Archers thread #187: Send not to know For whom the bell tolls, It tolls for Peggy. Discuss The Archers here.

[Gasp0deTheW0nderD0g]

Thank you, @PseudoBadger, for kicking off this long, long series of Archers threads.

All views on The Archers welcome here! New blood welcomed, and of course we are always delighted to welcome back former or occasional listeners/posters. We don't all agree on all points, although we do mostly try to be civil about it. Most of us are posting tongue in cheek a lot of the time, so don't worry about revealing that you'd like Harrison to hasten home, or other unusual views.

Spoilers: not on this thread, please! We don't wait for the omnibus to discuss the weeknight episodes, but we do try our best to avoid cross-contamination from https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/radio_addicts/4636789-the-archers-spoilers-thread-7-cant-wait-for-702pm-join-us-here, where spoilers are positively welcomed!

For newer listeners, lurkers or those who just have no idea what we're talking about, @DadDadDad has created this useful thread: www.mumsnet.com/Talk/radio_addicts/3557323-For-Archers-fans-a-guide-to-acronyms-on-the-long-running-discussion-threads-and-any-other-meta-thread-questions-you-may-have - BOOP point for him! (See thread for explanation.)

Thanks to John Donne for the title inspiration. The funeral of the century beckons. How much of it do we think we will hear? Kate confirmed tonight that Shula, Debbie, Noli and Sipho are all coming. If we hear one peep from any of them I'll be amazed. Bets on Hazel turning up?

Over to you!

Arthur the dementia charity man was there, silently. I wonder if we'll ever hear anything more about that.

I thought that was a good episode. I was actually quite moved by the funeral and the crack in Tony's voice when he said Jennifer's name. My own dearest dad died only a few years ago so of course it brought that back.

I thought Phoebe's news was lovely, I wonder if she will come back to Ambridge, it would be good to have a young couple with a baby again, were the last ones Tom and Natasha?

Thought it was interesting that these days, for an educated woman, she is young to be having a baby, I wonder if it was unplanned.

I was rather worried that Joy might somehow pop up during the funeral, it was so nice not to have to hear her (un)dulcet tones.

Presumably James, Leonie and Mungo were there too? I’d far rather they moved to Ambridge than have Phoebe back. Now that Kate and Roy aren’t fighting over possession of her soul she doesn’t bring much interest - whereas Mungo would bring Lynda into play as a step-grandma in conflict or cahoots with Lilian. (I’m sure James at least has a digital nomad, work from the beach job. Mungo could go to the Cathedral School!)

I think James was one of the pall-bearers

👍

I wish MNHQ hadn’t zapped the 😀 react.

I'm thinking Grandmother could be Kate's best role - look how excited she was for a while when she thought she was having a baby with Jakob - she can spoil and dote on it all she likes and I think her reaction to the news was perfect

I have a daughter, Phoebe (yes, DH did point out I’d considered a lot of “Archers” names for the unborn child). She shares a birthday with a “Brodie” from infant school days, a good decade ago (the only one I’ve ever encountered as a human, not a dog).

I think Phoebe moving back would only make the absence of Roy more ridiculous.

Why the blazes was Hazel there? Who told her it was happening, and why did they?

Peggy was never her stepmother as far as Hazel was concerned, and only saw her for a total of about six weeks during Peggy's entire marriage to Hazel's stepfather. Most of which Peggy spent cordially disliking Hazel.

I think it would have been surprising if Hazel hadn't either attended or sent some sort of message. She wasn't on cordial terms with Peggy and her family, but there was a tie and she does still own property in Ambridge. She inherited a huge chunk of Jack's money. Maybe Arthur (I have my doubts about Arthur) latched onto her and will be trying to get his mitts on some of her money.

Peggy was very much involved in Hazels life for decades before she married Jack W. She was his secretary/PA and often defended him from or strengthened his resolve with Hazel.
But then Hazel herself was basically dumped on Stepdad Jack by her mother.

