Archers thread #187: Send not to know For whom the bell tolls, It tolls for Peggy. Discuss The Archers here.

[Gasp0deTheW0nderD0g]

Thank you, @PseudoBadger, for kicking off this long, long series of Archers threads.

All views on The Archers welcome here! New blood welcomed, and of course we are always delighted to welcome back former or occasional listeners/posters. We don't all agree on all points, although we do mostly try to be civil about it. Most of us are posting tongue in cheek a lot of the time, so don't worry about revealing that you'd like Harrison to hasten home, or other unusual views.

Spoilers: not on this thread, please! We don't wait for the omnibus to discuss the weeknight episodes, but we do try our best to avoid cross-contamination from https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/radio_addicts/4636789-the-archers-spoilers-thread-7-cant-wait-for-702pm-join-us-here, where spoilers are positively welcomed!

For newer listeners, lurkers or those who just have no idea what we're talking about, @DadDadDad has created this useful thread: www.mumsnet.com/Talk/radio_addicts/3557323-For-Archers-fans-a-guide-to-acronyms-on-the-long-running-discussion-threads-and-any-other-meta-thread-questions-you-may-have - BOOP point for him! (See thread for explanation.)

Thanks to John Donne for the title inspiration. The funeral of the century beckons. How much of it do we think we will hear? Kate confirmed tonight that Shula, Debbie, Noli and Sipho are all coming. If we hear one peep from any of them I'll be amazed. Bets on Hazel turning up?

Over to you!

How about she was a gangsters moll and is in hiding because she testified against

marky recognises her and the now released from prison gangster comes after her and she either runs away or meets a sticky end

although it wouldn’t surprises me if one of the sw has been watching to much Highway to Heaven and she turns out to be an angel sent to ambridge to help the pure and the good 🙄

This is all so true along with your subsequent post about how in RL people would be wary of Joy in view of what happened with Rochelle. She continues to feel entirely extraneous to me as she has never properly been knitted into village life and her background continues to be a mystery. They've paired her up with Mick - another blow-in - rather than getting her involved with an existing character. You could take her out of the drama and she wouldn't be missed (Harrison's return was disappointing @JudyCoolibar because he's just so dull, but you're right at least he has a reason to be in Ambridge because he's married to Fallon.). Attempts to to turn Joy into a jack-of-all-trades with retail, catering, artist's modelling and mental health experience in a bid to insert her into village life ring rather hollow because it all happened BA (before Ambridge). It all feels as flimsy as the picture she painted of Rochelle before she tediously finally turned up and dominated the airwaves with a drama noone really believed in as a result. Last night it felt like she was being pushed into place at The Bull by a SW with one of those long sticks used for plotting military campaigns ready for the Marky story to resurface at which point she'll be revealed as a dog whisperer/former associate/Marky's ex-probation officer or something equally preposterous.

I don't mind Joy.
I don't mind Pip turning to her fun uncle for advice.

I do object to Peggy's will: not waiting for probate, complete disinterest as to where the money has gone, daft family holiday.

OR, Joy is in witness protection after all following informing on Marky/his associates?
she could indeed be removed without any major repercussions and perhaps that is the endgame
and her role as universal confidante is in a way made easier by not having any history- no one will think- 'oh, no good talking to Joy about this because she's actually godmother to my ex/taught my children at sunday school/once sold us a prize boar that turned out to have ED

That would actually make some kind of sense.

Or she is the criminal mastermind and when she disappeared when Rochelle was younger it’s because she was in prison.

and marky will recognise her

Or that. I would like some relatively logical explanation and for them (Joy, Rochelle, Marky) to leave.

“Kenton’s in bits”
”Well, I must say that’s splendid news!”

I can’t begin to tell you exactly how much ‘X is in bits’ pisses me off. Ambridge is basically a giant Lego installation, given the proportion of the population that has at one time or another been described as fragmented.

Ooh could joy turn blackmailer

Having grown up wanting to join the police and being their number one fan I must say if I was Kenton I would have no faith the police would protect me given the gang know where I live

So is Joy going to end up in Dross?

