❓ Archers thread #126: It’s a mystery why we’re all still listening.

[Gasp0deTheW0nderD0g]

Thank you, @PseudoBadger, for kicking off this long, long series of Archers threads.

All views on The Archers welcome here! New blood welcomed. We don't all agree on all points and most of us are posting tongue in cheek a lot of the time, so don't worry about revealing that you’d love to be on the Parish Council, or other unusual views.

Spoilers: not on this thread, please. We don't wait for the omnibus to discuss the weeknight episodes, but we do try our best to avoid cross-contamination from www.mumsnet.com/Talk/radio_addicts/4197199--The-Archers-spoilers-thread-6-Cant-wait-for-7-02pm-Join-us-here, where spoilers are positively welcomed!

For newer listeners, lurkers or those who just have no idea what we're talking about, @DadDadDad has created this useful thread: www.mumsnet.com/Talk/radio_addicts/3557323-For-Archers-fans-a-guide-to-acronyms-on-the-long-running-discussion-threads-and-any-other-meta-thread-questions-you-may-have - BOOP point for him! (See thread for explanation.)

Thanks to @LillianGish and @Taswama for thread title ideas, but I felt most in sympathy with @R4's suggestion. Is it me, or is the programme in the doldrums at the moment?

Haven't heard the 31/3 episode yet. Perhaps it's a gem.

Suddenly there is an outbreak of standing up to Kate. Good.

At last a mention of Brine and JD still renting a small house. But no further explanation of what plans they might have.

What an awful punishment for being the only woman in Ambridge with a postgraduate degree in engineering ...
Pish. I bet Ambridge is abounding with people with PG qualifications. But they are non-First-Family and so never get mentioned. I really wish the SW would write more about the commuters; it's as if 75% of the village is missing.

Would it be abounding with people with postgraduate qualifications?
Don't they all leave if they have half a brain?

Kathy Perks might have a teaching qualification, but not necessarily PGCE.

Slight air of snootiness about post-grads/university generally on here. I'd say for the vast majority of jobs in the rural economy there is absolutely no need for a post-grad qualification and you'd be a mug to get one. They're not necessarily a mark of cleverness, just a sign of being able/willing to stay in education for longer, unless required for your work. Most people I know (aside from accountants, lawyers, teachers etc) who did a Masters did it out of boredom or uncertainty about their career path.

I'm not being snooty. In my age group, not all went to university, some could have gone easily.

Some did vocational qualifications, like nursing or NHS-type careers, which may or may not require PG study.

I can't think of anyone I know who did a Masters degree who didn't do it either because they wanted to or because they wanted to improve their career prospects.

Thinking about the village I grew up in, the people with PG quals are in Education or Social Work.

I have worked with lots of people with Masters degrees. Most of them were conversion degrees.

TheThermalStair
Most people I know (aside from accountants, lawyers, teachers etc) who did a Masters did it out of boredom or uncertainty about their career path.

I did mine because I found the subject fascinating. Just as simple as that. I wasn't going to be using it for anything except the joy of doing it. I went on to do a doctorate, equally just because I was interested in the subject, but then I had a stroke which destroyed my short-term memory for a couple of years and made it impossible to continue.

It is possible not to see education as nothing but a means to better career prospects.

Haha I realise that @AskingQuestionsAllTheTime but equally the number of post-grads in a village (or anywhere) probably says something about the sorts of jobs done and the amount of disposable time and income available. Many people pursue a strong interest through reading, online debate , group activities etc and I don’t like the idea that a dearth of advanced qualifications in Ambridge (fgs) means that it’s full of people with less than “half a brain”.

Would it be abounding with people with postgraduate qualifications?
Don't they all leave if they have half a brain?
Why do they need to? Hollerton is only 10 miles from Birmingham, 30 minutes on the train. Ambridge is a few miles on from there; it's not in the middle of moors or dales. There are all sorts of interesting jobs in the area from the ubiquitous NHS and teaching to top-tier Universities and their Business parks, finance & commerce, R&D at Malvern, manufacturing at JLR, etc, etc.

I don’t like the idea that a dearth of advanced qualifications in Ambridge (fgs) means that it’s full of people with less than “half a brain”
Nevertheless, the place is seething with idiots. Must be a SW/editorial team preference.

R4, don't you remember what happened when Brenda got a job outside Borsetshire?

I'm basing Ambridge on the rural community I'm from. Career options were teaching, nursing, shirt factory, shop assistant or getting married.

I'm basing Ambridge on the rural community I'm from. Career options were teaching, nursing, shirt factory, shop assistant or getting married.
That was then.
It is strange that TA has moved on from the age of the horse-drawn plough and is forever pushing the latest MAFF bright idea onto to us but doesn't seem to have moved with the sociological times. Ambridge will have a fair number of middle-aged, educated, connected, high-earning blow-ins. They don't get mentioned enough.

@TheThermalStair

Haha I realise that *@AskingQuestionsAllTheTime* but equally the number of post-grads in a village (or anywhere) probably says something about the sorts of jobs done and the amount of disposable time and income available. Many people pursue a strong interest through reading, online debate , group activities etc and I don’t like the idea that a dearth of advanced qualifications in Ambridge (fgs) means that it’s full of people with less than “half a brain”.