Look I’m pleased about Phoebe’s news but I still don’t feel she has a personality, I don’t feel like I know her at all. She’s just a good girl, isn’t she? Like a Saffy without the eccentricities. Tell me something else about her because I feel she’s just slipped past me.

She never had much of a personality, and her being Oxford material was just something that happened for plot - she’d never seemed particularly intelligent, or indeed particularly anything. There was a brief bout of extreme nastiness, aided and abetted by Lily, when it became clear that both of them saw the pickers and Lexi as lesser, disposable beings.

I’m surprised Kate was so enraptured at the thought of grandmotherhood: surely in her own mind she’s far too much of a wild child and free spirit for that…

Wasn't Re-wilding Ambridge her idea?

I can imagine if your mother is a perpetual wild child, always getting into scrapes or taking off to greener fields, leaving you abandoned and mortified, you might be inclined to quietly build a bit of solidity and boringness into your life. She’s jolly lucky she had Roy and Hayley through her childhood.

(I’m trying to remember what sort of relationship Hayley had with Peggy - but it’s a complete blank in my mind.)

But it’s true we mostly didn’t have the pleasure of seeing her grow up as an even moderately clever / bookish / curious child. Her insistence on going to spend a year with Kate in SA was fairly gripping at the time - a real test of her familial relationships. And it did seem to play a part, intellectually, in her eventual Oxford aspirations. But the fact that only Jenny, of all her family, seemed capable of engaging with her scholastic success made the whole thing seem cursory and incomplete.

Yes you’re right of course and now I realise that hearing Phoebe without Jenny doesn’t really make sense, she was her mother in the more nurturing sense of the word, much like with Ruairi. Without Jenny and Roy I’m slightly surprised they haven’t just faded Phoebe out, but I suppose it’s encouraging that they haven’t. Hang on Ruairi is her… uncle?

Well at least Phoebe is leading a reasonably normal life - employed, in a relationship, having a baby

her age group in ambridge don’t seem able to do that

Yes, I think so. Half-uncle, if that's a word.

Kate's parents - Brian and Jennifer
Ruairi is Brian's son but not Jennifer's
Kate is Phoebe's mother and Ruairi's half-sister

In the real world, not one constrained by script and budget limitations, I'd have expected Peggy's funeral to be a huge event with dozens of people who used to live in Ambridge turning up, plus distant cousins from her childhood in the East End, former colleagues at Grey Gables and extended family. I wouldn't have been at all surprised if Mike Tucker had come from Brum and Roy might have taken the opportunity to make a flying visit back from Romania, once they knew that Phoebe was going to be there.

I don't think anyone else commented on the glorious line 'People must have access to tea at all times!' which Lilian mentioned the other day, although I'm quite certain that Lilian wasn't involved in that jumble sale, but I'll forgive Keri Davies for shoehorning it in anyway, as it was quintessence of Peggy. One of my all-time favourite lines, up there with Shula musing over which flowers could be put in the church in Lent. 'I'm in two minds about forsythia' she said, earnestly.

I think Jakob will make a great step grandfather. That could be a lovely relationship and I hope we hear it develop over the years to come

I hope Phoebe doesn’t move back to ambridge single because Brodie is an arse

it would be nice to have a family tbh

i assume Brodie is Scottish? The sw seem keen to bring in more accents so a Scottish accent that contrasts with jazzers would be good

Well they obviously haven’t cast Brodie yet - so you may be able to influence them!

Can I vote for someone that speaks thickest Doric? I vaguely recall that Phoebe's job isn't that var from Glasgow, but I'm sure they could cook up a reason for someone from Aberdeenshire to be there!

The Archers is at its best when it's almost veering into Alan Bennett!

i assume Brodie is Scottish?

Deerhound, Border terrier, Golden Rteriever, Smooth Collie, Skye terrier?

The last would be brilliant, they have amazing ears and people could comment on them to assist our building a picture in our minds. Though the Golden would make a more reliable role model. A Shetland sheepdog could keep the sprog rounded up and under control once it's mobile.