Calling all prostitutes and former prostitutes on MN, as there seem to be a few around right now...

[Aitch]

I'm curious to know how it makes you feel to see threads on here from wives and girlfriends etc when they discover that their husbands etc have been visiting prostitutes? even if you are happy in your own jobs (and i hope to god you are somehow, because the alternative is intolerable), how does it feel to be confronted with the downside of your work on these pages?

(i think it goes without saying that the men are culpable in this scenario, but am looking for some insight into how your work squares with sisterhood etc).

I agree with you swc

it never even occurred to me but I have come across that issue a no of times

www.digitalspy.co.uk/forums/showthread.php?p=43113100

slog.thestranger.com/slog/archives/2009/03/16/_will_anyone_sleep_with_my_dow

jme.bmj.com/content/36/3/152.abstract

also, having kids isn't a basic human right, so should IVF treatment be stopped?

I don't agree with donor IVF, or surrogacy or egg/sperm donation - I probably have fairly extreme views on the subject as far as mumsnet goes.

I don't either, personally

'I have a totally neutral position on the matter.'

No VC, you have a completely self-serving position.

The complete lack of ability to see any wider question or think beyond me, myself and I on the part of VC and Manda and WR can only be explained by extreme defensiveness, as can the constant harping about the public service they offer to poor shy/ disabled/ forces members off to Afghanistan/ loveless and lovelorn ickle men.

um, yes I do actually have a neutral position on THIS subject matter.

I couldn't care less about being self-serving, I genuinely am interested to hear other people's views other than my own! It would be great if someone could help me off the fence I'm sitting on but so far that hasn't happened and am more confused then ever. I LOVE a vigorous discussion/debate and sometimes enjoy playing devil's advocate but it's not about being self-serving.

I've lost interest because once again someone goes off on a tangent and starts to become personal rather than sticking to the topic! It's so annoying!

if someone is a "higher class" prostitute-
i assume that the men that go to them have the money to spend.
usually then-if the men have got the money
they wear nice clothes and nice aftershave and are seen by society as a adicit[cant spell it]people-probebly got ok jobs aswell.
and most of them arent married?[or have a partner]
why not?is there something wrong with them?
or are they actually buying people[in their minds]

what about the woman who has a punter for a year and she dont see anyone else in this time-does he see other women?
and is this not buying people?

'I couldn't care less about being self-serving,' Well there you have it.

'I agree that if I found out my DP had been doing that I too would be inside for murder - I would like to hear tremendoussleazebag's reasons but still I don't think his actions are justifiable. You should not make those kind of vows to someone if you don't plan on honoring them.' If you think his actions are deplorable and you feel sorry for his wife, and he turned up on your doorstep, and he seemed to fit your criteria for safety, etc., would you accept his money in return for your services? Since Manda decided she wouldn't answer this question, maybe you could have a stab at it -- how do you know if one single word of the stories you her are the truth and how do you make the decision to go ahead with a customer, maybe suspecting there's another woman somewhere whose life would be left fallen down around her ankles if she knew?

Re. the self-esteem issues that one poster mentioned: yes I am a caring and empathic person. Manda and I are saying that about ourselves specifically because there are so many posters who have been assuming the opposite.

I don't believe either of us ever said however that we consider ourselves acting 'for the benefit of society'. This is my job, I'm doing it for the money. That doesn't exclude my sense of empathy from manifesting, however.

The more general discussion about sex is interesting, I'm sure some men consider prostitutes (including high class escorts) as 'pieces of meat' or at best don't give a hoot about anything else other than having a live vagina to come inside (as another posted put it early in this thread). However a lot of them simply want casual guaranteed sex ie the same as a man (or woman) might seek by going out on the pull on a Friday night, only with less time and trouble and with no need to consider the possibility of further contact afterwards. Some people want that, I don't think there's anything morally wrong with such a scenario occurring between mutually consenting adults, whether money changes hands or not.

So what happens if the punter claims the money back after the sex has taken place? Or takes the money back with force? Or complains that it wasn't worth the money?

And VCC in your scenario that sex can be viewed as a commodity then is rape just robbery with violence? Or something else?

math I never decide whether to see a man based on whether he is married or not. I assume most of them are. Most clients keep their wedding rings on and the ones that take them off have visible marks on their ring fingers.

