The Brave Babes Battle Bus - We're All Going On A Sober Holiday!

[Mouseface]

Hello, I'm Mouse

Welcome to the Brave Babe's Bus. This is a bus full of drinkers old and new, sober and not, and those who are somewhere in between.

We are all at different levels of sober so you can bet that one of us has walked in your shoes.

If you want advice and support then you're in the right place.

Come take a seat or just lurk, we're happy to have you along for the ride.

And here is a link to the last thread so you can catch up on the journey so far HERE

Well I drank sensibly and moderately at the restaurant then came home and had a lot of cider.
WTF am I going to do? DP refuses to accept despite evidence to the contary that I am an alcoholic. He refuses also to support me attending AA and thinks I just need to pull myself together, stop binge drinking and grow up.
Am very sad today.

So here we go...Day one.

Hello - have just read the last few pages of the last thread and all of this one to catch up. What a mixture of emotions I have. I really don't handle conflict well, so I am very glad I was away during the little bit of irritation that was going on. Very glad to see isindie posting, and how lovely that you and JWN met up. It's such a funny thing to meet someone that you know from here - I can't get used to people's real names, and still think of them as their names from here . Sad to see that so many people were struggling over the weekend. I know that I used to be glued to this thread on friday night, desperate for someone else to post and to keep me company and to help me stay sober.

luci what is making you so sad today? is it just because you drank the cider when you got home? one of my main reasons for not drinking at all is that my ability to drink moderately was very short lived. Like you, I'd manage to drink moderately for a brief period, but for me, once I'd got a taste for a drink (and my inhibitions were slightly lowered) I'd find it really tough not to just move up to the next step. What happened is maybe not unexpected. the real question is what are you going to do now? Are you going to say that you're hopeless and give in to wanting / having another drink sometime, or can you chalk yesterday up to experience, remind yourself that stopping at a couple of drinks is difficult, and take the positive step of affirming that you will not drink today?

"DP refuses to accept despite evidence to the contary that I am an alcoholic. He refuses also to support me attending AA and thinks I just need to pull myself together, stop binge drinking and grow up."

That is hard. Does he drink heavily himself? He may worry - rightly or wrongly - that you getting sober is going to put the spotlight on him.

You need to reassure him that it is not - that his drinking is not your business unless it has a direct impact on you.

Then you need to think hard. If you became a wreck of a woman, to the point of passing out, getting arrested, sleeping around, being institutionalised, wetting the bed - would he stick by you or would he leave? I'm not saying those things are going to happen - only that they happen more easily, and to more respectable women (and men) than you might otherwise credit. If he is not going to put up with that sort of thing, then you can't wait for him to "accept the evidence" because, when he does, the same evidence might have him packing his bags. If you think AA can help then you needn'yt wait for his support. Just tell him you are going out at 7.30 and you will be back by 10 (or whatever). If he asks where you're going, tell him whatever you think is best, the truth or a lie.

ironically, he is quite possibly right - maybe you DO "need to pull [your]self together, stop binge drinking and grow up." But the question he is refusing to address is, can you do that alone, or do you need help? If it's the latter - as it was for me - then go and get that help. When he sees that your sobriety is no threat to him, he may well come round. If he doesn't, then he probably wouldn't have come round to your worsening drinking either -he wants you to stay exactly as you are now, and it is the nature of problem drinking that it never stays the same, it always gets worse - so you will be no worse off by attending AA (or whatever help you seek) than by not attending.

You owe it to yourself - and, though he doesn't yet realise it, to him too - to be selfish on this one.

good luck, happy to help if I can.

Luci - MIFLAW's post is pretty much what I was going to say to you.

This has to stop. You are doing this to yourself over and over again.

If DH isn't on board then go get help yourself sweets. Only YOU can do it. You can't keep going on like this can you? You can't want to keep drinking like this can you?

Please, get some real long term help x

luci just wanted to echo mouse and MIFLAW, and to say I do know a bit what it's like. DH took ages to accept I was an alcoholic and even longer to stop insisting the best thing was for me to have 'a little drink' to reward myself for not drinking.

It is horrible. But this is your life. As long as you worry about what he thinks, you've got a ready-made excuse for why it's hard to stop.

