Archers thread #168: Near to the Maddening Crowd? Discuss The Archers here.

[Gasp0deTheW0nderD0g]

Thank you, @PseudoBadger, for kicking off this long, long series of Archers threads.

All views on The Archers welcome here! New blood welcomed, and of course we are always delighted to welcome back former or occasional listeners/posters. We don't all agree on all points, although we do mostly try to be civil about it. Most of us are posting tongue in cheek a lot of the time, so don't worry about revealing that you'd like to hear more of Harrison's strange little moaning noises, or other unusual views.

Spoilers: not on this thread, please! We don't wait for the omnibus to discuss the weeknight episodes, but we do try our best to avoid cross-contamination from www.mumsnet.com/talk/radio_addicts/4636789-the-archers-spoilers-thread-7-cant-wait-for-702pm-join-us-here, where spoilers are positively welcomed!

For newer listeners, lurkers or those who just have no idea what we're talking about, @DadDadDad has created this useful thread: www.mumsnet.com/Talk/radio_addicts/3557323-For-Archers-fans-a-guide-to-acronyms-on-the-long-running-discussion-threads-and-any-other-meta-thread-questions-you-may-have - BOOP point for him! (See thread for explanation.)

Thanks to @OverArmour for the title suggestion!

Over to you.

I've missed most of this thread but I was CHEERING in the car when Susan dressed Alice down!!

Oooooh Christopher - he’s almost there …

This is exciting!

It's all getting a bit Squeaky Bum Time for George, isn't it?

From the tone of his voice I suspect he'd forgotten about the cider bottle in the car. Now he knows there's an ever greater chance of the truth coming out, especially as Chris is (slowly) putting two and two together.

They need to fingerprint the steering wheel

Paul’s dad is from St Lucia where homosexuality is still illegal. I’m surprised there’s been no reference at any point to the historical anti gay sentiment in much of the Caribbean.

A lot of my gay friends no longer travel there as they don’t feel welcome even in the major resorts.

Maybe so; but there would have been little incentive for Plod to have done so at the time. A drunk, with form, slumped in the driver’s seat of her own car?

I think George might confess to Emma and then she’ll have to be the one to confront her own attitude towards him and make a decision accordingly. Poor Emma, life is always dragging her back down.

It’s a bit of a shame that they’ve made George a more sympathetic character recently, because we can’t quite enjoy the downfall of a dastardly character.

I have a separate question for the historians here, I’ve been listening to a Sally Wainwright interview, who I love, and I was wondering whether the episodes she wrote of The Archers were generally good ones? I assume that they would have been.

I wondered if the police would have kept the bottles for evidence in case it went to court, especially as it was a quite serious accident. If so I was thinking they could fingerprint the cider bottle. Is there any reason George’s dabs would be on record? Or possibly better still saliva on the bottle not being Alice’s.

If they were now looking for another person in the car, the fact that George was just there might be questioned, especially if it was not logical (I.e. not on his route home - although if that was the case you would think one of his family might have already commented on it, even just to say it was lucky he was there).

I don’t think the car has been driven since the accident, so presumably certain evidence may be retained.

Cant help thinking Chris is just clutching at straws, even though he is right would he be so bothered if he wasnt in love with Alice.
I hope this dosnt ever come to light about George and Alice is sent down. She may not have caused the crash but she was pissed in her car and as we all know she would have to have slept a bottle of vodka off for about a day before being fit to drive. Hope she does time in The Big House.

Oh and why was Alistair and Denise in a boat on a river after Alistair nearly having a turn last time he went for a paddle? Not only sitting in a boat but messing about try to scare each other with capsizing. What a pair of ninnys.

#trying.

If Denise was a man behaving as she is, it would be very hard listening and see him as a cad or a bounder who is simply having his cake and eating it. Instead we are being encouraged to think of the pair as star-crossed lovers. I felt sorry for A suggesting the romantic Mediterranean break with D just saying how she had only just come back from a nice holiday in sunny climes. She is playing him for a fool- it sounded as if she has no intention of leaving John.

It’s a bit of a shame that they’ve made George a more sympathetic character recently, because we can’t quite enjoy the downfall of a dastardly character. I think it's actually much better that we are conflicted about both of them (see also @Alwaysdieting's comments about hoping Alice goes down for it anyway because she deserves it). George started out trying to do the right thing - if Alice hadn't regained consciousness and tried to get out of the car he would have driven her safely home and no-one would have been any the wiser. Alice is now in much worse trouble than she would have been if she'd merely been found drunk in charge and George will be in much worse trouble than if he'd immediately admitted what had happened (and now has much further to fall having been elevated to village hero). He can't even take any pleasure in having got away with it because 1) he's still in constant fear of being found out and 2) because he seems to genuinely care what happens to Alice. Whatever happens now there will be no winners.

