out of the frying pan..?

[crimsonpetal]

I posted on here a while ago about my DP not respecting my boundaries and, basically, making me cry. Everyone on here was great and told me that it wasn't right, and eventually I did get it together enough to split up with him (although I didn't tell him why, as that would have caused arguments - 'But I'm not like that' etc.)

However I'm now about a month into a new relationship and I'm worried it's the same thing. During sex, he really likes to put his hands round my neck and/or hold me really tight, almost crushing me or choking me. It's happened a few times. I tell him 'too tight' or 'let go' and he relaxes for a bit, but then it happens again as he's about to, you know, come.

Up until now I've been excusing it as the fact that a man can't remember a single thing right before he comes, and it must just be an instinctive thing. But is it a bit weird? Maybe I'm just oversensitive because of last time, but I would like some objective advice if that's possible...

He wasn't really severely abusive though - I know I just sound like a victim, but those were maybe 3 incidents in two and a half years. And with all of them it was dubious as to whether he intended it or not. I think he 'gave' me much more than he 'took' by being unthinking/selfish on a couple of occasions.

This counsellor I've got is a man. I've never had a male counsellor before. Do you think this will be good/bad/indifferent?

TDaDa, no I didn't.

crimson, the sex of the counsellor should be of no consequence to you

seriously love, you worry the hell out of me...

Crimson - this isn't normal; the insensitivity of the men towards you. WHen experimenting, your partner should be looking for signals that you are comfortable and should respond accordingly. Best wishes

as it's confined to sex (at the moment, I suppose) and it's just a bit of discomfort that is soon over.

You really, really, really need help. It's just so wrong on many levels I can't tell you and worrying tbh.

it will be very uncomfortable when you black out due to asphyxiation

a month in to a relationship?

and he is strangling you despite you telling him it is too much ?

I have to leave this thread now before I type something that will scare you away forever [hsad]

I'm going to share 2 links.

for the second time today.

One to a friend who has sadly realised that Mr Too Good To Be True is indeed that.

I really feel for her, but at the same time am so proud that she recognised the Red Flag behaviour and reacted immediately.

The Red Flag thread is here

Also, someone put this link up too early in the thread. It's credited to AF/SF, but if not her, whoever did find it originally, it's worth repeating. How to Spot Losers

Honey, dear Crimson, Please take a break, for you. Do you have a good gaggle of girls to back you up, bouncing odd behaviour off them etc?

Whatever it takes for you to rid yourself of these dreadful, dreadful men, and find your way to normality, to love, to affection and gentle, touching support.

Come on SF, you have done all you can, really.

We can only hope she listens, reads and does the kindest thing in the world for herself, the one thing that will save her life.

TO LEAVE THESE MEN FOR DUST

Crimson:
"This counsellor I've got is a man. I've never had a male counsellor before. Do you think this will be good/bad/indifferent?"

Perhaps when he tells you in low, slow, one syllable words that no decent man would ever, in a million, billion years, EVER DO what they do to you.

Stop this now Crimson. It will be the death of you otherwise.

LittleMiss, neither of them have very many of the red flag or loser points. With ex, the main one I can see was the 'Discounted Feelings/Opinions' one, where he refused to believe he'd hurt me. And that wasn't all the time. He also had little sense of personal responsibility with relationships but not with anything else. Even with the Physical point, he never ever did anything like hit, slap, shove, breaking stuff.

New one doesn't have any except what I've mentioned here, except apparently he does shout at work (is the boss, so can get away with it).

I do have girl friends, but don't think I can really talk to them about this.

What scary thing do you want to tell me, AF?

x post

Love this isn't BINGO....

A red flag is a red flag. It's RED for a reason.

As I see it they both AT LEAST have Discounted Feelings.... and new one shouts at work... so uses aggression to dominate those he sees subordinate to himself.

How a man behaves at work is a HUGE indicator.

If you feel you have to hide issues that worry you in your relationship from all of your friends, ALL OF THEM... isn't that telling you something?

Have these men isolated you from them in some way?

No they haven't isolated me. It's just with the age gap, they haven't got much in common with my friends. So they are separate from my social life.

Also I mentioned the ex's biting to my friends, and they didn't seem to think it was a big deal. I have difficulty telling people, even friends, about problems because when I was little no one would believe my problems, which is why I hid my depression and anxiety from my parents, because I didn't think they would believe it was 'real'

So they have no active part in your social life? In some way if you are with these blokes, it's not encouraging your social circle away from them.