Thank you everyone for your wise words. It was in fact DP who handed me the first cider (along with a beer for himself) practically as soon as we got in the house yesterday. Whilst he stopped at a couple of drinks I continued. In fairness he did try to stop me and got angry with me and said perhaps I'm right. I should just stop drinking altogether. Previously he has said I just need to moderate myself. Time and time again I try to do this and fail.

This morning he was back to saying "just have one or two. Don't go mad every time."
He can be a binge drinker too but more often than not he'll stop at 2 or 3. Thing is he starts at lunchtime on a weekend. I join in and try to moderate myself and...well that's where it all goes wrong.
It is my life and I do need help.

Luci I'm sorry to read that you are having a hard time at the moment and that your DP is not being as supportive as he could be. One thing I have learnt over the years is that it is very difficult for me to stop at just 1 or 2 drinks, especially when i am at home. I am slowly beginning to realise that I can't drink sensibly and that if I do choose to start the evening with a glass of wine then I am going to finish it with an empty bottle.

Last wednesday I drank a bottle of 11% wine and felt absolutely crap all day on the thursday. I agree with Venus about 1 glass giving me a taste for alcohol. Basically once I start I can't stop and so I'm trying very hard not to start.

I hope you are able to get through to your DP how YOU feel about your drinking because as long as he is continuing to encourage you, I think it will be very hard for you to stop.

Good luck :)

luci - you poor love!! tbh, the more you tell us, the more i think your dh has a 'bit of a problem' with the drink! - miflaw is right i think, i think that dh is brushing over your problems so that he dosent have to focus on his own!

as hard as it is, i think you need to try and deal with with on your own, you deserve so much more in life than you are getting right now, as do your dcs!

im really rooting for you, i have seen over the months how hard you have been trying, i have read the miserable, desperate posts and also the bright cheerful ones when you have been more on top of it - i know which luci i would like to get to know more of!

how about you make today the first day of a better life?, just an hour at a time?

have a big ole' ((((((((((hug))))))))))

luci it doesn't really matter what your DH thinks does it? It's about what you think is best for you. It would be great to have his support but he's not in your head or body so is really not in a position to comment on whether or not you can just 'have a couple and not go mad'.

Can you get him to agree not to offer you any drink and that if you want it you'll ask.

For what it's worth, I also think he doesn't want to lose his 'drinking buddy'.

Lucilastic, when my eating was up the creek, one of the first things I was asked to do was to keep a diary. When, where, how much, what it felt like....etc. I am doing the same now with alcohol, to see what patterns emerge. It also helps to have things in black and white. I don't know if it might help under your circumstances.
MIF, what led you to alcohol? I have heard that some people start drinking and find it the 'key to life'. For some people, they fall into it very quickly and easily. Others have to practice hard for alcohol to take over.

Well he came in tonight, cracked open a beer and asked if I regretted drinking all the cider as now I have nothing to drink. He really doesn't get it. I am relieved there is no cider left. He asked me why I couldn't drink moderately. I told him I don't know but think it's because I have a drink problem. He just doesn't believe me.
His suggestions are to swap to low % beers and mix with lemonade and to listen to him and stop drinking when he's decided I've had enough.
He also said he'd have no problem with me getting drunk if, in his words I just acted like a bit of a silly arse."

It's the fact I often become argumentative and spiteful when I'm drunk that he has a problem with. I have a problem with alcohol and everything to do with it. I don't want to be the drunken arse anymore at family parties etc and I don't want to let myself and my kids down.

Yes silent, a diary would be a good idea. Thank you.

Hi everyone, it's been a while since I slinked off the bus and I'm back, if that's ok.
Today is day 1 for me, again.
Great to see familiar names, still posting great advice. Good to see new people with new insights.

Welcome back thornrose. I was thinking of you the other day. How's things?

Hey my lovely Babes.

I am so sorry to all of you that are 'new', or not so 'new', to just jump in - I have not posted for a long time but have always kept up with the thread.

A long time ago Mouse, you said that I would only stop when I was ready to stop.

and you were right.

took me a while to get here

and even now I may well still vanish

but, tried AA, tried naltrexone, I've not actually tried a bit of simple SELF CONTROL.

so that's it really

I love you all to bits Venus, Isindie, JWN, Ma, Thurso, MIF - all of you.

Needed to put it down in writing so that tomorrow I cannot ignore how I feel right now.

sweet dreams babes.