There is an interesting dearth of further degrees in Ambridge. Jim probably has one (but not absolutely certain, because universities used sometimes to employ people without and once you were on that ladder you could become a professor just by promotion in the system, without further degrees beyond your BA) but I honestly can't think of anyone else who seems likely to apart from Alice.

But I don't think that lack of academic qualifications is what qualifies people in Ambridge as having "half a brain"; I think it is their behaviour which leads us to that conclusion. Jim is quite remarkably stupid at times, so I doesn't look as if academic qualification helps people escape Ambridge Dimness Syndrome. And Alice is hardly a shining example of sense or reason.

R4, I'm not that old. They tend not to get married these days though, and a lot more go to yooni.

A family like Brookfield would have encouraged Pip to go to Uni (and marry a rich local farmer), Josh to farm and Ben to do something like engineering.

But I don't think that lack of academic qualifications is what qualifies people in Ambridge as having "half a brain"; I think it is their behaviour which leads us to that conclusion.
I think that there is Something In The Water (and I don't mean Brine's chemicals). You only have to look at the likes of Robert, Justin or Oliver who arrived as fairly intelligent, savvy people but who have regressed mightily since taking up residence. Even young folk like the Fairbretheren or Kirsty (desperately trying to think of a female) have ambition sucked out of them. What's Batasha up to these days?
Nobody is allowed too much success.

Batasha has probably spent the lokdown maxing out yet another credit card, and the box room has now expanded to the size of an aircraft hangar to store her purchases. She stayed in most of the lockdown as she hadn't been able to keep up her botox and fillers.

I don’t like the idea that a dearth of advanced qualifications in Ambridge (fgs) means that it’s full of people with less than “half a brain

That'll teach me for not typing out my entire thought. I'm sorry if I wasn't clear, TheThermalStair - but really I was leaning on the long acknowledged fact that the SWs gave Alice a profession (one that is unusual amongst Ambridge women) but, since then, have gone out of their way to trash her progress. It has seemed as if she's being punished for daring to be other than the standard Ambridge wife. And it is deeply disappointing.

Nothing at all to do with academic snobbery on my part - everything to do with TASWAMA.

I think Pip went to Felpersham. However, she shows no ability to think critically. Phoebe has a degree in PPE from Oxford but shows no sign of having studied anything harder than the Borsetshire Echo. I am firmly with TheThermalStair and Weevils that Ambridge is not an advertisement for the benefits of a university education.

Johnny has done an apprenticeship but I don't think it was one of those apprenticeships that give you a foundation degree. Lily left her course in Manchester and there is no sign that she will ever go back.

Going back to last night, I am looking forward to hearing Phoebe's reaction to Kate planning to move her yurts.

Good round up @nettie434. I guess what we're all saying is the key thing, is that few/none of the "educated" people in the village - especially women - show signs of having sense let alone brains. you all know my thoughts on Phoebe leaching off her dad after graduating

If I think about who I feel are the "smartest" people in Ambridge, it'd be Fallon (entrepreneur, employer, got her head screwed on), Tracey (quick witted, doesn't take shit), Josh with his dodgy chicken empire, even Toby Fairbrother who is (come to think of it weirdly) similar. The educated Alice, Pip, Phoebe etc all seem a bit wet.

I find it odd that Alice would've handed the food entirely over to her mother, unless of course she had been doing the catering herself. Surely JD would've asked her to meet with Fallon to have an opinion then get them to thrash out the minor details. I think the SW have simply used it to both make Susan feel left out and a platform for Kate to be dreadful. I don't hate Kate (I would in real life obviously) as I do enjoy listening to her. (Pip on the other hand is a different kettle of fish).

Don't worry @MayIDestroyYou - I get it, thanks for clarifying. I may get a bit touchy about different kinds of intelligence being recognised, due to growing up around a lot of very clever rural types (artists, farmers, writers, beauty therapists, dog groomers, you name it) many of whom had never had a sniff of higher education, either through choice or circumstance.

I am looking forward to hearing Phoebe's reaction to Kate planning to move her yurts

Oh @nettie434! I am astonished anyone could ever muster even the slightest enthusiasm to hear anything Phoeble has to say! You are a kinder person than I...

I hope Kate just moves them and then Phoebe takes her to court to evict her or just sets them on fire, I bet essential oils burn well

I agree TheThermalStair. Fallon, Tracey, and Toby and Josh all have different types of 'soft' skill. That is what helps them in their work.

I agree with AskingQuestionsAllTheTime that education should be an end in itself. I also wish we were better at recognising that there are lots of reasons why intelligence and having lots of educational qualifications aren't always the same thing.

I do think MayIDestroyYou is right about TASWAMA. When Alice was thinking of going to Canada, she was seen as a high flier. Now she is only employed because her dad gave her a job. Emma is another one who I think would be studying for catering qualifications in real life. However, at least she is allowed to be a parish councillor.

Roysnewshirt Sadly, my anticipation for the Phoebe/Kate conversation is not out of kindness but because I hope sparks will fly