I'm fully aware that their wives would be devastated if they discovered this type of infidelity especially as given the seedy associations of prostitution (disease, crime, drugs etc) most women would think worse of their H seeing a hooker than say shagging his secretary.

If I decided not to see married men then I might as well quit the business altogether because only about one in twenty of my clients is single. I simply wouldn't earn enough to live on.

Plus, anyone who wants to see me and faces an acceptance criteria of not being married would just lie about it anyway. How can someone prove they are not married?

I'm often astonished at the risks married men take in visiting me/escorts in general. Also as someone in her thirties who has never been married and who is raising a child alone, I often find myself subsumed by disbelief that they would put the security of a wife, home and family on the line for the sake of an hour or two with me. However perhaps this says something about the strength of their need (or want, if you prefer) to find sexual release, that they are that desperate they would take risks.

Having said that...there is little risk in the way that my clients tend to do things: typically he will take an hour off at lunchtime or finish work an hour early. There will be no physical evidence because he is visiting me and showering at my place which is far removed from his home. There will be no evidence on his mobile because all it takes is one call to me to arrange the appointment and he can delete the record of that call. He knows (since he is paying for my discretion as well as the sex) that I will never phone or text him or initiate contact. The only thing he has to do is get the cash and since he (and his wife) are well-off to start with she will not even notice XXX leaving their bank account (or if she does he can easily explain it). He has no emotional attachment to me so is not mooning around at home as he might be if having an affair, thus arousing suspicion. And finally I suspect most wives would not think for a minute their husbands were the type to visit prostitutes.

Anyway, my point is that given the circumstances, it could likely take something close to a miracle for these guys ever to get rumbled.

WG, Manda took great pains to tell us about the poor men who just wanted a hug, her services discount .... clearly sees herself as some sort of altruist.

How does your sense of empathy manifest itself; how deeply do you probe to find out if there's some woman back on the home front who might be devastated to learn her H was in your place of work? Or is caring and empathy something that happens in a vacuum.

There are some poor men out there who just want a hug, that's Manda's point, made in response to participants in this discussion who were generalising about all her clients being women-hating bastards. She never said she became a prostitute as an act of altruism, for heaven's sake!

And the percentage of your customers who pay hundreds of pounds for a hug is?

And what about the caring and empathy for the women who don't know where their H is, while the hugging is going on? How about a hug for them.

I have empathy for a client who has difficult personal circumstances. I am rarely told about such things as for obvious reasons I do not enquire what drove a man to my door. But those I do know, who have got difficult home lives, I empathise with.

I don't assume that all my clients have harridan wives or wives that refuse all intimate contact. That would be as daft as you assuming that all wives are amenable, approachable, communicative, loving, and participating fully in their marriages.

I didn't mean literally just want a hug (although a small pecentage do just want that). I meant they just want a hug as in, they just want to feel loved and wanted for a short while; that they don't get any physical affection of any kind elsewhere; they want to feel a sense of closeness, romance, intimacy.

You'd be surprised how much it moves a person to get a big hefty hug if they haven't had one for a while - months or years, perhaps. Men (yes even the 'rapists' that come to see me) will get vastly more emotional about hugging than about shagging.

LA - I actually don't think sex can be viewed as a commodity. Are massages from a masseuse a commodity then?

And math I would say that if I were in Manda's shoes and a prostitute doing my job for money (aren't we all) then it's not my problem and I couldn't care less!

I don't question people in my line of work I just accept their money and get on with it. She's not a therapist fgs.

'I didn't mean literally just want a hug (although a small pecentage do just want that). I meant they just want a hug as in, they just want to feel loved and wanted for a short while; that they don't get any physical affection of any kind elsewhere; they want to feel a sense of closeness, romance, intimacy.'

But this I repeat is a lie, a fake, a copy and has therefore nothing to do with empathy or care.

agreed watchingrain

why else would there be GFE? and why do some men complain that some escorts won't do FK?

'I don't think that there's something wrong with being able to purchase it. You are going on the basis that you think paying for sex is wrong.'

Vcc this is your post - what are you stating here? I repeat does this mean your definition of rape is robbery?

Yes, yes of course it means that.

OR how about... no, and where on earth did you draw that conclusion from?!

And I am stating that, on the whole, I do not believe paying someone to have sex with you is wrong. My definition of rape would not be robbery (?) but sex with a woman through physical force/duress.