I feel the same about Denise as I would if she were a man. She’s awful and feel sorry for Alastair. I wonder if this happens a lot and John is weary wise to it. Although perhaps not given his convo with Paul about open relationships

If they are trying to create a female Brian then it’s not working!!!

Apart from anything else the splashing about in the middle of a boating lake just felt so incongruous - where exactly were they? It was not a believable scenario - anymore than the conversation between father and son.

Hmm - Brian isn’t the only unfaithful spouse in the village; Jenny, Ruth, Roy, Rob all did the same. (I know Ruth stopped short of ‘spending the night’ with Sam.)

I do slightly fear for Denise’s health and material security; the BBC morality department is remorseless in seeking out and punishing Ambridge residents who stray from the marriage bed - so far they’ve all paid a price. Brian ‘got away with it’ in spectacular fashion for ages - but he’s since lost his home and his wife and is facing the possibility of his youngest daughter being sent to jail. Now that she and Alistair have done the deed, and we’ve been shown what a sweetie John is - who knows what retribution might fall upon his wife?

I can't have been the only listener hoping Denise would fall in the lake, become entangled in weed and drown - or can I?

I like the sound of John - in both senses, i.e. the character and the voice.

aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaghhhhhhhhhh

(Significant silence before Barwick Green)

not yet

Brian was a bit of a cad though

poor Alastair is going to have his heart broken and no doubt she will put him down and imply he read more into it than there was so John thinks poor Denise was taken advantage of

Apart from anything else the splashing about in the middle of a boating lake just felt so incongruous - where exactly were they?

@LillianGish , I think it was likely to have been Arkwright Lake. Will nobody think of the ducks?

John does sound lovely. Perhaps retribution for Denise will come in the form of her losing both him and Alistair. Or maybe John already knows.

@Louloulouenna most of Caribbean islands have now repealed laws forbidding same sex relationships (laws which were imposed by the British) bar a handful. Homophobia is a real problem. Presumably Paul is ‘straight’ acting when he visits his gran in St Lucia. My gay cousin certainly is when he visits our family in Jamaica (although the family there knows he is gay).

Just caught up. Denise and Alistair are excruciating 😩 the thought of being stuck with Denise for the foreseeable is grim.

I agree about George. They have very cleverly turned him from being the villain and deserving all he gets to now vulnerable and seemingly wanting to be a good person. He has finally realised just how seriously others can suffer at the hands of his own self serving actions. There have been hints that court case could be a long way off yet due to backlogs. I think at some point Chris and George will talk and it will all come spilling out.

I just don't get the hatred for Alice on here. Yes she's been a spoilt rich kid at times but bloody hell, she did not deserve to fall victim to alcoholism and end up in the state she's in. The addiction has made her do awful things. Adam and Lillian seem to be the only ones that really get it. I can't believe people think she deserves prison and Martha ends up without her Mum. I really hope she heals and proves everyone wrong especially Justin and Harrison!

just for you … Always ;)

Chris loves Alice, so of course wants to help her prove her actual innocence, or any mitigating factors, as he (correctly) finds it hard to believe she would have done it - or for that matter drink cider. However I think Chris too decent a person to want to, or consider, setting someone up in her place, despite his love for her.

But of course, anyone is entirely entitled to hate Alice’s character enough (for whatever personal reason) to think our own misogynist George should get away with seriously perverting the course of justice by setting Alice up for drunk driving, by dragging her into the drivers seat, after he has caused a serious accident. Whilst she suffers all the mental trauma of such mind games, loses her daughter and goes to prison, for something she has not done.

Although some for obvious reasons may consider that a tad unfair.

however I don’t think ….
“we all know she would have to have slept a bottle of vodka off for about a day before being fit to drive“

That is not true, I certainly don’t. Given objective evidence (provided to prove their point, by the last person who suggested something similar to you) actually quite clearly stated that a breathalyser can only detect alcohol up to between 12 and 24 hours later. That is detect alcohol at all, let alone at levels to fail a breathalyser.

So it is quite possible at say 8am the following morning, (well after 12 hours after she bought the alcohol from the community shop as it was closing and swigged it back before passing out), that not only could she pass a breathalyser (thus quite legally fit to drive) but no alcohol be detected at all.