You lead 2 equally separate lives 50:50 or grab a moment with a mate your own age every so often, and have simple, kind of superficial or more shallow friendships with others?

Oh great, these men saw you coming didn't they?

Honey I am not being harsh on you, I feel so sad for you and wish I could sit with you and talk to you about this, to hold your hand and tell you it'll be OK.

All of us on this thread who are being hard, direct and no-nonsense with you are doing so because you are in danger, you are being harmed daily, by men that will do you no good, ever.

Frustration makes us want you to see the light, to run for the hills, having told them both, in no uncertain terms to, as the MN saying goes, to Fuck off and when they get there to Fuck off some more.

Second time EVER I wrote that was today too!

You can do this, you need to find some self esteem to stand up for your own happiness.

Read the words on this thread. If you really must abdicate control over your life, don't give the power to these men, give it to us and let us help you find the way out.

That is your only realistic option.

'With ex, the main one I can see was the 'Discounted Feelings/Opinions' one, where he refused to believe he'd hurt me.'

That is the scariest thing you've said, imo.

It's the warped sense of what is right/wrong, and the ability to discount someone else's feelings and account of how things happened (someone you supposedly love, as well) that is the most disturbing and dangerous characteristic of abusive men.

I had two relationships with men who liked this type of sex when I was younger. They both turned out to be seriously disturbed, violent and dangerous men (although I had escaped from both of them before they showed their true colours. It was other women that weren't so lucky).

Be careful.

Crimson - they do not have to hammer into you!!! I'm so sorry for you you've had such a run of unloving, rough sex. I'm getting on and probably had more than my fair share of men, from one nighters to long term marriage :-) - What you're talking about is incredibly rare.

The thought that someone says...do you want me to hold you...and then bends your arm back...it's just horrible :-(

Sure most men go a bit harder and faster pre orgasm but not to the extent it hurts at all. If you are talking about pain purely around the vaginal area it's possible these men haven't really aroused you so your body cannot respond which is making it worse. If you're talking about weight on your body - wrong, wrong, wrong

The idea that men get out of control at orgasm so they don't know what they are doing? Complete and utter tosh! Where did you get that belief from?

I didn't read all the replies so not sure where you got the counsellor from. It is via the GP? What sort of counsellor are they?

And I still don't understand:

'the playfighting I could have put up with'

What normal guy playfights with his partner (at all, let alone to the extent that she feels uncomfortable with it)?

It's just wrong.

I repeat Crimson:

"All of us on this thread who are being hard, direct and no-nonsense with you are doing so because you are in danger, you are being harmed daily, by men that will do you no good, ever."

The hardest thing with ex is that I'd hoped that even after we had stopped the relationship that he could be a supportive friend, and that was what he wanted too. I speak to him far more than I speak to either of my parents. In a way I would rather block out the whole thing that happened with the playfighting, especially the biting - that was the worst. He never agreed to apologise for that. But if I fully accept what that means, it means that he was never who I thought he was and so I will 'lose' too much, because there really were a lot of positives in the relationship and I did feel properly loved.

LittleMiss, I think in a way I do want to abdicate responsibility for my life, but I don't know why.

crimson, it sounds like you have very low self esteem and a lot of issues around self-respect and boundaries.

I would definitely pursue counselling if I were you.

Honey, he wanted to 'stay a friend' not cos of you, not because he cares for you....

If he did he would NOT have hurt you in the first place. He would have stopped when you told him to. This you know.

He stayed involved cos he wanted to keep tabs on you. To potentially control you.

Because. He. Could.

Life is scary, very scary. If you have not got a close supportive set of parents, for whatever reason, it's even scarier. Giving up control to someone else, older men is what you are doing, because you think you can not run your own life, you don't think you are up to the job.

Of course you can do it, you just need to believe in yourself.

You have a low self esteem, these kind of men can see that and target women like you. To have a person at their beck and call to do whatever they want to do, to them.

THEY are the ones with real problems, it's their fault they are an abuser.

You do not have to be their victim.

Dump these awful 'men'. Talk to your counsellor and surround yourself with friends that will be there for you.

Do not date again until you know that you can recognise unhealthy behaviour and know that you are strong enough to deal with it.

We can help you. We are always here. We are telling you how to help yourself.

Fuck me, these men are awful.

Positives? I'm sure Fred West had some positives, do they undo the things he did?