn't mentioned in this thread by the OP and I haven't read any others). Not because of any perceived threat about their friendship, but because if the OP is that overwhelmed by things at the moment her DH should be helping her, not a friend. If he can find time to help someone move, he can find time to ease some of the burden on his wife.

OP is he still planning to help her move?

"The OP cannot possibly go round preventing her DH from having female friends because of a perceived threat to her marriage."

Of course she can - this so called female friend is trouble with a capital T!!

Even IF she is trouble then it's for the DH to sort out.

But she is not the root of the problem. Remember that DH said he felt 'dead inside' when they were in the UK, it sounds like that's a big reason why they emigrated to begin with.

If the OP makes her DH stop seeing friends and going out and there is nothing done to change the dynamics within their marriage, how long before he feels dead inside again?

They BOTH need to make some changes and have some fun, then the woman won't even be an issue.

This is what the OP is asking advice for, I don't think it's helpful to go on about the friend. She's not in denial, they've talked about it for hours and she thinks it's okay. Shall we trust her on that?

dreaming - I disagree.

I think she is perfectly in her rights to intervene - and a swift first approach might be to warn this woman away and get her out of the picture.

THEN maybe - DH can work on himself.

On what basis can she 'intervene'? I mean, what have they done? Talked on the phone, had work drinks together? Whatever inappropriate feelings her DH may have had, that's for him and OP to sort out, and it sounds like she has.

Let's not forget the woman is a work colleague, it would be entirely inappropriate for the OP to 'warn her away' and possibly create workplace drama.

I don't think spouses should dictate their partner's friends. I think the most you can do is express any problems you have with them, then your partner can show their true character in how they respond. That's what the OP has done.

I am biased however. I have never had a partner cheat on me, however I have lost many (emphatically platonic) male friends over the years because their wives and girlfriends didn't want them to have any female friends.

If the OW is a real true friend to DH, she could be asked to do some babysitting so the OP and DH can have a night out together.....