I hope Gerald will be on the road very soon xxxx

HI everyone. A bottle tonight - struggling with things going on big time at the mo. Nothing major but its getting me down.

Hi Thornrose how are you

How are things tonight Luci

Hi SIlver hope your OK

Morning all,

I don't know if it's my laptop, or Mumsnet generally, but I've had a terrible job finding this thread, and then posting over the last couple of days. When I write on "Add your message here" and then post, it freezes, and then does nothing .

Anyway, hello all , Silver How lovely to see you, please don't vanish, tell us how you are and what's gone, going on (only if you want to, obviously )

Sorry, lots of people were struggling over the weekend. Me too, had a fairly horrid weekend with Dh, but walked my sadness off on Sunday morning with a 5 mile walk, and a big roast dinner! Spending the whole day like that together made Dh happy and all is right with our world, but I still feel a bit .

I have been very busy. I've actually started making a simple cookbook for when DC2 goes to Uni, and have been making the dinner with him every night, so that he gets some idea of how to do things!!!!

Luci I've seen what you said about Dh, and I don't have any experience of a Dh who drinks much (2 beers, 0r 3 a week for mine), but it does sound like your Dh doesn't want to lose his drinking buddy. Do it for yourself, only you know the truth, whatever that may be, for you.

Speak later Babes and Miflaw
xxxxxx

Hello everyone - Mouse I had a very needy sigh of relief that you noticed me . Lovely to see lots of familar names and some new ones (if that isn't too odd a thing to say).

Lucil my DH was the same - and still advocates me stopping at one glass of wine. Its really hard for him to see why that is so hard for me - its such an alien concept to him. So I had to discount his views on the basis that although he was trying to support me, he didn't really get what I need. Over time he has seen that I am much happier just not drinking at all.

Anyhoos I am on Day 3. Yesterday a close friend told me that she was pregnant and I wanted to jump into a nice big vat of wine and chug, chug, chug. However, I had hot chocolate and toast instead. Hurrah. Mouse thank you for the lovely words - the past few months have been fecking tough. At some point I will post a cathartic message offloading on you all but the short version is to say the loss of the baby wasn't straightforward and left me incredibly traumatised. I still can't quite get my head round what happened.

DD doing better, I am much calmer this time at dealing with poo-gate and so she seems to be coping better too. She is lovely at the moment, although was up at 5am and her interpretation of 'sleeping quietly in our bed' was to strangle cuddle me very closely with her face pressed to mine. Sweet, but not conducive to sleep.

Hope you all have a good day xxx

Luci

If you had a medical problem - a big one, like cancer - would you go to a doctor; a fellow cancer sufferer; or ask your husband to treat you at home?

My guess is it would be a), b) or some combination of a) and b). If you have a drink problem, you have a problem which is potentially every bit as serious. Why in the name of Christ would you let your husband plan your treatment for you?

"Well he came in tonight, cracked open a beer and asked if I regretted drinking all the cider as now I have nothing to drink." This is how you educate children not to spend all their pocket money on Friday. you are not a child and this is drink, not pocket money. His advice is piss poor, frankly. As you say, "he doesn't get it."

The good news is that, unlike cancer, the normal treatment for problem drinking is effective and simple and it is always going to be basically the same, whoever you ask in category a) or b). Some people will suggest you cut down or control your drinking first. Well, apparently you've tried that and it hasn't worked. So the next advice, which is universal, is:

stop drinking

find a way to be happy about the fact that you have stopped drinking, so that you are not tempted to doubt your decision

That's what I did with AA; that's what other people do with therapy; that's the sole purpose of antabuse, to allow you to achieve part 1 so you can get on with part 2; that's why some people start going to evangelical church; it all boils down to those two ideas. Whatever your husband's motives, his practical advice - for you - is shit. For the vast majority of problem drinkers, low alcohol beer becomes high alcohol beer in a matter of weeks. By alll means try it, if YOU (not him) believe it will work - but remember that, if it does, you will be the exception rather than the rule.

sorry to lay it on the line like this but it really is the easiest and most enjoyable way. Problem drinking is like a fast-moving lorry with no brakes. Your best bet is to jump off as early as you can and then stay off. Your second best bet, if you really must stay on, is to get in the cab, turn the radio up really loud, and pray - you'll probably die quite quickly, but at least you'll be warm, you'll only get hurt once and you can kid yourself you chose it. By far the worst advice is what your husband is suggesting, which is to put one hand on the rear axle and then try to keep up.

