If I list the things dh does that make seriously make me want to leave him, can you help work out if there is a future?

[ijudge]

DH:

Lies every time he thinks I won't like what he has done. It can be really small petty lies or really big ones. I literally have to catch him in the lie before he will tell the truth. His stock response to anything is' it wasn't me' or 'I didn't do it. Its like dealing with a little boy.

He never takes responsibility for his actions, he can never say sorry I shouldn't have done that. First he denies and lies, then he blames someone else (normally me) then he tries to distract the conversation away from the topic so we end up talking about something else and forget the original problem.

He doesn't seem to care about anybody else's possessions. He looks after his things, but mine and our two dd's things are constantly being lost because he can't remember what he has done with the. I spend ages searching for things. He can never put things back where they belong, he out dd's toothpaste on top of the shower unit the other day and I spent ages in the morning looking for it (he's at work so not here for the morning rush!) In the end I had to phone him (have to phone him nearly every other day to work out wheres he out something) he said he put it there because dd was messing around with, but why not put it back later? or putt it somewhere I could find it. Its so exhausting looking for things all the time. Yesterday he put the broom back in the spare room where we never go instead of in the clockroom, he said he never and dd1 did but she's 3 so I know that's not true. But like I said he lies about everything.

He can't control dd1, she is a typical 3yr old and is pushing the boundaries. If she doesn't do what he wants it ends up in them arguing and then her having a massive meltdown. No matter how much she is screaming I'm not allowed to get involved even if I can calm the situation in 2 mins. I have tried to tell him how to deal with her, told him what I do. But he seems incapable of being the adult and always ends going to her level and arguing with her - it's like listening to a pair of kids, not a father daughter. It breaks my hear to listen to her getting so upset, I know he loves her to bits but he has no idea how to be a parent IMHO. Last night it happened again, he did bedtime with dd1 while I bf'd dd2. It resulted in dd1 coming into the bedroom and telling me daddy had slapped her on the face with the flannel. I quesitoned him he said he didn't and asked dd1 why she had said that. But I don't know if I believe him.

I told him later that I couldn't live like this anymore, am I over reacting? I am sleep deprived with a 3 month old baby so could be hormonal.

OK, now do the other bit. What things make you not want to leave him? Presumably he has good points.

I think sleep deprivation is a killer of relationships. Don't make any hasty decisions.
Do you love him? Did you ever find his behaviour endearing? has it go worse over time or stayed the same?

Good points:

Atm I'm struggling to think of any.

But if I go back and tell you what I would have said a year ago:

He loves his family and we are everything to him. He puts us first.

He is a soft kind, loyal man.

He is loyal - so the lying has never been about infidelity???
He loves his family - so his lying is not about taking risks eg overdrinking, debt etc??
You wanted a baby with this man one year ago...what has changed since then? (not judging by the way, just trying to work out why you feel so confused)

I don't know if I love him, all I can see atm are the bits that I dislike and my life hard.

Sometimes I think he is getting worse but then when I think back I think he may have always been this way I just never saw it. We have been together 12 years and when I think back to the start I can see things which point towards his behavior now - I think I was more tolerant back then.

Hmm. He doesn't sound evil, but he does sound very chillike. The denying and lying is exactly what a child does to a parent when they are in fear of being told off all the time, and his behaviour with your dd is also, as you say, like that of child to child.

Perhaps he learnt the hard way to take care of his own stuff (or be told off), but uses up all of his concentration on that so none is left over for the other stuff?

He needs help in breaking away from those child-behaviours and moving on and up.

does he have any idea that you feel at breaking point??
tbh the toothpaste etc seems very inconsequential to an outsider, but if it's the straw that breaks the camels back i can see why you're worn out by it all
do you get help wih the baby, the housework etc?

No he has never cheated and I used to think he was one of the few men that never would - but since the lying has got so bad I don't know now. I think if he can lie about that he can lie about anything.

We have debt problems, some of which he hid from me but since I found out the whole truth we are now in DMP and hopefully working our way out of it slowly.

He doesn't overdrink or gamble

with a 3yo and a 3mo - don't make any hasty decisions, you are exhausted, that impacts your perceptions.

How is everything else feeling?