I was going to say that about Joy and Dross!

Oh, the torture of hope. I so much want Marky's pals to turn up at the back door of the Bull with dogs that rend Joy into tiny tiny pieces and eat her, and for Harrison to rush in to intervene and get torn into even tinier bits. I'd even sit through ten minutes of funeral platitudes of only it would all be over.

Maybe Monty will lick her to death 🤞

I agree I didn't mind Joy at first. I thought she was the kind of person I would avoid in real life and I didn't enjoy the mental image of her and Muck in the hot tub, but I assumed the relentless bonhomie and the references to Rochelle hid some dark secret. The only time I've actively been interested in Joy as a character was when she got snappy with Mick when he tried to hunt Rochelle down and it seemed as though Joy's mask was slipping and revealing something more complex underneath.

But no such luck. The dark secret turned out to be a damp squib: Joy was such a rubbish mother that Rochelle had to bury a dead dog and become a vegan. (I'm a bit hazy on whether it was Joy or Rochelle's fault that the dog died and I am not at all clear on whether the dead dog and the veganism are connected.) But it didn't justify all the secrecy and was a real let down. And yet somehow Joy, who doesn't in fact have any hidden depths beneath her horrible bland surface, has become this beloved saintly figure who is being inserted into every possible SL.

I am also irritated that Rochelle's story doesn't make a lot of sense. At some point she obviously settled down long enough with Benny to have two children. Why don't they live with her? When did she join the vegan terrorist cult - before or after her life with Benny? If Joy is such a reformed character why doesn't Benny ever bring the "bairns" to see her?

Every time I listen now I worry that Rochelle with her whiny voice and adolescent behaviour is going to reappear and we are going to be subjected again to the totally unrealistic love story of the militant vegan and the pig farmer.

And I am also starting to worry that Benny and the "bairns" are going to move to Ambridge to increase the quota of teenagers and become yet more characters I don't care about.

I’m slightly more worried that as Mick used to be a roadie, the reformation of Dross means that the transformation of ‘The Archers’ to ‘The Horvilles’ is edging increasingly closer.

I'm trying to think of a way to get the happy outcome without the poor dogs getting blame/indigestion. How about Harrison shoots at Monty thinking he's Marky's dogs, except Monty was play-fighting with Joy, so Harrison kills Joy and then gets hit by a ricochet. Monty unscathed, Harrison and Joy done for, oh how sad.

Can we manage something that doesn't leave Kenton further traumatised?

Jazzer is really, really annoying. He makes my skin crawl too- creepy.

The thing I like about Jazzer is he does love his pigs (and Tracey). It is reassuring to know there are people out there who genuinely enjoy pig farming. I don’t know why they do, but it’s a good thing.

he does love his pigs (and Tracey)

A distinction without a difference, except possibly for a touch of lipstick 🐽 💄

😂how very dare you? Tracey would never wear lipstick!

I like Jazzer. He is genuine and the character is consistent which is more than can be said for some.

I can’t take the Markie story seriously. Partly because his name is so ridiculous but mainly because the entire back story with Jolene recognising him as someone who started a fight at one her gigs 30+ years ago has never made the slightest bit of sense. It’s never been clear why that fact alone left her so terrified of him. I do feel sorry for Kenton though.

I haven’t bothered remembering the details of bite nights but did Jolene come out and see them so she would be able to identify Marky Mark?

did Robert find any cctv in the end?

everything seems to fizzle and die and then get reborn in a mutilated form?

why are the sw so obsessed with PTSD?

She absolutely fecking would, only the < bleep > would call it ‘lippy’.

I can’t remember if Jolene saw Marky Mark on the night of the attack. He might have come into the Bull afterwards, she recognised him and then he told her he was responsible for it all. I could be making that up.

When Robert suggested checking the CCTV she panicked and said there was no point etc but I don’t know what happened next.

For the love of god, Kenton, don't get involved!