"MIF, what led you to alcohol?"

The same as everyone else. People drink. I thought that drinking heavily and being able to hold your drink was part of being a man. Like nearly everyone I knew, I drank heavily throughout my time at university, though I would say it had little impact on my success there.

The real question is what KEPT me at the drink and I have to say, the answer is probably "me". Drinking was neither fun nor not fun. It was what you did. It was part of the decor, as much an essential of a party as the music and the crisps in a bowl. And then it spread out. It became part of the decor of a Saturday night, whether or not there was a party. Then of every night after a hard day at work. Then of every night. Then of every afternoon, whether I had had a hard day at work or not. Then of every afternoon whether or not I had even been at work. Then of some mornings ...

When we left uni, I would say that the majority of my friends were, on occasion, heavy drinkers. But then responsibility came our way; jobs, careers, mortgages, talk about kids. For most, this meant they drank less. For me, it meant I drank more - it was my way of dealing with the stress of responsibility and, in many cases, also removed the responsibility (no one was rushing to have kids with me while I was drinking, for example; while my career as a top-flight academic somehow became a job stacking shelves in a provincial Safeway.) I also had to be less choosy about the company I kept while drinking - most of my old friends no longer wanted to drink as often, as long or as hard as I did so, rather than drinking with bright graduates and young professionals, I drank with old men, violent ex-squaddies and dole scroungers. Or, increasingly, alone.

At the end, drink had taken everything from me, and was my best friend; when the realisation that I would need to stop began to dawn on me, I panicked - if this was life WITH a drink, then what the fuck would life WITHOUT a drink be like?

I am now, thankfully, in a position to answer that question, and the answer is, "fantastic." I would not change the worst of my days sober for the best of my days drinking. Everything I now have in my life I owe to the fact that I am sober. I heartily recommend it, however you get there.

Morning Babes

Silver - I was thinking of texting you today to see how things were! As if by magic you appear! I'm soooooooooooooo pleased that you have hit this wall. This rock at the bottom so to speak. You know what? You have given it a bloody good go with AA and the meds, but you're right, you've known that for a while I guess, but only YOU can stop drinking when you absolutely do not want to touch another drop.

I've missed you and your trips around the globe. Huge mwahs to you and thank you for the cheese, my favourite xx

MsGee - sweetheart. Please take your time. The pain will stay with you for a long time but it will get less, it will fade, I promise. When we lost the triplets, I had to have them surgically removed. So, I went to theatre 'pregnant' and came out not.

But your body takes a long time to adjust back to pre-pregnancy state which for me was the hardest part. I was HUGE! I'd put on 3 stone very quickly and I looked pregnant for a good couple of months after losing them. People would ask how far I was. Friends that I saw on occasion would ask how the boys were and I had to tell them that they had died.

So, my lovely lady, lean on me, lean on friends, family and the Babes when you have that wobble. EVERYONE around you will be pregnant, or that's how it will seem. But you won't see that forever.

Keep going, keep posting and give DD a huge snuggle from me xx

thornrose - HELLO!!!!! Fab to hear from you too. I love it when Babes re-appear. Even if it means that they've fallen from the top deck of the Bus and out onto the pavement.

MIL is having an MRI scan this morning, they're still not sure what is wrong, definately a heart condition but are not sure what course of action to take. She's been in the cardiac unit for 6 days so I'm hoping that we should have some answers today.

Mouse I hope that MIL's scan is good news (or rather the least of bad news) and that you get some explanations as to what is wrong.

Thank you again for being so lovely. Once we got the bad news I threw all my maternity clothes out (and I was pretty big even at 12 weeks!) and then realised I had no clothes to wear, so ended up in hospital in DH t shirt and track suit bottoms... lucky I work from home and don't get out much ... you're so right, looking pregnant when you are not is pretty shitty. I am now in the process of getting rid of all baby related things - I had kept everything from when DD was little so we could use it again but its all being freecycled now. Ugh. Anyway, highlight of today is food delivery, so I now have lots of non alcoholic, low fat things to munch on.

Bless your heart sweets. Much love to you. Start a fresh. A day at a time. You know where I am xx

Afternoon, just wanted to say to Thurso .. what a fabulous idea to compile cookbook for your son and to take it a step further and practice the recipes with him .