I am happily married and adore my dh, but can honestly say that in the first year of our dd's life I could have split with him about 3 times...and he hadn't done any of the things your dh has done. Tiredness, resentment of time out of the house and disagreements over child discipline can really make you feel like you'd be better off alone. But if your dh loves yuo and his family as much as you say he does then I'm sure he would be devastated to think you would be leaving him. You really need to let his know how you are feeling right now.

It is exactly the straw that breaks the camels back but he doesn't understand that, he says I over react. He can't see how fed up I am of it all.

If I could just stop him being like a little boy then life would be so much easier. But I've tried everything. What else can I do> Its like default behavior with him, he doesn't even know he is doing it. It's the lying more than anything which I absolutely hate, how he can stand there, look me in and the face and tell me an outright lie and swear he is telling the truth. How can he do that if he loves me?

get the health visitor involved, and get her to send him to parenting classes. it can be done tactfully, and hopefully, will enable him to deal in a better way with the three year old.
the stuff and thelieing i have no suggestions for, as dh does the same with my stuff and kids stuff, but doesnt lie. sorry no help

How he can lie to you, is fear. He is fearful of you 'telling him off', fearful of you not liking him because of something he's done 'wrong'. It's why children lie - to avoid being told off and , esp. if self esteem is an issue, to avoid being disliked.
speaking as someone who has been known to lie for both these reasons while also an adult.

Doesn't mean he doesn't love you.

He needs parenting classes b ut would never go to them.

Pride and embarrassment would stop him

I really think you need to talk to him, about the lying, but you need to do it in a very 'caring' way (or he'll think you are 'telling him off'...) you need to tell him why it matters and reassurae you will still love him even if he outs the broom in the wrong place...

Parenting classes good plan. Also maybe some sort of relationhsip counselling?

I agree with those saying not to make any hasty decisions.

I expect he is very tired as well, which, IME leads to scattiness of the type you're describing. When I'm tired I often put the cucumber in the knife drawer or forget to turn the heating off.

The stuff about the parenting of your 3 yo is interesting, and there is a tone in your post of you feeling he is incapable of looking after her, and there is also a strong sense of your relationship with him being one of parent to child.

Can someone stop lying if it is their first instinct? I don't think he could stop

I think he can stop lying about silly stuff, if you can also try relax about the same 'silly' stuff. Because, honestly, toothpaste and brooms in the wrong room are not serious enough to warrant seriously challenging someone over are they? (I am terrible at leaving stuff in the wrong place...always have been...so I may be biased :D )

I really hope that it is just sleep deprivation.

Sometimes I think its gaslighting. The other day there was 2 bottles of beer in the fridge left over from friends round Saturday night. Sunday evening after a stressful bathtime and bedtime I said to him did he want to finish off the beer with me. He said there weren't any, I checked and there weren't. He then tried to make me think I had been imagining things and actually said 'are you sure they were there'? I went in the bin and found the empty bottles and he then admitted drinking them when I had taken dd1 to the park earlier. Does that sound that gaslighting, when I said to him it wasn't fair trying to make me think I was going mad when he knew he was lying, he laughed.

That would have pissed me off - i would have asked him to go to the shop and replace them. His lies are his default defence...you need to tell him that he is slowly poisoning your relationship with his lies, every time he lies you love him less.

Why is he so afraid of taking responsibility and owning up? What was his family life like? Did he always get punished for doing things wrong? or did he always get let off if he lied?

My XDP was a little bit like this - could never say sorry, always keen to find who was at fault and apportion blame if somethign went wrong, was gutted if something went wrong that was his fault even if it was trivial. All from his toxic parents who sulked, blamed, and who were more interested in punishing than in encouraging truth telling. My blood still boils thinking about them. Sadly I wasn't strong enough or clear minded enough to change him hence XDP.

doesn't sound like gaslighting to me.
sounds like he drank the beer then felt guilty when you wanted one later.
I really don't think there is the 'intent' that there is with gaslighting.

I have said that to him dropdead - I said everytime he lies I lose a little bit of respect for him and how can I be married to a man that I don't respect?

And yet the lies continue.

He mum treats him like the sun shines out his back side and wants to keep him a baby. He is the golden boy who can't put a foot wrong, everything is always somebody else's fault in her eyes, never his.